fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said: Watching Reynaldo Lope makes me feel like I know less about baseball. He's missing a few spots, but for the life of me I cannot understand how his stuff is so easy to hit. He just touched 98, his fastball is like 9 inches of horizontal movement, and he's keeping an 84 mph slider down. I don't get it. Yeah I don't get how hitters don't seem to get fooled more by his change up. Have to wonder if he telegraphs it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwolf68 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Just now, fathom said: No I think he's shown enough progression in terms of maintaining his velocity of late that he should be a starter going forward. He's easily the main guy currently in the rotation that I project to be in it two years from now Rodon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insp Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Engel really didn't even try in that last AB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 My god Yoan is bad right now. Takes two fastballs for strikes, yanks fastball foul, misses changeup by a foot. He continues to pull off everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth05 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Moncada is painful to watch right now.im gonna be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, kwolf68 said: Rodon? Needs to stay healthy and come two full seasons for now, do they look to unload him due to impending free agency? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Just now, TheTruth05 said: Moncada is painful to watch right now.im gonna be honest. When's last time he hit a ball hard to left? He did that a lot last year it seemed. Time for our hitting coach to earn his money with the two main young players in horrible slumps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwolf68 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Just now, fathom said: Needs to stay healthy and come two full seasons for now, do they look to unload him due to impending free agency? Understand. Depends on where the Sox are, where he is. If the Sox are competing for a playoff spot in 2 years it will likely be in part because of him. Do people suspect the Sox will move Rodon because he is risky and a Boras client? The guy has electric stuff. Not sure why I'd want to move that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, fathom said: No I think he's shown enough progression in terms of maintaining his velocity of late that he should be a starter going forward. He's easily the main guy currently in the rotation that I project to be in it two years from now So keeping in mind the pitchers that they have- Dunning, Rodon, Foster, Lopez, Hansen, Giolito, Pilkington, Henzman, Stephens, Kopech, Flores, Battenfield, and Cease- what was the point of your sarcastic line about too much pitching? Just, something to do? Edited June 16, 2018 by soxfan49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: So keeping in mind the pitchers that they have- Dunning, Foster, Lopez, Hansen, Giolito, Henzman, Stephens, Kopech, Flores, Battenfield, and Cease- what was the point of your sarcastic line about too much pitching? Just, something to do? Because of the highly optimistic thread on soxtalk today. And of the guys you mention, I still don't think you can field a 5 man MLB rotation. For or the record, I think the 5 man rotation to start next year consists of Rodon, Lopez, Covey, Dunning and a free agent. They aren't going to promote Kopech until he turns it around. Edited June 16, 2018 by fathom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Palka plays entirely too deep. Not a fan of Lopez having Palka in RF and Omar catching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said: Watching Reynaldo Lope makes me feel like I know less about baseball. He's missing a few spots, but for the life of me I cannot understand how his stuff is so easy to hit. He just touched 98, his fastball is like 9 inches of horizontal movement, and he's keeping an 84 mph slider down. I don't get it. 23 minutes ago, fathom said: No I think he's shown enough progression in terms of maintaining his velocity of late that he should be a starter going forward. He's easily the main guy currently in the rotation that I project to be in it two years from now If Lopez's changeup continues to get hammered like this I do think it is more likely he's a reliever. He could be a damn good one with that fastball/slider combo. Not to say that they shouldn't give him every opportunity to start for the time being. It is kinda weird because Lopez was getting lots of swing and misses on his changeup last season when he was called up. Also, effectiveness of pitches has a lot to do with spin. if he's getting low spin on his fastball 98 looks like 92 to hitters. Spin is everything. Remember Rafael Betancourt, the reliever for the Indians? He threw 91-93 but got tons of swing and misses with fastballs in the zone and out of it because his spin rate was much higher than average. Lopez has worse spin on his fastball than Giolito does, so it isn't surprising that he gets hit. If they could have a "portable trackman" that they could bring with on scouting trips, it could completely change scouting pitchers. It is shocking that teams don't understand how much spin affects a pitcher's effectiveness, even now that they have that data available. Lopez supposedly has great stuff, but he doesn't miss bats enough to justify it. We all have to adjust our perception of what great stuff is. Edited June 16, 2018 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, fathom said: Because of the highly optimistic thread on soxtalk today. And of the guys you mention, I still don't think you can field a 5 man MLB rotation. You can’t field a 5 man rotation with 7 MILB pitchers who are killing it, one top 10 prospect who’s struggling, one top 75 prospect who’s hurt, one high draft pick, one MLB pitcher who’s done well and one MLB pitcher who’s struggled? If that’s the case, every major league baseball team is fucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Timmy with a good defensive game so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: You can’t field a 5 man rotation with 7 MILB pitchers who are killing it, one top 10 prospect who’s struggling, one top 75 prospect who’s hurt, one