Moustakas linked to Sox again

[fathom]

Nah, I read it as they aren't adding anyone that will be on the 25 man. 40 man additions only. Hahn said "similar to Santiago" which I read as scrap heap pickups with upside only. Pretty sure he put the kibash on Moustakas.

 

Got a different impression from his appearance on the sports talk live podcast. Absolutely didn't rule out adding someone if it fits long-term and doesn't block a prospect

[caulfield12]

With Drury to the Yanks, their infield is suddenly very crowded...

Back to the Royals makes no sense.

 

Pirates? Cards? West Coast?

Edited February 21, 2018 by caulfield12

[Whisox05]

Got a different impression from his appearance on the sports talk live podcast. Absolutely didn't rule out adding someone if it fits long-term and doesn't block a prospect

 

Rick Hahn gives an update on the state of the White Sox rebuild in this episode of the SportsTalk Live Podcast: https://t.co/HP0QKByhH2 https://t.co/4l0JGg3Jnx

https://twitter.com/NBCSChicago/status/966140975486767106

 

The podcast for that

[greg775]

Moustakas sounds like a good addition. You'd have an infield ready for contending status in Moustakas, Anderson, Moncada and Abreu. Then you can trade Burger/Davidson if you want. Or let Davidson DH. Folks, I really don't see why the Sox didn't target a good closer this offseason. Nate coulda been setup with Soria the third reliever. We're not that far from contention in a horrible division, folks.

But nobody agrees with me. I'd say sign Mous.

[caulfield12]

Moustakas sounds like a good addition. You'd have an infield ready for contending status in Moustakas, Anderson, Moncada and Abreu. Then you can trade Burger/Davidson if you want. Or let Davidson DH. Folks, I really don't see why the Sox didn't target a good closer this offseason. Nate coulda been setup with Soria the third reliever. We're not that far from contention in a horrible division, folks.

But nobody agrees with me. I'd say sign Mous.

 

Davidson has limited value...trading Burger wouldn’t make any sense because he could eventually end up at 1b or DH.

 

We still don’t know what’s going to happen with Abreu and Avi.

 

There’s also no regular CFer, and the rotation has more question marks than answers with Rodon out. You can’t expect to win anything with Shields, Miguel Gonzalez, Giolito, Lopez and Fulmer in 2018.

 

 

[Dam8610]

Moustakas sounds like a good addition. You'd have an infield ready for contending status in Moustakas, Anderson, Moncada and Abreu. Then you can trade Burger/Davidson if you want. Or let Davidson DH. Folks, I really don't see why the Sox didn't target a good closer this offseason. Nate coulda been setup with Soria the third reliever. We're not that far from contention in a horrible division, folks.

But nobody agrees with me. I'd say sign Mous.

 

Moustakas is a stopgap that would take playing time from a young player who put up a 2 WAR season last year on a rebuilding team. It just makes zero sense to sign him unless you're doing it for 2020, and there are two much more attractive 3B options hitting the market between now and then.

[chitownsportsfan]

Moustakas is a stopgap that would take playing time from a young player who put up a 2 WAR season last year on a rebuilding team. It just makes zero sense to sign him unless you're doing it for 2020, and there are two much more attractive 3B options hitting the market between now and then.

Davidson has limited value...trading Burger wouldn’t make any sense because he could eventually end up at 1b or DH.

 

We still don’t know what’s going to happen with Abreu and Avi.

 

There’s also no regular CFer, and the rotation has more question marks than answers with Rodon out. You can’t expect to win anything with Shields, Miguel Gonzalez, Giolito, Lopez and Fulmer in 2018.

 

yea right? Sox don't need to chase this Dragon. They tried that. Didn't work too well. Just let Yolmer/Whoever player 3B this year as the window is 2019-25. As noted if he wants to sign for pennies in the dollar ok fine, but otherwise f*** no.

Edited February 21, 2018 by chitownsportsfan

[caulfield12]

The crazy thing is imagining a contract 3x the biggest the Sox have ever offered before, and well over doubling the $100 million mark. I know, Abreu, Albert Belle, Luis Robert, Dunn, Robertson, etc. Guess it’s like Doubting Thomas here, we have to actually see it first to believe it.

 

We usually give that money to our own guys, like Buehrle/Konerko/Danks/Ordonez.

 

It really feels like the best route to signing one of the biggest names is them coming off an injury (see Dye, Thome, Quentin, Eaton) and signing at a discount (which probably means they won’t want the long term deal).

