2018-2019 Official NBA thread

[Quin]

5 hours ago, Chisoxfn said:

Would be smart if they did it. 

Yup. Due to the injury + Klutch, it could scare Phoenix off if they can't work him out.

Only play they really got, but it is a play.

[bmags]

I doubt it was any team that high. Someone probably just guaranteed him a floor. If a top ten team asks for a private workout he’s taking it, but no need to go through combine if a team saw what it needed.

[bmags]

In terms of refocusing to "just gettin stuff", I really don't think I'd have issue at 7 with many guys.

Even if they took Reddish I'd get it, and it'd probably be worth shooting your shot (sorta like Malik Monk albeit it didn't work out) with a guy with that skillset.

But assuming the absolute locks that Williamson, Morant and Barrett are all gone, in order of my preference its

1) Jarrett Culver

2) Darius Garland

3) Coby White

4) Deandre Hunter (more for fit, he is likely above white otherwise)

5) Reddish

6) Hayes

7) Clarke

Trade back guys

Nickeil Alexander Walker, Bol Bol, Grant Williams

If we picked up a future lotto protected first, traded back and got NA-W? I wouldn't hate it!

If we got Culver I'd deem that really successful, Garland really nice, White pretty normal, and I seriously could buy into any of the guys behind even though some fit questionably as our health and rotation is so thin.

[Chisoxfn]

Bulls reportedly interested in Rozier and/or Beverly.  Both would be nice additions.  Rozier could have some upside and will be interesting if he sticks around Boston. He shined in the post-season last year when Kyrie was out.  

[Chisoxfn]

I presume Memphis will keep the 2nd pick, but I wonder if the Bulls make a very strong play to go up and grab Ja (if after they finish their scouting they determine he is a generational guy). If so, do they offer Dunn, this years 1st, plus next years first + ?.  I don't know that Memphis does that (Bulls probably need to offer another future 1st, which is risky), but this is probably the last year the Bulls will be this awful (they might still be bad).  Than again, with the lottery odds flatter, being on the back of the lottery isn't necessarily bad either (you at least have a better shot of moving on up).  

Based upon the Bulls roster construction, if there was a year to be ultra aggressive, this would be the year. I don't know Memphis to know where they stand in their rebuilt and what other pieces they have, but they might still be earlier in the asset accumulation phase where moving down isn't a bad thing (especially since they have Conley, who is still very good, but has a large contract).  

The alternative is the Bulls move Felicio and any other spare parts and just trade for Conley (who I presume Memphis would move purely to clear cap space). Know you've sunk your cap space for 2 more years (Porto and Conley) if you are the Bulls and roll with that.  The move absolutely puts the Bulls in a playoff spot, albeit, their flexibility will be a bit hampered and I don't know how good that team could be, but it absolutely should be a playoff team. Conley is a massive upgrade (presuming he can stay on the floor and doesn't have any known LT injury concerns (I know he has had a couple seasons recently where he's missed some games due to injury). 

As I type this...I'd have to kind of say, Conley might be the Bulls most realistic path.   I don't know how they position from there to a true contender, probably very dependent on the growth of Lavine, Laurie, Wendell and I don't think any of them are stars. They would have a ton of well rounded pieces and than you just have to hope with the team being much better, at some point a superstar forces his way to Chicago (and you move some of the pieces to get said player).   

[Kyyle23]

43 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

I presume Memphis will keep the 2nd pick, but I wonder if the Bulls make a very strong play to go up and grab Ja (if after they finish their scouting they determine he is a generational guy). If so, do they offer Dunn, this years 1st, plus next years first + ?.  I don't know that Memphis does that (Bulls probably need to offer another future 1st, which is risky), but this is probably the last year the Bulls will be this awful (they might still be bad).  Than again, with the lottery odds flatter, being on the back of the lottery isn't necessarily bad either (you at least have a better shot of moving on up).  

Based upon the Bulls roster construction, if there was a year to be ultra aggressive, this would be the year. I don't know Memphis to know where they stand in their rebuilt and what other pieces they have, but they might still be earlier in the asset accumulation phase where moving down isn't a bad thing (especially since they have Conley, who is still very good, but has a large contract).  

The alternative is the Bulls move Felicio and any other spare parts and just trade for Conley (who I presume Memphis would move purely to clear cap space). Know you've sunk your cap space for 2 more years (Porto and Conley) if you are the Bulls and roll with that.  The move absolutely puts the Bulls in a playoff spot, albeit, their flexibility will be a bit hampered and I don't know how good that team could be, but it absolutely should be a playoff team. Conley is a massive upgrade (presuming he can stay on the floor and doesn't have any known LT injury concerns (I know he has had a couple seasons recently where he's missed some games due to injury). 

