Trade Deadline

[Balta1701]

8 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Luis Ortiz or Lucas Erceg and Jean Carmona. Neither are top 100 guys, but they are the Brewers #3. #4 and #15 according to MLB pipeline. I'd target Corey Ray, but the Sox are so loaded in the OF they don't need him. Erceg would be nice because it would give the Sox a decent 3B prospect. 

Erceg has whopping .663 OPS at AA this year as a 23 year old. Ortiz hasn't been great but he's a year younger at the same level, and at least not that disappointing.

[Chicago White Sox]

37 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Would have to be something like Luis Ortiz as the key piece.

 

33 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Luis Ortiz or Lucas Erceg and Jean Carmona. Neither are top 100 guys, but they are the Brewers #3. #4 and #15 according to MLB pipeline. I'd target Corey Ray, but the Sox are so loaded in the OF they don't need him. Erceg would be nice because it would give the Sox a decent 3B prospect. 

The guy I would target would be Kristen Lutz.  He’s not a top 100 guy by most publications (only FG I believe), but was the 34th overall pick in the 2017 draft.  I know we don’t need more outfielders, but IMO our goal from here on out should be acquiring the most impactful talent possible regardless of position.  The reality is a lot of the guys in the lower levels will ultimately become trade chips and Lutz has a chance to improve his prospect stock significantly in the coming years.

I’d be good with Ortiz being the return and Erceg has always intrigued me, but I do wonder if the Brewers would rather hold onto to those guys given their proximity to the majors.  The good thing about Lutz is he’s a good three years away if not longer.  He doesn’t really fit their window like those other two might, especially Ortiz.

[Heads22]

Only if Erceg is on the same team as Dunning

[SoxAce]

3 minutes ago, Heads22 said:

Only if Erceg is on the same team as Dunning

Can you imagine the Barons clubhouse with those two?  (although Dunning is injured right now so...)

Edited July 4, 2018 by SoxAce

[greg775]

Folks, you are only getting scraps for Yolmer. He's just another guy. That said, I do respect him and even worship him at times as a member of the Sox. But he's just another guy on a horrid team if that makes any sense. Greg gives Yolmer an A. Baseball yawns and says, "Why the hell do you think we need Yolmer?"

[GGajewski18]

1 hour ago, greg775 said:

Folks, you are only getting scraps for Yolmer. He's just another guy. That said, I do respect him and even worship him at times as a member of the Sox. But he's just another guy on a horrid team if that makes any sense. Greg gives Yolmer an A. Baseball yawns and says, "Why the hell do you think we need Yolmer?"

False.  You would not get scraps for Yolmer.  He's an average hitter that can play above average defense anywhere in the infield with 3.5 years of control.  

The Sox even got a decent piece for an aged, expensive Melky Cabrera. AJ Puckett would be in the AA rotation right now if he were healthy and is only 23 years old. 

[BlackSox13]

1 hour ago, greg775 said:

Folks, you are only getting scraps for Yolmer. He's just another guy. That said, I do respect him and even worship him at times as a member of the Sox. But he's just another guy on a horrid team if that makes any sense. Greg gives Yolmer an A. Baseball yawns and says, "Why the hell do you think we need Yolmer?"

And there ya have it folks. Straight from the self proclaimed baseball aficionado himself. 

[oldsox]

1 hour ago, BlackSox13 said:

And there ya have it folks. Straight from the self proclaimed baseball aficionado himself. 

Greg is right 

[fathom]

1 hour ago, BlackSox13 said:

And there ya have it folks. Straight from the self proclaimed baseball aficionado himself. 

With all due respect to Greg, if he doesn't know who the Cubs first baseman is, how could he even start to predict how much trade value anyone has around the league?

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, GGajewski18 said:

False.  You would not get scraps for Yolmer.  He's an average hitter that can play above average defense anywhere in the infield with 3.5 years of control.  

The Sox even got a decent piece for an aged, expensive Melky Cabrera. AJ Puckett would be in the AA rotation right now if he were healthy and is only 23 years old. 

Is this the same Yolmer with nine or 10 errors already? I think he's a decent player, a good sub playing once or twice a week on a solid team...nothing more in my opinion.