Edited February 21, 2018 by caulfield12

[greg775]

Davidson has limited value...trading Burger wouldn’t make any sense because he could eventually end up at 1b or DH.

 

We still don’t know what’s going to happen with Abreu and Avi.

 

There’s also no regular CFer, and the rotation has more question marks than answers with Rodon out. You can’t expect to win anything with Shields, Miguel Gonzalez, Giolito, Lopez and Fulmer in 2018.

I kinda like Giolito, Lopez and Fulmer. Those 3 might be OK. I forgot about Hector. I guess in a perfect society Hector, Soria and Nate if they had career years might be a playoff bullpen. I think we're not that far off if we add Mous.

 

Moustakas is a stopgap that would take playing time from a young player who put up a 2 WAR season last year on a rebuilding team. It just makes zero sense to sign him unless you're doing it for 2020, and there are two much more attractive 3B options hitting the market between now and then.

We're not getting Machado. He is dying to be a Yankee I read in ESPN the Mag. Do you realize if we got Mous we'd have veterans in him, Abreu and Wellington and Avi. That's with all those young guys almost ready to contribute. If Robert and Eloy can stay healthy (knock on wood) we really have something in a copule years combining youth with experience.

 

I think people are kind of afraid if we added Mous we'd be sort of trying to win now. And we all now nobody wants us to win yet. Like I said we'd have 4 veteran everyday players and Anderson already has some experience, too. With Mous at third I'd love to see Davidson DH. My mlb.com subscription would change dramatically I think.

Edited February 21, 2018 by greg775

[fathom]

I fear the Sox are going to get too excited, think they are being smarter than everyone else and sign him.....When they should have sat back and trusted the process.

 

Kind of agree with Greg that maybe Sox are moving on from their plan to go after Manny.

[Chicago White Sox]

Kind of agree with Greg that maybe Sox are moving on from their plan to go after Manny.

I’d rather add Donaldson next offseason quite frankly.

[Jerksticks]

Kind of agree with Greg that maybe Sox are moving on from their plan to go after Manny.

I wonder what the 3B plan options are on the big board. I doubt Manny is plan A. Hard to PLAN on the top player choosing your team. He’s more like Plan GravyTrain.

[fathom]

I’d rather add Donaldson next offseason quite frankly.

 

Agreed and I think probably 99 pct of us on here would agree

[wrathofhahn]

Cardinals have Gyorko...

 

Rosters are pretty much set around the league at corner hard to see the spots where he could conceivably be an upgrade. Maybe, the Phillies. The Sox. The Royals.

 

Not going to count out Boras but the Yankee trade hurts his market no obvious need among any of the contenders

[Jose Abreu]

I'd rather overpay for Machado's prime years than pay for Donaldson's age 33-37 years

[BlackSox13]

Which Rondon, Jose or Bruce? My guess is Bruce since he was in the same division...do they have an issue or something?

Bruce hit Moustakas during the game in which KC and Detroit brawled.

[BlackSox13]

Thanks, didn't know that

Disregard the post above. I had not scrolled far enough to see your question had been answered.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

I'll be real, real upset if we sign Moose and forfeit our 2nd RD pick to do so. That would be the 45th overall pick. We took Alec Hansen with the 49th overall pick in 2016. Would you be willing to give up Hansen in order to sign Moose? I sure as hell wouldn't.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

The crazy thing is imagining a contract 3x the biggest the Sox have ever offered before, and well over doubling the $100 million mark. I know, Abreu, Albert Belle, Luis Robert, Dunn, Robertson, etc. Guess it’s like Doubting Thomas here, we have to actually see it first to believe it.

 

We usually give that money to our own guys, like Buehrle/Konerko/Danks/Ordonez.

 

It really feels like the best route to signing one of the biggest names is them coming off an injury (see Dye, Thome, Quentin, Eaton) and signing at a discount (which probably means they won’t want the long term deal).

There are a lot of sub topics that come up when talking about Moose. There's Donaldson 's age when he becomes a free agent.

 

There's the potential cost and issue of a really big name free agent . Can the Sox really afford that kind of contract? Hell in the past we talked about an Adam Dunn type contract crippling them financially.

 

There's does Moose really fit the window of contention and is he even a good enough player now and in the future even being one of the younger free agents. The saber guys don't like him and the more traditional of us see a pretty useful guy filling a glaring position of need

 

There's those who look at lineup construction, handedness, brings World Series experience , HR's , batting average , OPS and slugging vs. OBP and defense , WAR.

