Sarah Sanders denied food

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, greg775 said:

So Balta, will you go on the record saying you wish Trump to fail? I think that's sort of un-American if that's your answer. At least Greg answers questions the best he can directly. A lot of you guys hit me with one liners, win the current argument, and we wait for the next one. I wish more people would post on here. I think a lot of people understand my sentiments but stifle.

At everything he cares about, yes, because everything he cares about makes this country a worse place. 

[LittleHurt05]

8 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

They didn’t take them away, lol.

There were those families who fell between cracks....mostly upper middle class/small business or independent contractors...whose rates went up quite dramatically.

 https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/01/01/middle-class-workers-struggle-to-pay-for-care-despite-insurance/19841235/

But the number aren’t close to the tens of millions who are going to be demonstrably worse off NOW, including those with pre-existing conditions.  Sure, they can buy the cheapest bare bones policies that actually cover nothing, but, hey...they’re covered.  Except not really.

 

Basically, the priority of the GOP is protecting the upper middle class and elites and screwing over the middle class, lower middle class and poor people.  We can give away a trillion in tax cuts to corporations, and increase defense spending by over $80 billion, but no.

If they wanted to close that donut hole or loophole, they easily could have used the money from either line item.

So if the GOP can just give away stuff for free with no concern for fiscal consequences or our future grandchildren, why can’t we just have Medicare for All and cut out the insurance industry altogether...and negotiate for better drug prices as well?   It’s actually quite simple, it’s all about priorities.

I had benefits and hospital access taken away. Not priced out of my range, just taken away and not available to me or my family. 

[caulfield12]

26 minutes ago, LittleHurt05 said:

I had benefits and hospital access taken away. Not priced out of my range, just taken away and not available to me or my family. 

And what is the Trump administration doing today to fix that loophole?

 

‘INSURANCE FOR EVERYBODY’

Before he was sworn in, President Trump made a bold promise: The as-yet-unreleased Obamacare repeal and replacement plan would have “insurance for everybody.” 

“We’re going to have insurance for everybody,” Trump said in an interview with The Washington Post. “There was a philosophy in some circles that if you can’t pay for it, you don’t get it. That’s not going to happen with us.” 

While House Republicans and the White House have indicated repealing and replacing Obamacare may take multiple legislative steps, the bill currently on the table would not meet Trump’s pledge. Per the CBO’s score, 14 million people would immediately lose coverage, a number that would eventually rise to 24 million over the next 10 years.

...

EVERYBODY’S GOING TO BE TAKEN CARE OF’

Trump has made other, more vague promises about the repeal-and-replace endgame. 

As he campaigned for the White House that he declared in an interview with CBS’ “60 Minutes”: “I am going to take care of everybody … Everybody’s going to be taken care of much better than they’re taken care of now.” More recently, Trump has promised that repeal will end with “a beautiful picture.” 

Both of these pledges are harder to quantify — but judging by early reactions to the legislation from liberals, some conservatives and others, it will be difficult to ensure.

[illinilaw08]

35 minutes ago, greg775 said:

So Balta, will you go on the record saying you wish Trump to fail? I think that's sort of un-American if that's your answer. At least Greg answers questions the best he can directly. A lot of you guys hit me with one liners, win the current argument, and we wait for the next one. I wish more people would post on here. I think a lot of people understand my sentiments but stifle.

Greg, here's what you need to be able to distinguish between.  I can both hope that America itself does not fail, and also hope like crazy that Donald Trump's un-American policies fail.

Here's the point - I can't speak for Balta, but I strongly believe that a lot of Donald Trump's policies undermine the very best parts about America historically (or at least of the American ideal) - that we are a melting pot of cultures, that Americans do the right thing even when that is a difficult decision to make, that when history shakes out who are the good guys, and who are the bad guys, that America is not the baddies.*  

The success of many of Donald Trump's policies is a failure of that ideal of America.  Separating children from their parents when they claim asylum.  Lying constantly.  Using his Twitter account to attack private citizens and businesses.  Cozying up to authoritarians while harming our allies.  Making racially divisive comments because it makes his base happy.  And I can go on.  Blind loyalty to the President's policies is the anti-thesis of being American.  

* There are a lot of historical examples of how America has failed in living up to those ideals, but not ripe for this discussion.

[illinilaw08]

46 minutes ago, LittleHurt05 said:

I had benefits and hospital access taken away. Not priced out of my range, just taken away and not available to me or my family. 

So that I am clear, you had an insurance policy that provided access to certain benefits and certain hospitals.  After the ACA, that policy was cancelled and no policies were offered - anywhere at any price - that provided those benefits, or covered those hospitals?  Or am I misreading your post?