[fathom]

1 minute ago, Lip Man 1 said:

Is this the same Yolmer with nine or 10 errors already? I think he's a decent player, a good sub playing once or twice a week on a solid team...nothing more in my opinion.

Unfortunately he's nothing special defensively at 3rd. I'm sure other teams would potentially put him at 2nd where his glove is much, much better.

[BlackSox13]

1 hour ago, oldsox said:

Greg is right 

No, he's not. So there.

[Balta1701]

If you only get scraps for him, F*** it, we have him for 3 more seasons, don't trade him until someone gives us something of use for him.

[BlackSox13]

1 hour ago, fathom said:

With all due respect to Greg, if he doesn't know who the Cubs first baseman is, how could he even start to predict how much trade value anyone has around the league?

Yep. I agree fathom. Granted Yolmer is a very lite hitting third baseman but he has plenty of value defensively and still sporting a +.700 OPS. His defensive versatility adds to his value. 

It's funny how a fan can type that post when they admittedly doesn't know much about his teams farm system and yet proclaims Sanchez has fodder trade return value and is a baseball aficionado that loves the statnik.

[BlackSox13]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

If you only get scraps for him, F*** it, we have him for 3 more seasons, don't trade him until someone gives us something of use for him.

Exactly. I'm not saying the Sox should trade Yolmer but to say he has fodder value is ridiculous. As I said a few days ago, I would hate to trade Yolmer but if the return makes sense then I'm game.

[greg775]

16 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said:

Yep. I agree fathom. Granted Yolmer is a very lite hitting third baseman but he has plenty of value defensively and still sporting a +.700 OPS. His defensive versatility adds to his value. 

It's funny how a fan can type that post when they admittedly doesn't know much about his teams farm system and yet proclaims Sanchez has fodder trade return value and is a baseball aficionado that loves the statnik.

I said I like him a lot, but he has little to no trade value. He's a proud White Sox but he is just another guy. To be clear, I love the guy.

[black jack]

8 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

If you only get scraps for him, F*** it, we have him for 3 more seasons, don't trade him until someone gives us something of use for him.

 

 

I'll expand.  

How about keeping him until someone actually beats him out for a position?  He's a 26 year old 3 War player that is very popular in the clubhouse.  

Imo, he's a super-sub when this team is winning divisions. 

 

 

Another opinion:  Avi stays long term.  This cat has figured it out and is now a foundation player.

 

[Balta1701]

3 minutes ago, black jack said:

Another opinion:  Avi stays long term.  This cat has figured it out and is now a foundation player.

 

After what we saw last offseason, keeping Avisail Garcia long term may not be nearly as expensive as once feared, which means there's no benefit to the White Sox to even talk about such things right now. He could wind up getting Moustakas money, which is a pittance.

[black jack]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

After what we saw last offseason, keeping Avisail Garcia long term may not be nearly as expensive as once feared, which means there's no benefit to the White Sox to even talk about such things right now. He could wind up getting Moustakas money, which is a pittance.

One more year of arbitration left right? 

[Chicago White Sox]

24 minutes ago, black jack said:

 

 

I'll expand.  

How about keeping him until someone actually beats him out for a position?  He's a 26 year old 3 War player that is very popular in the clubhouse.  

Imo, he's a super-sub when this team is winning divisions. 

 

 

Another opinion:  Avi stays long term.  This cat has figured it out and is now a foundation player.

 

Here’s the way I see it.  The infield is going to get super crowded in the next couple years.  Madrigal should move fast and should be ready by the start of 2020.  At that point Yolmer becomes a super-utility guy which is valuable, but will likely not be our most pressing need at that time.  He’s also going to be much more expensive by then.  That doesn’t mean we should automatically dump him, but if there is a team that sees him as a young, versatile 3 WAR infielder with three years of control and is willing to pay for him as such, we’d be crazy not to consider it.  Ultimately anything we can get for Yolmer can be used as part of a package to add a cost-controlled impact talent.  Again, I really like Yolmer, but selling high on him at this point in the rebuild represents better utilization of our assets IMO.

[southsider2k5]

Yolmer Sanchez is really close to a league average hitter (94 RC+ in both 17 and 18, 98 OPS+ in both 17 and 18, and a league neutral fielder at 3B, along with being able to slide into both 2B and SS without hurting his team. As of today is a 1.0 fWAR player.