 

There's how to proceed in the market that MAY be throwing you some bones vs. the reality of actually getting free agents that will command great attention and dollars.

 

 

As for me I anticipate some holes will be very difficult to fill and the money put to best use is NOT to sign someone to a mega deal. Love Yolmer's defense and versatility but he'd have to shock us all with a big uptick in power for me to like him at 3B. I've argued in the past about Moose in the other threads but it's not like I think he's a great fit just think he's pluggigng a few holes positionally and in the lineup where I anticipate problems going forward.

 

If you think the competition will be fierce for Machado, Donaldson Arenado Harper etc just wait til you try to get top notch relief help where not only are you dealing with the super rich clubs but now have to deal with everyone in contention and the fast rising cost of elite relievers.

[caulfield12]

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/mlb/kansa...e201140924.html

 

This gives a lot of insight on how the Padres sold Hosmer and Boras...as it’s the exact same plan we have, with similar smaller market/revenue issues (media markets are different, obviously.)

 

It’s the exact same strategy we laid out for Luis Robert. Hosmer being bilingual was another plus, with all the Latin American prospects in their system, just like the Sox have with the Cubans/Renteria/Santiago brothers.

 

Hosmer’s decision, like most occupational choices, largely rested on the financials. The Padres guaranteed the most money and the most years. They offered an opt-out after five seasons, sweetening the deal. Yet Hosmer said he spent much of the offseason studying the Padres’ minor-league system and learning the tenets of their plan. He watched video of the prospects in their pipeline and discussed them with Padres general manager A.J. Preller and his agent, Scott Boras. Hosmer believed, in time, he could win in San Diego.

 

“The very plan that San Diego has is one that he’s lived through,” said Boras, who earlier described the organization as a “volcano of hot talent lava.”

 

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/sports/mlb/kansa...l#storylink=cpy

 

 

With Royals on the sidelines, is anyone interested in Mike Moustakas?

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/mlb/kansa...e198736894.html

Edited February 21, 2018 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

There are a lot of sub topics that come up when talking about Moose. There's Donaldson 's age when he becomes a free agent.

 

There's the potential cost and issue of a really big name free agent . Can the Sox really afford that kind of contract? Hell in the past we talked about an Adam Dunn type contract crippling them financially.

 

There's does Moose really fit the window of contention and is he even a good enough player now and in the future even being one of the younger free agents. The saber guys don't like him and the more traditional of us see a pretty useful guy filling a glaring position of need

 

There's those who look at lineup construction, handedness, brings World Series experience , HR's , batting average , OPS and slugging vs. OBP and defense , WAR.

 

There's how to proceed in the market that MAY be throwing you some bones vs. the reality of actually getting free agents that will command great attention and dollars.

 

 

As for me I anticipate some holes will be very difficult to fill and the money put to best use is NOT to sign someone to a mega deal. Love Yolmer's defense and versatility but he'd have to shock us all with a big uptick in power for me to like him at 3B. I've argued in the past about Moose in the other threads but it's not like I think he's a great fit just think he's pluggigng a few holes positionally and in the lineup where I anticipate problems going forward.

 

If you think the competition will be fierce for Machado, Donaldson Arenado Harper etc just wait til you try to get top notch relief help where not only are you dealing with the super rich clubs but now have to deal with everyone in contention and the fast rising cost of elite relievers.

 

See 2004-2006.

 

Just because we have the money doesnt mean the best allocation is predominantly investing in 2-3 players.

 

There are at least eight closers on the market next offseason, but they won’t come cheap. Finding one internally would be huge. It’s what the Sox have always done, up until Robertson.

 

I would have added Moustakas on a 4-5 year deal and Dyson for two years at $7.5 million (his Arizona deal). Then I would decide which player is the best utility fit (probably Leury, being able to play infield and outfield) and trade Yolmer, keeping Davidson in the 3b/DH/1b rotation for at least one more year (not knowing what we are yet doing with Abreu and Avi).

 

Dyson plays Gold Glove defense and teaches the rest of the team how to follow his lead on the basepaths, then gives way to Robert at the end of 2019.

 

Saladino slots into Yolmer’s role. That gives you a ton of speed in L.Garcia/Saladino off the bench, with Anderson/Moncada/Dyson and then Robert/Avi. (Financially, it’s easier to keep Yolmer.)

