2019 OD Bullpen

[ChiSoxJon]

Have a feeling our Sox are gonna pump a lot of money into the bullpen next year considering where they stand with a great lineup, wide open payroll, and s*** bullpen. Great year to do so with a FA class containing Allen, Brach, Familia, Herrera, Holland, Kimbrel, Ramos, Miller, Britton, and Doolittle. So what's the pen like on OD and who do we want in FA?

 

I'll realistically take a 'pen with Allen, Herrera, and Britton as newcoming FAs to join Jones, with Vieira, Burr, and Burdi later

 

Also whoever of Adams, Guerrero, Stephens, Fulmer, Danish, Covey can't start

[Balta1701]

I'm not squeamish about the money next year. IMO that was the point of the rebuild. So I'll be the first to say in this thread that this is the piece I want.

 

Kimbrel.

[caulfield12]

Personally, I think they give it until midseason 2019 to play out...unless they can get some absolute bargains next offseason.

 

There are too many wild cards right now. Jones. Burdi’s health. The law of averages says that at least one if not two of Fulmer, Lopez, Cease and Dunning will wind up down there.

 

Not having to pay an elite closer $15 million (again) would be a huge boost.

 

Hopefully Avilan, Bummer, Cedeno can hold down the fort from the LH side...not particularly interested in overpaying for Andrew Miller one season early.

[ChiSoxJon]

I'm not squeamish about the money next year. IMO that was the point of the rebuild. So I'll be the first to say in this thread that this is the piece I want.

 

Kimbrel.

Best there is probabaly

 

ChiSox have all the money in the world to burn and only a major need in the bullpen (Although I'd want Machado, but Anderson and Yolmer continue to rake)

 

I know I DON"T want Josh Donaldson...off topic

[caulfield12]

I'm not squeamish about the money next year. IMO that was the point of the rebuild. So I'll be the first to say in this thread that this is the piece I want.

 

Kimbrel.

 

Has he had arm surgery yet?

 

He seems like a perfect example of a veteran who has been used extensively and all of a sudden goes south (if the Sox get him)...but he’s still only 29, and should have at least 3-4 more dominant years left.

[ChiSoxJon]

Personally, I think they give it until midseason 2019 to play out...unless they can get some absolute bargains next offseason.

 

There are too many wild cards right now. Jones. Burdi’s health. The law of averages says that at least one if not two of Fulmer, Lopez, Cease and Dunning will wind up down there.

 

Not having to pay an elite closer $15 million (again) would be a huge boost.

 

Hopefully Avilan, Bummer, Cedeno can hold down the fort from the LH side...not particularly interested in overpaying for Andrew Miller one season early.

I agree on Miller and forgot about Avilan (hopefully does well)...Cedeno is a scrap piece but Bummer has '18 to prove himself as well

[Chicago White Sox]

Personally, I think they give it until midseason 2019 to play out...unless they can get some absolute bargains next offseason.

 

There are too many wild cards right now. Jones. Burdi’s health. The law of averages says that at least one if not two of Fulmer, Lopez, Cease and Dunning will wind up down there.

 

Not having to pay an elite closer $15 million (again) would be a huge boost.

 

Hopefully Avilan, Bummer, Cedeno can hold down the fort from the LH side...not particularly interested in overpaying for Andrew Miller one season early.

What exactly are we spending all our money on then? You’re against Machado, you’re against elite relievers. Do you want to overpay for a bunch of B free agents or simply go young across the board?

Edited April 7, 2018 by Chicago White Sox

[Balta1701]

What exactly are we spending all our money on then? You’re against Machado, you’re against elite relievers. Do you want to overpay for a bunch of B free agents or simply go young across the board?

The Kimbrel fan again stressing this point - I spent what, 4 years, saying the White Sox needed to go young across the board, probably longer. Being able to sign one or two of these big guys and add them into the mix in a very talented franchise...that is why we needed to go young across the board. We've already done that, this offseason will be the time to strike with a big piece or two.

[southsider2k5]

Best there is probabaly

 

ChiSox have all the money in the world to burn and only a major need in the bullpen (Although I'd want Machado, but Anderson and Yolmer continue to rake)

 

I know I DON"T want Josh Donaldson...off topic

 

I am pretty certain Josh Donaldson will not be in the White Sox 2019 bullpen.

[Chicago White Sox]

CL: Kimbrel (FA)

SU: Burdi

SU: Wilson (FA)

MR: Fulmer

MR: Bummer

MR: Hamilton

LR: Stephens

[ChiSoxJon]

CL: Kimbrel (FA)

SU: Burdi

SU: Wilson (FA)

MR: Fulmer

MR: Bummer

MR: Hamilton

LR: Stephens

I like it although Wilson's a bit too old for me to pay bank for

[caulfield12]

What exactly are we spending all our money on then? You?€™re against Machado, you?€™re against elite relievers. Do you want to overpay for a bunch of B free agents or simply go young across the board?

 

1) Another outfielder if Avi goes

2) Veteran 2/3 starter

3) Two elite set up guys (rather than one closer, who I believe comes internally)

4) Catcher? Depends on Collins/Zavala...