If he was playing about 8 miles further north, the whole world would be drooling over Yolmer.

[bmags]

I'm curious how people define what is good value for a player like Yolmer vs. scraps.

It's easy for me when we have a top player going to the market, I want top 50 prospects. And for a good player/good contract, I want a top 100.

But for players like Yolmer, as a fan, I have no idea what he would get back. My hunch is that, unlike relievers at the deadline, teams would often view a decent hitting versatile infielder as a nice to have, but not a need to have.

For that I don't see the return being that good, or little leverage.

For me, I can only judge a return based on player type. It wasn't my favorite strategy last year, but I at least understood the using of assets to give ML-ready, slightly below average but blocked prospects such as gillaspie and cordell time in ML to see if there's something there.

With 3.5 years control left and still young, Sanchez is already basically that. Instead I'd prefer younger players with some elite tools. Though unlikely they ever make an impact as good as Yolmer

Brewers example, I would have trouble saying we got scraps if we acquired position players such as Je'Von Ward and Carlos Rodriguez.

I'd err on the same side for pitching, but I think I'd also make the case for going after like Medeiros and Zack Brown, players with success in AA but profiles that say they are more likely bullpen. Get them here where we have more leeway to grow them as starters.

Anyway point is these are backend top 30 guys from Brewers. Is that scraps? I don't know. I'd feel fine not trading sanchez for some of them, but I'd also understood if they were.

[Chicago White Sox]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Yolmer Sanchez is really close to a league average hitter (94 RC+ in both 17 and 18, 98 OPS+ in both 17 and 18, and a league neutral fielder at 3B, along with being able to slide into both 2B and SS without hurting his team. As of today is a 1.0 fWAR player.

If he was playing about 8 miles further north, the whole world would be drooling over Yolmer.

And I know he hasn’t been awesome this year at 3B, but I truly believe the ability is there to be a plus defender at the hot corner.  And he’s most definitely a plus defender at 2B.  He’s a guy Joe Maddon would love to have on his roster and those reasons apply for most NL teams where versatility is extremely valuable.  I really think there will be teams interested in him.

[Chicago White Sox]

6 minutes ago, bmags said:

I'm curious how people define what is good value for a player like Yolmer vs. scraps.

It's easy for me when we have a top player going to the market, I want top 50 prospects. And for a good player/good contract, I want a top 100.

But for players like Yolmer, as a fan, I have no idea what he would get back. My hunch is that, unlike relievers at the deadline, teams would often view a decent hitting versatile infielder as a nice to have, but not a need to have.

For that I don't see the return being that good, or little leverage.

For me, I can only judge a return based on player type. It wasn't my favorite strategy last year, but I at least understood the using of assets to give ML-ready, slightly below average but blocked prospects such as gillaspie and cordell time in ML to see if there's something there.

With 3.5 years control left and still young, Sanchez is already basically that. Instead I'd prefer younger players with some elite tools. Though unlikely they ever make an impact as good as Yolmer

Brewers example, I would have trouble saying we got scraps if we acquired position players such as Je'Von Ward and Carlos Rodriguez.

I'd err on the same side for pitching, but I think I'd also make the case for going after like Medeiros and Zack Brown, players with success in AA but profiles that say they are more likely bullpen. Get them here where we have more leeway to grow them as starters.

Anyway point is these are backend top 30 guys from Brewers. Is that scraps? I don't know. I'd feel fine not trading sanchez for some of them, but I'd also understood if they were.

Your points are all very fair.  I don’t think a team will automatically pay what we may deem fair value simply because Yolmer is versatile.  I think you need a team like Milwaukee that is desperate for an everyday middle infield solution and sees Yolmer as a possible 2B solution for the next +3 years.  Then you hope Sanche’s versatility becomes a differentiator and makes him more attractive than other potential options.

[Baker]

You can guesstimate trade value. 3+ years of 2 WAR player is about 7 WAR controllable. A dependable and versatile infielder perhaps a little more. A back-end Top 100 prospect is only worth 3-4 WAR controllable over six years. In the Brewers case that would equate to Ecreg + Ortiz for Yolmer.