[greg775]

1 hour ago, LittleHurt05 said:

I had benefits and hospital access taken away. Not priced out of my range, just taken away and not available to me or my family. 

Sorry Hurt, I feel your pain and wonder how you are getting by without health insurance.

I tell you, this double crossing B.S. regarding health care is why I've given up. I want Bernie and want him now to make it free for all. Health care has jumped the shark. Even if you have coverage, good luck not going in the poorhouse. For instance, I'd love to hear from folks whose wives have just had a baby. For those of you with good plans, tell me how much you paid out of pocket for said baby. Years ago, you were covered; baby is basically free, full 100 percent coverage. Now? Good luck. Also lets say a boomer who is living check to check has coverage at work yet he gets a condition that keeps him hospitalized 3 weeks and out of work 3 months. Hmmm, will boomer and his family have to hit the streets?

[greg775]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

At everything he cares about, yes, because everything he cares about makes this country a worse place. 

Not a bad answer. Not bad at all.

But generally speaking ... let's say under his regime we have unprecedented economic success. Do you want him to succeed in that regard? For general prosperity of the USA? Or do you want a recession/depression so he gets blamed and ousted? I'm saying I want the prosperity but still would want him out after 4 years for Bernie cause his stance on health care won't be changing.

Edited June 27, 2018 by greg775

[greg775]

31 minutes ago, illinilaw08 said:

Greg, here's what you need to be able to distinguish between.  I can both hope that America itself does not fail, and also hope like crazy that Donald Trump's un-American policies fail.

Here's the point - I can't speak for Balta, but I strongly believe that a lot of Donald Trump's policies undermine the very best parts about America historically (or at least of the American ideal) - that we are a melting pot of cultures, that Americans do the right thing even when that is a difficult decision to make, that when history shakes out who are the good guys, and who are the bad guys, that America is not the baddies.*  

 The success of many of Donald Trump's policies is a failure of that ideal of America.  Separating children from their parents when they claim asylum.  Lying constantly.  Using his Twitter account to attack private citizens and businesses.  Cozying up to authoritarians while harming our allies.  Making racially divisive comments because it makes his base happy.  And I can go on.  Blind loyalty to the President's policies is the anti-thesis of being American.  

* There are a lot of historical examples of how America has failed in living up to those ideals, but not ripe for this discussion.

Not a bad post. You don't want America to fail so in my mind that's good.

[Dick Allen]

5 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Not a bad answer. Not bad at all.

But generally speaking ... let's say under his regime we have unprecedented economic success. Do you want him to succeed in that regard? For general prosperity of the USA? Or do you want a recession/depression so he gets blamed and ousted? I'm saying I want the prosperity but still would want him out after 4 years for Bernie cause his stance on health care won't be changing.

The stock market was 152 points away, one decent day, from tripling under Obama’s presidency. Yet, according to the right he was one of the worst presidents of all time. 

There will most likely be a recession under Trump. That is just historical odds. How bad it will be is the question. Trump has everyone believing the election he won by having over 3 million less votes than his opponent was a historic landslide victory. It really wasn’t. Personally, I think dems need to win some of these midterms or he will go unchecked for a couple more years due to republicans being scared of him. But the next presidential election is going to come down to MI,WI, OH, FL, just like this last one. I just hope dems have a candidate who can relate and flip those states. 

I think  Bill Maher is a little out there on several things. But I agree with him on at least one thing. If Trump loses the next election, getting him out of the White Hiuse is going to be a tall task. He won’t voluntarily leave. He was already calling the last election a fraud and he won. Things might be really ugly in January 2021.

[Balta1701]

Just now, greg775 said:

Not a bad answer. Not bad at all.

But generally speaking ... let's say under his regime we have unprecedented economic success. Do you want him to succeed in that regard? For general prosperity of the USA? Or do you want a recession/depression so he gets blamed and ousted? I'm saying I want the prosperity.

No I don't particularly want another depression, the last one was not particularly fun. However, a recently passed law once again deregulating the banking industry should help make sure we have another collapse soon enough.

[greg775]

2 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

The stock market was 152 points away, one decent day, from tripling under Obama’s presidency. Yet, according to the right he was one of the worst presidents of all time. 

There will most likely be a recession under Trump. That is just historical odds. How bad it will be is the question. Trump has everyone believing the election he won by having over 3 million less votes than his opponent was a historic landslide victory. It really wasn’t. Personally, I think dems need to win some of these midterms or he will go unchecked for a couple more years due to republicans being scared of him. But the next presidential election is going to come down to MI,WI, OH, FL, just like this last one. I just hope dems have a candidate who can relate and flip those states. 

