caulfield12 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 https://www.yahoo.com/sports/10-degrees-manny-machado-vs-bryce-harper-frenzy-two-biggest-money-contracts-american-pro-sports-history-162619590.html Passan argues that Machado SHOULD get the biggest contract (but might not because of "marketing" factors surrounding Harper) Players trending up: Michael Brantley, Trevor Cahill, Jeurys Familia, Tyler Flowers, Gio Gonzalez (3 times?), Yasmani Grandal, JA Happ, Jeremy Hellickson, Joe Kelly, Jed Lowrie, Nick Markakis, Leonys Martin, Moustakas, Bud Norris, Adam Ottavino, Wilson Ramos, Garrett Richards, Tyson Ross, Kelvin Herrera Five relievers. Six starting pitchers in there that all would be potential Sox targets. Also, valuing Dallas Keuchel appropriately will be an interesting one to watch. Two catchers in Ramos and Grandal (looking less likely with development of Collins/Zavala)...doubt we take back Tyler Flowers, but strange things have happened. Would now have to go Michael Brantley (who also has an injury history) over AJ Pollock because of the cumulative number of injuries...and also taking away a key member of the Indians/divisional opponent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Machado or bust 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 40 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: https://www.yahoo.com/sports/10-degrees-manny-machado-vs-bryce-harper-frenzy-two-biggest-money-contracts-american-pro-sports-history-162619590.html Passan argues that Machado SHOULD get the biggest contract (but might not because of "marketing" factors surrounding Harper) Players trending up: Michael Brantley, Trevor Cahill, Jeurys Familia, Tyler Flowers, Gio Gonzalez (3 times?), Yasmani Grandal, JA Happ, Jeremy Hellickson, Joe Kelly, Jed Lowrie, Nick Markakis, Leonys Martin, Moustakas, Bud Norris, Adam Ottavino, Wilson Ramos, Garrett Richards, Tyson Ross, Kelvin Herrera Five relievers. Six starting pitchers in there that all would be potential Sox targets. Also, valuing Dallas Keuchel appropriately will be an interesting one to watch. Two catchers in Ramos and Grandal (looking less likely with development of Collins/Zavala)...doubt we take back Tyler Flowers, but strange things have happened. Would now have to go Michael Brantley (who also has an injury history) over AJ Pollock because of the cumulative number of injuries...and also taking away a key member of the Indians/divisional opponent. Machado, Brantley, Kimbrel, Herrera, and Familia seems like a good haul. Don't be all logical and tell me that that's likely over half a billion dollars in contracts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Dam8610 said: Machado, Brantley, Kimbrel, Herrera, and Familia seems like a good haul. Don't be all logical and tell me that that's likely over half a billion dollars in contracts. I doubt they'll bring in more than one closer...likely a closer and MAYBE a veteran set-up guy like an Addison Reed. Depends on whether or not Nate Jones is traded, to an extent. Brantley and AJ Pollock are the two best outfielders...Pollock was looking at a $100+ million deal before going down to injury yet again. Could see Moustakas/Donaldson (if his value falls off a cliff to the point where the risk is worth it), Brantley and a top reliever as the three biggest adds without breaking the bank. Just don't trust guys in their walk year putting up HUGE numbers and then falling off as soon as they've signed huge megadeals (especially playing for what's likely to be a .500, at best, team in 2019). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glangon Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 Bust the bank. Get Machado and Harper, we have the payroll to do this. Blow up the FA market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydBannister1983 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 7 hours ago, Hot FiRe said: Machado or bust He will most likely be in a Cubs uniform next year, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
he gone. Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 2 hours ago, glangon said: Bust the bank. Get Machado and Harper, we have the payroll to do this. Blow up the FA market. True. Let's get Keuchel and Gio Gonzalez too. Let's do this the right way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 56 minutes ago, Juschill said: He will most likely be in a Cubs uniform next year, unfortunately. According to Baseball Reference, they are already at $185 million in estimated payroll for 2019 (if Q and Strop's options are exercised). The luxury tax next year will be at $206 million. If they want Machado (or Harper for that matter), they will easily be at $215 million without any other off season additions. Will be interesting to see what they do, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Juschill said: He will most likely be in a Cubs uniform next year, unfortunately. I hope they're dumb enough to let their core walk to pay a guy who can't play SS to play SS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, Dam8610 said: I hope they're dumb enough to let their core walk to pay a guy who can't play SS to play SS. Well I guess you would just move him to 3B in a few years when Bryant left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Lamar Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 2 hours ago, maggsmaggs said: According to Baseball Reference, they are already at $185 million in estimated payroll for 2019 (if Q and Strop's options are exercised). The luxury tax next year will be at $206 million. If they want Machado (or Harper for that matter), they will easily be at $215 million without any other off season additions. Will be interesting to see what they do, I've written here before that I think the key on both of those guys is going to be front loading the contract in the first two years with a player opt out after year 2. I think the Sox are position better than just about anyone to give $80 million (or more) in those first two years. I wouldn't even be concerned about the overall contract value if I were the Sox as there is a very small chance he doesn't opt out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, Superstar Lamar said: I've written here before that I think the key on both of those guys is going to be front loading the contract in the first two years with a player opt out after year 2. I think the Sox are position better than just about anyone to give $80 million (or more) in those first two years. I wouldn't even be concerned about the overall contract value if I were the Sox as there is a very small chance he doesn't opt out. Front load AND and opt out? That is an awful deal. If you are going