 

If I knew the top 2-3 picks in the draft, that would help, too.

 

I also would be looking to Japan or Korea for a bargain to throw in the mix.

Edited April 7, 2018 by caulfield12

[Chicago White Sox]

The Kimbrel fan again stressing this point - I spent what, 4 years, saying the White Sox needed to go young across the board, probably longer. Being able to sign one or two of these big guys and add them into the mix in a very talented franchise...that is why we needed to go young across the board. We've already done that, this offseason will be the time to strike with a big piece or two.

Unless something crazy happens, the Sox will most definitely be adding one elite reliever next offseason. It’s a huge area of weakness and one where we could use a stabilizing veteran. The Sox aren’t going to sit on their money forever, not when a ton of their key young pieces are up and ready to contribute.

[ChiSoxJon]

1) Another outfielder if Avi goes

2) Veteran 2/3 starter

3) Two elite set up guys (rather than one closer, who I believe comes internally)

4) Catcher? Depends on Collins/Zavala...

 

If I knew the top 2-3 picks in the draft, that would help, too.

 

I also would be looking to Japan or Korea for a bargain to throw in the mix.

Why? They'd hit below .200 for Charlotee

 

Have a feeling Avi stays

 

May not be room for a starter with Kopech, Giolito, Lopez up and developing with Hansen, Dunning, Cease, etc. knocking at the door and Rodon already there

 

I agree that two set up guys are better than a single closer and the Sox do have some guys with great 'pen potential...starting with Fulmer but I think he sticks in the rotation

 

Catcher is gonna be crowded with Castillo's option likely picked up, Narvaez there, Smith still hanging on (for now at least), and both Collins and Zavala knocking at the door

Coillins likely better profiles at 1B but obviously Abreu is there (And Davidson)

[soxfan49]

Why? They'd hit below .200 for Charlotee

 

Have a feeling Avi stays

 

May not be room for a starter with Kopech, Giolito, Lopez up and developing with Hansen, Dunning, Cease, etc. knocking at the door and Rodon already there

 

I agree that two set up guys are better than a single closer and the Sox do have some guys with great 'pen potential...starting with Fulmer but I think he sticks in the rotation

 

Catcher is gonna be crowded with Castillo's option likely picked up, Narvaez there, Smith still hanging on (for now at least), and both Collins and Zavala knocking at the door

Coillins likely better profiles at 1B but obviously Abreu is there (And Davidson)

I believe he meant a pitcher from Asia, but even if he was referring to a hitter, how do you know he'd hit .200 for Charlotte?

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

I’ll never understand the thought process that we have to wait on rebuilding the bullpen until the start of the anticipated contention window. Strong bullpens can take a few years to build. It’s why I strongly endorsed the idea of signing Addison Reed to a 4 year deal at ~$7MM AAV, even though the rest of the board was strongly opposed to such a signing. Why not start adding pieces now to begin addressing the team’s biggest weakness rather than reaching for 3 or 4 pieces next offseason? Heck, the Sox would probably be 5-1 right now if they had signed Reed.

Edited April 7, 2018 by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

[ChiSoxJon]

I’ll never understand the thought process that we have to wait on rebuilding the bullpen until the start of the anticipated contention window. Strong bullpens can take a few years to build. It’s why I strongly endorsed the idea of signing Addison Reed to a 4 year deal at $7MM AAV, even though the rest of the board was strongly opposed to such a signing. Why not start adding pieces now to begin addressing the team’s biggest weakness rather than reaching for 3 or 4 next offseason? Heck, the Sox would probably be 5-1 right now if they had signed Reed.

After viewing this 'pen for a week I'm convinced that Hahn's goal for '18 is to show promise through the lineup and young arms like Giolito and Lopez (Who the TOR broadcast compared to Severino BTW) and ongoing prospect influx yet lose through the bullpen to get a top 10 pick again so he can maintain the Farm and keep a first rounder despite adding big time FAs this upcoming offseason. Also, feel like he's preparing the fanbase to miss out on a Harper/Machado-type and settle for a bullpen makeover. I would have liked that Reed idea but I do think Castillo and Avilan who were both added this offseason will be here when this time is a perennial powerhouse (At least at the beginning of the reign)

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

After viewing this 'pen for a week I'm convinced that Hahn's goal for '18 is to show promise through the lineup and young arms like Giolito and Lopez (Who the TOR broadcast compared to Severino BTW) and ongoing prospect influx yet lose through the bullpen to get a top 10 pick again so he can maintain the Farm and keep a first rounder despite adding big time FAs this upcoming offseason. Also, feel like he's preparing the fanbase to miss out on a Harper/Machado-type and settle for a bullpen makeover. I would have liked that Reed idea but I do think Castillo and Avilan who were both added this offseason will be here when this time is a perennial powerhouse (At least at the beginning of the reign)

Avilan and Castillo are nice additions but aren’t they both free agents after next season? The reason I liked the idea of signing Reed to a 4 year deal is that you’d have him thru the 2021 season. He could function as the closer this season and then when they add a proven closer like Kimbrel or Allen next offseason, he could easily slide to proven setup man over the next 3 years. Oh well. Probably need a spend a decent chunck of change on the bullpen next offseason if they have any plans of competing in 2019.