high draft pick, one MLB pitcher who’s done well and one MLB pitcher who’s struggled? If that’s the case, every major league baseball team is fucked. Both statements are true. Success in the minors =/= success in the majors. You don't know anything about any minor leaguer until they get to MLB. Look at Byron Buxton. Consensus #1, can't hit above .200 for more than 1/2 season. Moncada is struggling, Delmon Young was the consensus top prospect in baseball at one point and he was a below average major leaguer. I guess that the best thing you can say is that the Cubs and Astros got incredibly lucky. Edited June 16, 2018 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: You can’t field a 5 man rotation with 7 MILB pitchers who are killing it, one top 10 prospect who’s struggling, one top 75 prospect who’s hurt, one high draft pick, one MLB pitcher who’s done well and one MLB pitcher who’s struggled? If that’s the case, every major league baseball team is fucked. About half of the guys you mentioned are pretty low ceiling guys though. Henzman, Foster and Flores aren't exactly highly thought of. I like Henzman as a sinker ball reliever though, but doubt he has the velocity to be a starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: Both statements are true. Success in the minors =/= success in the majors. You don't know anything about any minor leaguer until they get to MLB. Look at Byron Buxton. Consensus #1, can't hit above .200 for more than 1/2 season. Moncada is struggling, Delmon Young was the consensus top prospect in baseball at one point and he was a below average major leaguer. I guess that the best thing you can say is that the Cubs and Astros got incredibly lucky. I’m aware of how it works. By no means does a good minor leaguer always turn into a good big leaguer, but when you have a ton of them having success, you’ll likely find 4-5 good ones. The Cubs also traded for Quintana & signed Lester, while Houston traded for Verlander & Cole. I think fans around here just assume the Sox have $0.00 to spend and no minor leaguers to trade one day, almost as if they can’t find a great starter, 2 good ones and 2 OK ones in their current system they’re doomed. The good news is, the Sox have the same access to trades and FA’s as the rest of the MLB does. Awesome concept. Edited June 16, 2018 by soxfan49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: I’m aware of how it works. By no means does a good minor leaguer always turn into a good big leaguer, but when you have a ton of them having success, you’ll likely find 4-5 good ones. I disagree. The Sox are roughly ~20 deep in good to great MLB prospects. If they get 2 all stars, 3 solid MLB regulars and 2-3 bench players/relievers out of the whole group of 20 that is actually an incredible scouting job. If they get 3 or 4 MLB players total, that is average, and if they get 5 MLB players total out of the group that is really good. Scouting hasn't become so accurate that you hit on 50% of these guys, that isn't how it works. If they hit on 30% that is incredible under most circumstances. The fact that the Cubs missed on virtually nobody and the Astros missed on 4-5 guys only is incredible generational luck. Edited June 16, 2018 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I disagree. The Sox are roughly ~20 deep in good to great MLB prospects. If they get 2 all stars, 3 solid MLB regulars and 2-3 bench players/relievers out of the whole group of 20 that is actually an incredible scouting job. If they get 3 or 4 MLB players total, that is average, and if they get 5 MLB players total out of the group that is really good. Scouting hasn't become so accurate that you hit on 50% of these guys, that isn't how it works. If they hit on 30% that is incredible under most circumstances. The fact that the Cubs and Astros didn't miss on anyone really is incredible generational luck. I didn’t say they’d all be great. It sounds like your version of “hit” is a really good pitcher. I said one great, 2 good and 2 that are decent (fourth or fifth starters). I don’t think that’s necessarily out of the question especially with a group so large. Edited June 16, 2018 by soxfan49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: I didn’t say they’d all be great. It sounds like your version of “hit” is a really good pitcher. I said one great, 2 good and 2 that are decent (fourth or fifth starters). I don’t think that’s necessarily out of the question especially with a group so large. Nope. my version of "hit" is very minimal, and that is just sticking on an MLB roster for the entirety of team control. In order to get to your level of expectation, they'd need 15-20 good to great pitching prospects alone, not to mention position players. Roughly 20-30% even on a top 100 list stick at the MLB level. Edited June 16, 2018 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GermanSoxFan Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 I was pretty high on Omar, and when I say high I meant a long term backup catcher, but watching him receive the ball is just painful. He should hope robot umpires will be here soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said: Nope. my version of "hit" is very minimal, and that is just sticking on an MLB roster for the entirety of team control. If their rotation in July 2020 is... Kopech Rodon Cease Hansen Lopez ...you’d be surprised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GermanSoxFan Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, fathom said: Yolmer has been underwhelming defensively at 3rd. Pretty clear he's not the long-term answer there. He has been above average according to all metrics. He plays a better 2B but underwhelming is ridiculous hyperbole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 1 minute ago, GermanSoxFan said: He has been above average according to all metrics. He plays a better 2B but underwhelming is ridiculous hyperbole. I deleted it because I saw the 3rd base comps, which he's improved upon. Almost all his errors have been due to having to speed up, which is likely due to inexperience there. I still stand by my belief they will upgrade there this offseason and I think it's Moustakas or bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Real nice game for Anderson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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