As I type this...I'd have to kind of say, Conley might be the Bulls most realistic path.   I don't know how they position from there to a true contender, probably very dependent on the growth of Lavine, Laurie, Wendell and I don't think any of them are stars. They would have a ton of well rounded pieces and than you just have to hope with the team being much better, at some point a superstar forces his way to Chicago (and you move some of the pieces to get said player).   

Come on, Jason.   COME ON

[Quin]

51 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

I presume Memphis will keep the 2nd pick, but I wonder if the Bulls make a very strong play to go up and grab Ja (if after they finish their scouting they determine he is a generational guy). If so, do they offer Dunn, this years 1st, plus next years first + ?.  I don't know that Memphis does that (Bulls probably need to offer another future 1st, which is risky), but this is probably the last year the Bulls will be this awful (they might still be bad).  Than again, with the lottery odds flatter, being on the back of the lottery isn't necessarily bad either (you at least have a better shot of moving on up).  

Based upon the Bulls roster construction, if there was a year to be ultra aggressive, this would be the year. I don't know Memphis to know where they stand in their rebuilt and what other pieces they have, but they might still be earlier in the asset accumulation phase where moving down isn't a bad thing (especially since they have Conley, who is still very good, but has a large contract).  

The alternative is the Bulls move Felicio and any other spare parts and just trade for Conley (who I presume Memphis would move purely to clear cap space). Know you've sunk your cap space for 2 more years (Porto and Conley) if you are the Bulls and roll with that.  The move absolutely puts the Bulls in a playoff spot, albeit, their flexibility will be a bit hampered and I don't know how good that team could be, but it absolutely should be a playoff team. Conley is a massive upgrade (presuming he can stay on the floor and doesn't have any known LT injury concerns (I know he has had a couple seasons recently where he's missed some games due to injury). 

As I type this...I'd have to kind of say, Conley might be the Bulls most realistic path.   I don't know how they position from there to a true contender, probably very dependent on the growth of Lavine, Laurie, Wendell and I don't think any of them are stars. They would have a ton of well rounded pieces and than you just have to hope with the team being much better, at some point a superstar forces his way to Chicago (and you move some of the pieces to get said player).   

To get Ja it'd be Lauri + this year's first.

[Chisoxfn]

21 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Come on, Jason.   COME ON

Kobe tried it. Bulls just weren't able to pull it off.  People act like the Bulls haven't had legit shots at superstars, when they were good...they were in everyone's conversation to land the big free agents. They swung and missed. 

Right now...they are on no ones list though.  Why because they suck.  

[Chisoxfn]

Separately, do people buy into the Bulls being a pretty good team with a Conley at the point. Very well rounded player, strong leader and vet presence (for the young guys we do have).  And if an opportunity develops, you can move a Porter plus other pieces to land a bigger fish over time. First they need to get to respectability.  

[Brian]

I would've liked Conley better a few years ago. Better than Dunn at least.

[Balta1701]

20 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

Separately, do people buy into the Bulls being a pretty good team with a Conley at the point. Very well rounded player, strong leader and vet presence (for the young guys we do have).  And if an opportunity develops, you can move a Porter plus other pieces to land a bigger fish over time. First they need to get to respectability.  

How do you define "Pretty good"?

Is this team 1 tolerable PG away from competing for the 8-9 slot? Probably not. Could they compete for the 8-9 slot with a tolerable PG, better health, and improvement from WCJ and Lauri? Maybe, but am I likely to bet on good health and good development from this Bulls organization and coaching staff?

[Kyyle23]

36 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

Kobe tried it. Bulls just weren't able to pull it off.  People act like the Bulls haven't had legit shots at superstars, when they were good...they were in everyone's conversation to land the big free agents. They swung and missed. 

Right now...they are on no ones list though.  Why because they suck.  

Kobe tried it what, 12-15 years ago?   You are living in the past if you think this is a destination anymore.   The players voted that Boylen is the coach they would least like to play for.   The front office is already known to be persona non grata and Paxson himself admitted that they cannot convince elite talent to come here, so that's why they traded for Porter.  So they are done swinging and missing, they just decided not to swing anymore.

This front office has destroyed every true avenue to get better and now they rely on luck.  On Tuesday luck kicked them in the nuts.

no superstar is going to push to come to Chicago until this entire front office is cleaned out 

 

 

[bmags]

54 minutes ago, Quin said:

To get Ja it'd be Lauri + this year's first.

No Ja is not that good of a prospect and it wouldn’t take that. You could get it for this years first and a lottery protected first and I’m not sure I wouldn’t take Barrett at two anyway

[Chisoxfn]

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

How do you define "Pretty good"?