 

Somehow, Delmonico/Davidson/Burger/Rutherford/Micker Adolfo/Cordell/Willy Garcia can hopefully give you enough to cover two spots, with Collins at catcher.

 

The core of the offense is obviously Anderson, Moncada, Jimenez, Robert and Moustakas, covering five spots. You also end up keeping one of Abreu and Avi...leaving you plenty of money for a veteran starting pitcher and closer.

 

2019

Rodon

Free Agent

Kopech

Hansen

Giolito/Dunning

 

This allows you to throw Lopez, Fulmer, Cease and Burdi at the bullpen. Maybe you don’t need a closer and put the money into the catcher’s spot instead.

Edited February 21, 2018 by caulfield12

[Chicago White Sox]

I honest to god think some of you guys want a $65M payroll or something. I really can’t stress enough how much financial flexibility we’ll have in the coming years. Here’s a theoretical 2020 roster assuming only guys that are under control plus with Abreu extended.

 

1B: Abreu ($21M)

2B: Moncada ($0.5M)

SS: Anderson ($4M)

3B: Burger ($0.5M)

LF: Delmonico ($0.5M)

CF: Robert ($0.5M)

RF: Jimenez ($0.5M)

DH: Sheets ($0.5M)

C: Collins ($0.5M)

Sub-total: $28.5M

 

IF: Sanchez ($6M)

OF: Cordell ($0.5M)

UT: L. Garcia ($4M)

BC: Castillo ($8M)

Sub-total: $18.5M

 

#1: Kopech ($0.5M)

#2: Rodon ($8M)

#3: Hansen ($0.5M)

#4: Giolito ($0.5M)

#5: Dunning ($0.5M)

Sub-total: $10M

 

CL: Burdi ($0.5M)

SU: Cease ($0.5M)

SU: Lopez ($0.5M)

MR: Vieira ($0.5M)

MR: Bummer ($0.5M)

MR: Fulmer ($0.5M)

LR: Stephens ($0.5M)

Sub-total: $3.5M

 

Grand-total: $60.5M

 

Yes, there are some weak/questionable spots. Yes, not all these guys will work out. But the point is we could add $60M to this roster in the short-run and still have room for growth as players start hitting arbitration. Plus I’m assuming an $18.5M bench to hedge against some of those kids not being quite ready. There are some quick & easy ways to clear even more salary.

 

To me, there is no reason we couldn’t afford to add Machado or Donaldson, a high leverage reliever, and one other impactful piece next offseason. If needed, then trade any excess/blocked talent resulting from these moves to fill the remaining holes on the roster. My point here is let’s use our financial resources on impact talent and not just league average players. If we have more than four or five major holes to fill come 2020 then the rebuild has gone poorly.

[soxfan49]

I'll be real, real upset if we sign Moose and forfeit our 2nd RD pick to do so. That would be the 45th overall pick. We took Alec Hansen with the 49th overall pick in 2016. Would you be willing to give up Hansen in order to sign Moose? I sure as hell wouldn't.

You could probably look at the twenty previous 45th or 49th pick and find a bunch of guys who never made it. I’m not necessarily advocating the signing of Moustakas but it sure as hell would have nothing to do with that pick.

[Eminor3rd]

The Royals won a World Series with Moose in he middle of their lineup

 

Yes, they did, in 2015. When Moustakas was 27 years old and put up a nearly 4-win season -- which is something he hasn't even sniffed since. In 2020, he'll be 32 years old.

 

The Cardinals won a World Series in 2011 with Albert Pujols in the middle of their lineup. That doesn't mean that should be the Angels' plan now.

[Chicago White Sox]

You could probably look at the twenty previous 45th or 49th pick and find a bunch of guys who never made it. I’m not necessarily advocating the signing of Moustakas but it sure as hell would have nothing to do with that pick.

It’s not just about the pick, but the bonus pool as well. The 2018 draft is supposed to be deep and it doesn’t sound like there will be a ton of seperation between the guys we’ll be considering at #4 (still early obviously). Therefore, there may be a legit under-slot play to made there, which could allow us to allocate bonus pool later on and take advantage of this draft’s depth. We’ll be in a much stronger position to execute such a strategy if we keep the #45 pick and it’s corresponding bonus pool. This is not the year to blow a high draft pick IMO, especially since we can stack penalties next year and lessen the overall impact if we sign multiple tendered guys.