[ChiSoxJon]

Avilan and Castillo are nice additions but aren’t they both free agents after next season? The reason I liked the idea of signing Reed to a 4 year deal is that you’d have him thru the 2021 season. He could function as the closer this season and then when they add a proven closer like Kimbrel or Allen next offseason, he could easily slide to proven setup man over the next 3 years. Oh well. Probably need a spend a decent chunck of change on the bullpen next offseason if they have any plans of competing in 2019.

Yeah I like that Reed idea too, although his stuff is on the decline

 

But yes, Avilan and Castillo are FAs in 2020...Maybe they both play their way here longer

 

All for Allen, Britton, Herrera, etc. though

 

Side note: Hector Rondon who I wanted CWS to sign is off to a hot start with 5 Ks in 3 IP, no ER

[Chicago White Sox]

I’ll never understand the thought process that we have to wait on rebuilding the bullpen until the start of the anticipated contention window. Strong bullpens can take a few years to build. It’s why I strongly endorsed the idea of signing Addison Reed to a 4 year deal at $7MM AAV, even though the rest of the board was strongly opposed to such a signing. Why not start adding pieces now to begin addressing the team’s biggest weakness rather than reaching for 3 or 4 next offseason? Heck, the Sox would probably be 5-1 right now if they had signed Reed.

Realistically, I don’t see a need to sign second tier relievers right now. We have a ton of interesting arms in the system that will require shots in the near future. Burdi is about as elite of a relief prospect as they come with three legit plus pitches (health permitting). Vieiria is another guy with an 80 grade fastball & significant upside if he can further develop his curveball. Hamilton & Burr are both high-end relief prospects currently in AA. I could see those last three guys pushing for major league roles this year. Burdi would already be up if it weren’t for his injury. And then you have a bunch of starting pitching prospects who will ultimately have to move to the pen. As good as Fulmer looked in his last start, I still view him as a reliever long-term. I think Stephens will also make the move to the pen at some point in the near future. Other guys remain up for debate. I see plenty of options to fill three or four spots right there. The left side is more of an issue. Bummer looks life he could be a quality second lefty in a pen, but I’d probably want to add an established left-handed veteran to handle the high leverage innings. Fry offers some depth in the event Bummer doesn’t pan, but clearly this is an area of need. Regardless, I’m optimistic we can build a quality bullpen with only two outside additions.

[caulfield12]

Which relievers were bargain this offseason and will hit their primes from 2019-23?

 

Reed was overpriced. Hector Rondon...maybe? But he’s already 30.

 

Better risk for the win now Astros than win in perhaps 2019 White Sox.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

Which relievers were bargain this offseason and will hit their primes from 2019-23?

 

Reed was overpriced. Hector Rondon...maybe? But he?€™s already 30.

 

Better risk for the win now Astros than win in perhaps 2019 White Sox.

How was Reed overpriced? He got paid the going rate for a proven setup man that could also fill in as a closer if needed. He is also 29 years old and didn’t require draft pick compensation to sign, just $$.

Edited April 7, 2018 by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

[southsider2k5]

I’ll never understand the thought process that we have to wait on rebuilding the bullpen until the start of the anticipated contention window. Strong bullpens can take a few years to build. It’s why I strongly endorsed the idea of signing Addison Reed to a 4 year deal at ~$7MM AAV, even though the rest of the board was strongly opposed to such a signing. Why not start adding pieces now to begin addressing the team’s biggest weakness rather than reaching for 3 or 4 pieces next offseason? Heck, the Sox would probably be 5-1 right now if they had signed Reed.

 

Bullpens are volatile, shortlived, and have gotten expensive when compared to what position players who play a ton more are getting paid.

 

Plus we have a TON Of pitchers who have potential relievers in their profile. We probably have a solid 20 pitchers in the minors who could have a shot at a major league bullpen, especially if you include guys like Cease who have endurance concerns in their scouting reports. The one spot I have the absolute least worry about in the next few years is the bullpen.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

Bullpens are volatile, shortlived, and have gotten expensive when compared to what position players who play a ton more are getting paid.

 

Plus we have a TON Of pitchers who have potential relievers in their profile. We probably have a solid 20 pitchers in the minors who could have a shot at a major league bullpen, especially if you include guys like Cease who have endurance concerns in their scouting reports. The one spot I have the absolute least worry about in the next few years is the bullpen.

How do you define short lived? The Royals had one of, if not the best bullpen in baseball during their 3 year run. Same for the Indians over the past 3 years. Even though relievers play a minimal amount when compared to position players, bad ones can inflict more damage over a much shorter timeframe as evidenced by what we are seeing from the Sox so far this season. I don’t think it’s a good idea to head into the “contention window” (which really should start next season) with a bunch of young arms that may have potential but are unproven at the big league level. Just take a look around the league and see what teams like the Indians, Cubs, Yankees, and Astros have done to build up their bullpens. It doesn’t have to be built entirely through free agency either but a combination of free agency and timely trades for proven veterans (Andrew Miller, Chapman, Davis, Robertson, Giles, etc).