Is this team 1 tolerable PG away from competing for the 8-9 slot? Probably not. Could they compete for the 8-9 slot with a tolerable PG, better health, and improvement from WCJ and Lauri? Maybe, but am I likely to bet on good health and good development from this Bulls organization and coaching staff?

Is Mike Conley a tolerable PG or one of the better PG's in the league. I guess that is the question.  

[bmags]

22 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

Is Mike Conley a tolerable PG or one of the better PG's in the league. I guess that is the question.  

Conley I still think is really good, but it's obviously tough to narrow down "top ten" when we can't really decide on whether we count players like Harden as PGs.

But the bulls depth is very bad. And I'm still not confident that with him they are better than the Pacers. They need some vet pieces like a Jared Dudley/Demarre Carroll type folks.

[Chisoxfn]

4 minutes ago, bmags said:

Conley I still think is really good, but it's obviously tough to narrow down "top ten" when we can't really decide on whether we count players like Harden as PGs.

But the bulls depth is very bad. And I'm still not confident that with him they are better than the Pacers. They need some vet pieces like a Jared Dudley/Demarre Carroll type folks.

If you acquire Conley, you have an MLE so that gets you another player plus you still have your 7th draft pick (and have not even dealt Dunn...albeit to get Conley they might have to give some of those pieces in addition to Felicio).  They also didn't have Porter for most of the year and that is a big issue. Their depth was also artificially lower because of "tanking".  

Note: If Bulls acquire Conley, I'm hoping they get Reddish. I like his game enough and think his ability to shoot can ultimately turn him into a Klay type of guy. Not saying he will be that guy...but I could see it happen. I think he is underrated given the other two stars he played next two and I like his game from an NBA perspective.  I actually think even if they didn't get Conley, I still lean to Reddish.  

[Chisoxfn]

I'll just go on record as saying, I'm cautiously optimistic on the Bulls offseason and more importantly the type of player they could get @ 7.  I think White, Culver and Reddish (not to mention Garland...albeit I'll downplay him due to his injury and limited scouting) could all turn into very good players.  Sure they could also bust, but there are components about any one of them that could lead them to be better than say Ja Morant (who I think has a high upside but also a risk element to him).  

[bmags]

Just now, Chisoxfn said:

If you acquire Conley, you have an MLE so that gets you another player plus you still have your 7th draft pick (and have not even dealt Dunn...albeit to get Conley they might have to give some of those pieces in addition to Felicio).  They also didn't have Porter for most of the year and that is a big issue. Their depth was also artificially lower because of "tanking".  

I don't agree with that, their depth is bad because it has a bunch of bad players. Arcidiacano is nice but he's fine if you have a few superstars. The team bulls are building needs borderline starters as backups as they have a lot of good not great players put into a core. 

Wayne Selden jr, Hutchinson, Valentine, Dunn, Felicio, TLC. Shaq harrison was a good 3rd/4th guard because he has a purpose. The rest, bleh.

And you are almost certainly out the 7th to the grizz in addition to needing to shave off at least 10 million for Conley, and that's not assuming they want legit talent which they may be able to acquire for Conley.

By contrast, a team like the pacers is throwing Thad Young and Tyreke Evans at you in the second unit.

So acquire collison, you are looking at 

Darren Collison, Lavine, Porter, Lauri, WCJ - Starters

Dunn, Felicio, Hutchinson, 2nd round pick, Valentine, WSJ.

You certainly need to add a backup C with Lopez gone or you are spending on the exception for Lopez.

It would be pretty hard. It kinda looks like Detroit.

[Chisoxfn]

1 minute ago, bmags said:

I don't agree with that, their depth is bad because it has a bunch of bad players. Arcidiacano is nice but he's fine if you have a few superstars. The team bulls are building needs borderline starters as backups as they have a lot of good not great players put into a core. 

Wayne Selden jr, Hutchinson, Valentine, Dunn, Felicio, TLC. Shaq harrison was a good 3rd/4th guard because he has a purpose. The rest, bleh.

And you are almost certainly out the 7th to the grizz in addition to needing to shave off at least 10 million for Conley, and that's not assuming they want legit talent which they may be able to acquire for Conley.

By contrast, a team like the pacers is throwing Thad Young and Tyreke Evans at you in the second unit.

So acquire collison, you are looking at 

Darren Collison, Lavine, Porter, Lauri, WCJ - Starters

Dunn, Felicio, Hutchinson, 2nd round pick, Valentine, WSJ.

You certainly need to add a backup C with Lopez gone or you are spending on the exception for Lopez.

It would be pretty hard. It kinda looks like Detroit.