I think  Bill Maher is a little out there on several things. But I agree with him on at least one thing. If Trump loses the next election, getting him out of the White Hiuse is going to be a tall task. He won’t voluntarily leave. He was already calling the last election a fraud and he won. Things might be really ugly in January 2021.

With his ego, all he's got to do is wait and find out who the leading Democratic contender is and if he's told it's obvious he doesn't stand a chance, he won't run again IMO. Now if the experts tell him it's 50/50 and he has a chance, damn.

[Balta1701]

Just now, greg775 said:

With his ego, all he's got to do is wait and find out who the leading Democratic contender is and if he's told it's obvious he doesn't stand a chance, he won't run again IMO. Now if the experts tell him it's 50/50 and he has a chance, damn.

LOL of course he's running he's already declared himself to be a candidate and he has an entire country willing to commit crimes on US Soil to support him, and they've used the Supreme Court and state governments to make it extremely difficult for people who might vote against him to actually do so.

[illinilaw08]

26 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Not a bad answer. Not bad at all.

But generally speaking ... let's say under his regime we have unprecedented economic success. Do you want him to succeed in that regard? For general prosperity of the USA? Or do you want a recession/depression so he gets blamed and ousted? I'm saying I want the prosperity but still would want him out after 4 years for Bernie cause his stance on health care won't be changing.

Greg, here's the problem with that line of thinking.

Under your logic, no matter what the President does, we should root for him because the economy is all that matters.

Slavery?  Doesn't matter - tell me about the economy.

Jim Crow laws? Doesn't matter - tell me about the economy.

Internment of Japanese-Americans in the name of national security?  Doesn't matter - tell me about the economy.

When the impact on your pocketbook is the only thing that matters to you, it's easy to look the other way when other American's rights are trampled.  I hope that Donald Trump fails miserably in trampling on the rights of other Americans.

Edit to add: The slavery point is actually the best example here.  When you don't have to pay your labor anything for the work that they do, the economy booms.  In the first hundred years of our country, the South had unprecedented economic success using that model.  But it was based on morally repugnant policy and, therefore, the right thing to do is to root against that immoral and evil policy, even if it hurts some people's pocketbooks.

Edited June 28, 2018 by illinilaw08

[caulfield12]

Or economic slavery...

The middle class used to be able to provide a decent future to their children, often with just one parent working.

How often is that true today?

The SC ruling today is one more nail in the coffin to all of the power going away from labor and to the exclusive benefit of corporations/CEO’s/shareholders.

If you don’t own stock, you simply don’t exist.  You’re worthless, a nobody.   Your Congressman won’t ten because you can’t afford to make a donation.

[greg775]

3 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

LOL of course he's running he's already declared himself to be a candidate and he has an entire country willing to commit crimes on US Soil to support him, and they've used the Supreme Court and state governments to make it extremely difficult for people who might vote against him to actually do so.

You wait. He won't run. He'll either be long gone via impeachment or just decide he's ready to count his money and golf every day.

[greg775]

3 hours ago, illinilaw08 said:

Greg, here's the problem with that line of thinking.

Under your logic, no matter what the President does, we should root for him because the economy is all that matters.

Slavery?  Doesn't matter - tell me about the economy.

Jim Crow laws? Doesn't matter - tell me about the economy.

Internment of Japanese-Americans in the name of national security?  Doesn't matter - tell me about the economy.

When the impact on your pocketbook is the only thing that matters to you, it's easy to look the other way when other American's rights are trampled.  I hope that Donald Trump fails miserably in trampling on the rights of other Americans.

Edit to add: The slavery point is actually the best example here.  When you don't have to pay your labor anything for the work that they do, the economy booms.  In the first hundred years of our country, the South had unprecedented economic success using that model.  But it was based on morally repugnant policy and, therefore, the right thing to do is to root against that immoral and evil policy, even if it hurts some people's pocketbooks.

I won't change my opinion. I dislike Trump and feel he's very evil. But I have to be selfish here. I want him to succeed if it means I'm not homeless someday. Democrats and Republicans alike don't care about the middle class and poor. Social security is dying; medicare/medicaid is dying and of course health care is the biggest scam ever and is preparing to bankrupt all Americans in the middle to poor class.

[LittleHurt05]

6 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

And what is the Trump administration doing today to fix that loophole?

 

‘INSURANCE FOR EVERYBODY’

Before he was sworn in, President Trump made a bold promise: The as-yet-unreleased Obamacare repeal and replacement plan would have “insurance for everybody.” 

“We’re going to have insurance for everybody,” Trump said in an interview with The Washington Post. “There was a philosophy in some circles that if you can’t pay for it, you don’t get it. That’s not going to happen with us.” 

