Dam8610 Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 At this point I think it might just be better to get a bunch of Tatis Jr. types (what he was before the Shields trade) than any substantial prospect. Just get five lottery tickets and hope two of them pan out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac9001 Posted June 23, 2018 Share Posted June 23, 2018 48 minutes ago, greg775 said: I know the Sox brought back MiGo but how often do you re-sign a guy like that? Sounds good in theory but ... I'm just saying if you can't get anything except two prospects who probably won't make it, it's insane to trade Abreu. I mean this trade stuff at some point jumps the shark. I do think Hahn will trade him though. If you trade him, the team that gets him is going to get a superstar who can help them win it all THIS YEAR and next. So YES I'm demanding Hahn get at least ONE sure-fire star for him. Preferably 2 sure fire stars and one top 50 guy. That's how it works. Teams overpay for studs who can help them win it all NOW. Why our fans are demanding less from Hahn SLAYS me. Geez some of you are so kind to the front office of the White Sox. How bout if we trade fan favorite/great chemistry guy Abreu we slay some team and acquire studs not duds??????? If Hahn gets organizational fodder for him and not excellence I just wish we'd fire Hahn. The flaw in your logic is they're not getting a stud. There's a reason teams won't offer a significant prospect package for Abreu. Defensively limited 1B/DH types are not that valuable. Add to the he fact he's been down right awful offensively in June and there's nothing particularly exciting about a guy like Abreu right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 On 6/22/2018 at 10:04 PM, wrathofhahn said: It isn't descriptive the reason for that is quite simple when you leave the realm of what happened to what should have happened you move from reflective to predictive. Again, you're just wrong here. What it's measuring has nothing to do with "what should have happened." It is simply stripping parts of run prevention out of pitching and assigning those to defense. It is measuring things that happened, not things that should have happened. It is a descriptive statistic. It is not a predictive model. That's not my opinion, it's a fact. You can hate it all you want, but don't hate it for reasons that aren't true. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 For example, a 1.6 fWAR described Moncada’s performance around the end of April. It obviously didn’t (and couldn’t) predict he would be sitting much closer to 1 than an “extrapolated” 4-5 fWAR just two months later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxmb35 Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 On 6/22/2018 at 6:32 PM, [email protected] said: This sounds a lot like Moncada as well unfortunately. No it doesn't. Ffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WBWSF Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 21 hours ago, greg775 said: I know the Sox brought back MiGo but how often do you re-sign a guy like that? Sounds good in theory but ... I'm just saying if you can't get anything except two prospects who probably won't make it, it's insane to trade Abreu. I mean this trade stuff at some point jumps the shark. I do think Hahn will trade him though. If you trade him, the team that gets him is going to get a superstar who can help them win it all THIS YEAR and next. So YES I'm demanding Hahn get at least ONE sure-fire star for him. Preferably 2 sure fire stars and one top 50 guy. That's how it works. Teams overpay for studs who can help them win it all NOW. Why our fans are demanding less from Hahn SLAYS me. Geez some of you are so kind to the front office of the White Sox. How bout if we trade fan favorite/great chemistry guy Abreu we slay some team and acquire studs not duds??????? If Hahn gets organizational fodder for him and not excellence I just wish we'd fire Hahn. I think Hahns contract runs out at the end of the 2019 season. I would like to think if the team isn't improved next season he won't be renewed. At least I hope not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 Why does greg think “slay” is a hip word 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 3 hours ago, Kyyle23 said: Why does greg think “slay” is a hip word Because Greg is a hipster. You know, like the guy in clueless. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 8 hours ago, WBWSF said: I think Hahns contract runs out at the end of the 2019 season. I would like to think if the team isn't improved next season he won't be renewed. At least I hope not. If Hahn or KW had their jobs riding on team performance, they would have been fired long ago. Until JR no longer owns the team, this is the front office the Sox will be working with. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 On 6/23/2018 at 7:28 PM, greg775 said: If that's all you can get, Hahn should be fired for trading him. On the spot. It's not like the Sox are spending any money this season. If that's all there is for an all star why trade him? Dumb. Well he is also over 30 years old and has just two years left and he isn't super cheap either. Regarding the 1b are easy to find this is also partly true albeit abreu is a 70 hitter (playing more like a 65 due to low walks) while most of the cheap sluggers are 40 to 45 bats (240-250, sometimes worse). But he still of course is a 31 yo bad glove first baseman with two years of contract even though his bat is elite (current abreu bat is probably the ceiling of top sox prospects eloy and robert). Getting a top100 and a nice filler would be good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 hours ago, [email protected] said: Well he is also over 30 years old and has just two years left and he isn't super cheap either. Regarding the 1b are easy to find this is also partly true albeit abreu is a 70 hitter (playing more like a 65 due to low walks) while most of the cheap sluggers are 40 to 45 bats (240-250, sometimes worse). But he still of course is a 31 yo bad glove first baseman with two years of contract even though his bat is elite (current abreu bat is probably the ceiling of top sox prospects eloy and robert). Getting a top100 and a nice filler would be good. 2014 Abreu is closer to what most expect from Jimenez... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 Considering Jose had his predictably worse 1st half of the season, I think we can kill the idea of him having any decent trade value. His OPS is below .800 at this point. For a guy in the wrong side of 30, I don't see any team giving up much of value for him. It a frustrating his stats are always clearly worse in the 1st half of the season. Does nothing but tank his trade value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Hot FiRe said: Considering Jose had his predictably worse 1st half of the season, I think we can kill the idea of him having any decent trade value. His OPS is below .800 at this point. For a guy in the wrong side of 30, I don't see any team giving up much of value for him. It a frustrating his stats are always clearly worse in the 1st half of the season. Does nothing but tank his trade value. The only thing more consistent than your irrational Abreu hate is Abreu proving you wrong each and every time. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 16 hours ago, maxjusttyped said: If Hahn or KW had their jobs riding on team performance, they would have been fired long ago. Until JR no longer owns the team, this is the front office the Sox will be working with. Lol - ohhhhh, I think we can safely say "jobs riding on team performance" isn't the case with this particular owner. Williams and Hahn have been 1-2/2-1 atop the White Sox front office for 18 years now. If you take the one clear outlier year (2005) out of the mix and look at the other 17 years they've been at the helm of this thing, you'll see just one trip to the postseason in those 17 years. Just one, and that year they needed 163 games to just barely squeak into the playoffs. And then of course the playoff appearance was ever so brief, with only four games played and only one game won. That's the performance those two have rendered for 17 of their 18 years as the men in charge. As has been mentioned on this board many times, such futility would have cost them their jobs a long time ago. But not with this owner for some reason. Maybe they laugh at all of his jokes so he likes to keep them around for that. Who knows? How else can you explain their continued employment in their current roles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 5 hours ago, Hot FiRe said: Considering Jose had his predictably worse 1st half of the season, I think we can kill the idea of him having any decent trade value. His OPS is below .800 at this point. For a guy in the wrong side of 30, I don't see any team giving up much of value for him. It a frustrating his stats are always clearly worse in the 1st half of the season. Does nothing but tank his trade value. Some of you guys are so demanding. The grass is always greener with other team's players. Abreu probably had a shitty half cause the team reeked. Always blame the player, right? Even a proven veteran. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, greg775 said: Some of you guys are so demanding. The grass is always greener with other team's players. Abreu probably had a shitty half cause the team reeked. Always blame the player, right? Even a proven veteran. Go take a look at his 1st half vs 2nd half stats. He is regularly a worse 1st half player. You can't argue otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 hours ago, Dam8610 said: The only thing more consistent than your irrational Abreu hate is Abreu proving you wrong each and every time. So he isn't a worse 1st half player? You know, the time when a player can help his team in a playoff race and/or build his trade value for a midseason trade to a contender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 35 minutes ago, Hot FiRe said: So he isn't a worse 1st half player? You know, the time when a player can help his team in a playoff race and/or build his trade value for a midseason trade to a contender Your hatred of Abreu is weird. There's not been a more consistently supurb White Sox player the first four years of a career. Yes he's gonna have to amp it up if he hopes to be as productive this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, greg775 said: Your hatred of Abreu is weird. There's not been a more consistently supurb White Sox player the first four years of a career. Yes he's gonna have to amp it up if he hopes to be as productive this year. He doesn't HATE Abreu. Nobody does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: He doesn't HATE Abreu. Nobody does. Ask HotFire how he'd describe his feelings toward Abreu. It sure seems like hate to me. He thinks he's useless basically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 At his point I think it is pretty unlikely that Abreu gets traded unless we receive an above market offer. The team does need veteran leadership moving forward and I think he is worth more to our organization than what other clubs would be willing to offer in a trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 52 minutes ago, steveno89 said: At his point I think it is pretty unlikely that Abreu gets traded unless we receive an above market offer. The team does need veteran leadership moving forward and I think he is worth more to our organization than what other clubs would be willing to offer in a trade. If he continues to struggle then I agree. At this point you aren't getting Alvarez (Houston) for him. He needs to heat up now, and he's running out of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, cjgalloway said: If he continues to struggle then I agree. At this point you aren't getting Alvarez (Houston) for him. He needs to heat up now, and he's running out of time. If I'm the Astros, Tucker, Whitley and even Alvarez are off the table at this point in trades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, steveno89 said: If I'm the Astros, Tucker, Whitley and even Alvarez are off the table at this point in trades. If we don't get something of decent value back, there's not much reason to move him. If we're that desperate for money, he doesn't have to be tendered a contract next offseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 The Yanks are getting horrible production out of Bird. I wonder if they would have interest in Abreu. The Yanks look to be a bit heavy on right handed hitters but Abreu would be a huge improvement over Bird. With Judge and Stanton occupying the corner outfield spots for many years to come they might be wiling to part with Clint Frazier who was just optioned to AAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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