to load a contract with an opt, it needs to be in the back end to give the player an incentive to stay, and not to leave. Besides our window is only going to be opening during that time frame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 If any free agent won’t be here through at least 2021...pretty pointless to acquire them unless simply reclamation (pitching) projects we’re hoping to flip for more prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 35 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Front load AND and opt out? That is an awful deal. If you are going to load a contract with an opt, it needs to be in the back end to give the player an incentive to stay, and not to leave. Besides our window is only going to be opening during that time frame. An interesting contract idea would be: 2019: $35 million 2020: $40 million OPT OUT 2021: $45 million 2022: $45 million 2023: $45 million OPT OUT 2024: $35 million 2025: $35 million OPT OUT 2026: $25 million 2027: $25 million 2028: $20 million Total Contract Value: $350 million ($35 million AAV) Contract Value at first opt out: $75 million ($37.5 million AAV) Contract Value at second opt out: $210 million ($42 million AAV) Contract Value at third opt out: $280 million ($40 million AAV) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 A deal like that makes a lot more sense from both the team, and from the player standpoint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 1 minute ago, Dam8610 said: An interesting contract idea would be: 2019: $35 million 2020: $40 million OPT OUT 2021: $45 million 2022: $45 million 2023: $45 million OPT OUT 2024: $35 million 2025: $35 million OPT OUT 2026: $25 million 2027: $25 million 2028: $20 million Total Contract Value: $350 million ($35 million AAV) Contract Value at first opt out: $75 million ($37.5 million AAV) Contract Value at second opt out: $210 million ($42 million AAV) Contract Value at third opt out: $280 million ($40 million AAV) So you want to give the player an opt-out about the time the Sox are expected to contend? That makes no sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 5 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: So you want to give the player an opt-out about the time the Sox are expected to contend? That makes no sense. FWIW, I'm totally ok with offering an opt-out, but the deal-breaker for me is having it after 2020. I need that 3rd year - 2021, to make this worth it for me. I will offer a 2021 opt out, but I need those 3 years to give this roster 3 shots before we have to figure out the next step. That goes for any of these big name players we might target. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 15 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: So you want to give the player an opt-out about the time the Sox are expected to contend? That makes no sense. My gamble is that he's not going to find a $45 million AAV contract elsewhere for those next 3 years. Essentially, I'm incentivizing him to stay in the deal for 5 years, maybe 7, then leave of his own accord. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beautox Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Balta1701 said: FWIW, I'm totally ok with offering an opt-out, but the deal-breaker for me is having it after 2020. I need that 3rd year - 2021, to make this worth it for me. I will offer a 2021 opt out, but I need those 3 years to give this roster 3 shots before we have to figure out the next step. That goes for any of these big name players we might target. I'm fine with an opt out as well, but to your point it has to be after three years. I'm ok going 30 35 40 opt 45 45 opt 45 35 35 opt 25 25 25 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, beautox said: I'm fine with an opt out as well, but to your point it has to be after three years. I'm ok going 30 35 40 opt 45 45 opt 45 35 35 opt 25 25 25 You're going 11 years on the contract? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beautox Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, Dam8610 said: You're going 11 years on the contract? If that's what it takes to land this generations Brooks Robinson...yeah. hoping he ages like beltre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Balta1701 said: FWIW, I'm totally ok with offering an opt-out, but the deal-breaker for me is having it after 2020. I need that 3rd year - 2021, to make this worth it for me. I will offer a 2021 opt out, but I need those 3 years to give this roster 3 shots before we have to figure out the next step. That goes for any of these big name players we might target. I'd also be okay with something like: 2019: $35 million 2020: $40 million 2021: $45 million OPT OUT 2022: $50 million 2023: $50 million OPT OUT 2024: $40 million 2025: $30 million OPT OUT 2026: $25 million 2027: $20 million 2028: $15 million I think if you sign him, getting the first 5 years is key. I'd be willing to structure the deal in just about any way to definitely get those first 5 years barring something crazy happening, maybe get 7 years, and not have to worry about paying a declining 36 year old a whole lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 8, 2018 Share Posted June 8, 2018 Hahn spent all offseason saving the Sox would be way more aggressive in the offseason after 2018. Well after 60 games of awful play, he seemed way less confident on Mully and Hanley today that the Sox would be aggressive after the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turnin' two Posted June 8, 2018 Share Posted June 8, 2018 On 6/5/2018 at 1:07 AM, caulfield12 said: I doubt they'll bring in more than one closer...likely a closer and MAYBE a veteran set-up guy like an Addison Reed. Depends on whether or not Nate Jones is traded, to an extent. Brantley and AJ Pollock are the two best outfielders...Pollock was looking at a $100+ million deal before going down to injury yet again. Could see Moustakas/Donaldson (if his value falls off a cliff to the point where the risk is worth it), Brantley and a top reliever as the three biggest adds without breaking the bank. Just don't trust guys in their walk year putting up HUGE numbers and then falling off as soon as they've signed huge megadeals (especially playing for what's likely to be a .500, at best, team in 2019). I would prefer no part in Pollock. Great player, but he has played 100 less than half his seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 8, 2018 Author Share Posted June 8, 2018 The problem is the #3 outfielder after Harper and Pollock...is Michael Brantley. His injury history speaks for itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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