While House Republicans and the White House have indicated repealing and replacing Obamacare may take multiple legislative steps, the bill currently on the table would not meet Trump’s pledge. Per the CBO’s score, 14 million people would immediately lose coverage, a number that would eventually rise to 24 million over the next 10 years.

...

EVERYBODY’S GOING TO BE TAKEN CARE OF’

Trump has made other, more vague promises about the repeal-and-replace endgame. 

As he campaigned for the White House that he declared in an interview with CBS’ “60 Minutes”: “I am going to take care of everybody … Everybody’s going to be taken care of much better than they’re taken care of now.” More recently, Trump has promised that repeal will end with “a beautiful picture.” 

Both of these pledges are harder to quantify — but judging by early reactions to the legislation from liberals, some conservatives and others, it will be difficult to ensure.

I never said anything about Trump, he was never part of this discussion.

[LittleHurt05]

6 hours ago, illinilaw08 said:

So that I am clear, you had an insurance policy that provided access to certain benefits and certain hospitals.  After the ACA, that policy was cancelled and no policies were offered - anywhere at any price - that provided those benefits, or covered those hospitals?  Or am I misreading your post?

Exactly.  The ACA took away coverage from the hospital I preferred in my area, there were suddenly zero plans available, no matter my price range.

[illinilaw08]

10 hours ago, greg775 said:

I won't change my opinion. I dislike Trump and feel he's very evil. But I have to be selfish here. I want him to succeed if it means I'm not homeless someday. Democrats and Republicans alike don't care about the middle class and poor. Social security is dying; medicare/medicaid is dying and of course health care is the biggest scam ever and is preparing to bankrupt all Americans in the middle to poor class.

Democrats favor strengthening the social safety net - no cuts to social security or Medicare, expanding health care access (Medicare for All is definitely more than just Bernie Sanders, Greg).  Shoot, there are politicians and policy experts on the left that favor a Universal Basic Income - ie, if you are an American citizen, you are guaranteed a certain amount of money annually.  There's money to do this stuff, but it requires reducing the amount of money that we spend on the military, or it requires raising taxes on high earners.

If you are worried about what happens if you lose your job and can't find another one, one party definitely has policies that are intended to cushion your fall (that's the Democrats).  The other party wants you to pull yourself up by your bootstraps while giving massive tax breaks to companies - tax breaks that end up benefiting shareholders far more than benefiting labor. 

[illinilaw08]

8 hours ago, LittleHurt05 said:

Exactly.  The ACA took away coverage from the hospital I preferred in my area, there were suddenly zero plans available, no matter my price range.

So that hospital no longer accepted insurance period?  

[LittleHurt05]

14 hours ago, illinilaw08 said:

So that hospital no longer accepted insurance period?  

It no longer accepted any insurance I was eligible to purchase as an individual.

[Brian]

I'm not calling you a liar but that doesn't sound right. Was it an HMO or something? What insurance company?

I've had to deal with insurance companies through various medical adventures and I find the insurance companies more bogus than the actual hospitals.

[BigSqwert]

9 hours ago, LittleHurt05 said:

It no longer accepted any insurance I was eligible to purchase as an individual.

Which hospital is this?

[southsider2k5]

I don't know what hospital or his situation, but there are definitely systems and locations that refuse to accept medicare, medicate and ACA plans.  Their cost structure versus what the plans will reimburse, plus the length of time those payments take to flow back from the plans to the health providers are all huge reasons that providers refuse to accept patients with those plans.

[greg775]

On 6/28/2018 at 8:59 AM, illinilaw08 said:

Democrats favor strengthening the social safety net - no cuts to social security or Medicare, expanding health care access (Medicare for All is definitely more than just Bernie Sanders, Greg).  Shoot, there are politicians and policy experts on the left that favor a Universal Basic Income - ie, if you are an American citizen, you are guaranteed a certain amount of money annually.  There's money to do this stuff, but it requires reducing the amount of money that we spend on the military, or it requires raising taxes on high earners.

If you are worried about what happens if you lose your job and can't find another one, one party definitely has policies that are intended to cushion your fall (that's the Democrats).  The other party wants you to pull yourself up by your bootstraps while giving massive tax breaks to companies - tax breaks that end up benefiting shareholders far more than benefiting labor. 

I may have to change to Democrat then. Hopefully the Millenials will take care of this and get in the people who want to give us all free stuff. I tried the other way. I'm fed up with the corruption in SS and health care and cuts cuts cuts that hurt the middle class and poor. The way I see it is they had their chance the old way. Now it's give me stuff and give it to me ASAP. Too many crooks out there taking advantage of me and millions of other folks who just want to live a good life.