That is where I think Conley differentiates (vs. a Collison). I agree with you that the above lineup is tough and very dependent on Lavine, Lauri and WCJ's future.  But that roster is missing the 7th overall pick (cause I'm not trading that for Collison).  

[bmags]

Just now, Chisoxfn said:

That is where I think Conley differentiates (vs. a Collison). I agree with you that the above lineup is tough and very dependent on Lavine, Lauri and WCJ's future.  But that roster is missing the 7th overall pick (cause I'm not trading that for Collison).  

I started looking at the pacers depth and then wrote down Collison, hah. 

Conley et al is very good but depth gets you through the regular season and they just need more defensive versatility from their front court and would be throwing questionable guard play almost immediately. Need more shooting/more athleticism all around.

I would like Jrue Holiday more than conley. If the 7th +the salary dumps net either I think you do it, because as you said you could get rid of Porter if you need to.

But absent that, I am starting to think I'd pull the trigger on Reddish if he's there. It also just feels like brandon clarke is gonna be a guy everyone says years later they should have just drafted him.

[Quin]

3 hours ago, bmags said:

I don't agree with that, their depth is bad because it has a bunch of bad players. Arcidiacano is nice but he's fine if you have a few superstars. The team bulls are building needs borderline starters as backups as they have a lot of good not great players put into a core. 

Wayne Selden jr, Hutchinson, Valentine, Dunn, Felicio, TLC. Shaq harrison was a good 3rd/4th guard because he has a purpose. The rest, bleh.

And you are almost certainly out the 7th to the grizz in addition to needing to shave off at least 10 million for Conley, and that's not assuming they want legit talent which they may be able to acquire for Conley.

By contrast, a team like the pacers is throwing Thad Young and Tyreke Evans at you in the second unit.

So acquire collison, you are looking at 

Darren Collison, Lavine, Porter, Lauri, WCJ - Starters

Dunn, Felicio, Hutchinson, 2nd round pick, Valentine, WSJ.

You certainly need to add a backup C with Lopez gone or you are spending on the exception for Lopez.

It would be pretty hard. It kinda looks like Detroit.

Pacers ain't throwing out Tyreke Evans anymore. He's been kicked out of the league.

[bmags]

Having only White or Hunter is my least favorite draft but it's very likely:

https://www.si.com/nba/2019/05/20/nba-mock-draft-pelicans-grizzlies-knicks-lakers-zion-williamson-ja-morant-rj-barrett-post-combine?xid=socialflow_twitter_si&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=sinow

I think it makes sense to go White but there is an aspect of Hunter I'm drawn to...but his age really makes me wonder. He was an old sophomore, and he certainly seems athletic. He's not denzel valentine, he can finish around rim.

He could be a really valuable wing if he developed consistently behind 3pt range and playing behind porter would be a really nice play on that.

[Quin]

@Chisoxfn

Quote

 

"Ball intrigues the Bulls as a pass-first, defensive-minded point guard with positional size who can best maximize the talents of Lauri Markkanen, Zach LaVine and Wendell Carter Jr."

"That said, there’s also a feeling that Brogdon is gettable with the right offer, given that the Bucks have multiple free agents to try to re-sign."

"They also plan to add a veteran big man in free agency. But upgrading the point guard position is their first priority."

READ MORE: https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/bulls/ct-spt-bulls-point-guard-nba-draft-trade-free-agency-20190518-story.html

If they legitimately believe they can get Brogdon, they may as well swing for the fences and draft Reddish (assuming Hunter isn't on the board).

Then with the 2nd rounder, try to get some front court depth and get Bazley or Porter. Or in the most ideal world, hope Gafford falls and don't trade him for cash considerations.

[bmags]

14 minutes ago, Quin said:

@Chisoxfn

If they legitimately believe they can get Brogdon, they may as well swing for the fences and draft Reddish (assuming Hunter isn't on the board).

Then with the 2nd rounder, try to get some front court depth and get Bazley or Porter. Or in the most ideal world, hope Gafford falls and don't trade him for cash considerations.

The mock I showed had them getting Grant Williams which I'd be really happy with. Weird draft late, but it had McDaniels, Porter and Williams left, I'd take McDaniels of the 3.

But yes, I would be actually quite happy with Brogdon and one of Hunter/Reddish. I still would be okay with Coby White but not sold he'd be high chance of being a starter, while Hunter Reddish I do think could be at least very valuable rotation guys.

[Chisoxfn]

As Jimmy Bucket's #1 fan, I find it interesting that Boylan and Buckets reportedly had dinner yesterday.  I'm sure it was more the two of them catching up than anything to do with the Bulls making a play to bring Jimmy back.