whitesoxbrad Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Can someone tell me what baseball background Rick hahn has , he is the general mgr. he is making the major decisions, I am having a tough time figuring out how he is qualified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 He used to babysit one of Reinsdorf's grandkids. The rest is history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 4 minutes ago, whitesoxbrad said: Can someone tell me what baseball background Rick hahn has , he is the general mgr. he is making the major decisions, I am having a tough time figuring out how he is qualified. He probably had just as much of a baseball background as any of us did when the White Sox hired him. All of us think we have all the answers. Obviously his moves when they were trying to win, didn’t produce wins. We will see how this change of direction goes, but at some point, you have to figure good results should be a qualification for him to remain employed in his current position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 He never wore a varsity jacket and therefore is unequivocally unqualified for the job. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 As of 8/8/18, he's Theo's daddy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 40 minutes ago, whitesoxbrad said: Can someone tell me what baseball background Rick hahn has , he is the general mgr. he is making the major decisions, I am having a tough time figuring out how he is qualified. Probably the Harvard law degree and the Northwestern MBA. Being a lawyer helps with contract negotiations, and having an MBA gives him an extensive analytics background. Everyone knows Hahn is more on the analytical side of things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footlongcomiskeydog Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 44 minutes ago, Dam8610 said: Probably the Harvard law degree and the Northwestern MBA. Being a lawyer helps with contract negotiations, and having an MBA gives him an extensive analytics background. Everyone knows Hahn is more on the analytical side of things. Rick Hahn and Yoan Moncada have a lot in common. Both are paper tigers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Hmmm... This sounds like a familiar discussion. Generally, NOT the greatest sign when most random message board posters have more high school or university experience in the sport you are GM in, with Theo Epstein (soccer instead) being a notable exception in baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: Hmmm... This sounds like a familiar discussion. Generally, NOT the greatest sign when most random message board posters have more high school or university experience in the sport you are GM in, with Theo Epstein (soccer instead) being a notable exception in baseball. Why the fuck does this matter at all? What kind of experience did Jeff Luhnow have exactly? Oh right, nothing since high school and yet he just built the best team in baseball. You got to move off this ridiculous tangent man. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 23 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Why the fuck does this matter at all? What kind of experience did Jeff Luhnow have exactly? Oh right, nothing since high school and yet he just built the best team in baseball. You got to move off this ridiculous tangent man. What is up with all of the insecurity on Soxtalk lately? People even have to get into personal backgrounds now? Cripes. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Just now, southsider2k5 said: What is up with all of the insecurity on Soxtalk lately? People even have to get into personal backgrounds now? Cripes. Rick Hahn may prove to be a terrible GM, but it won’t be because he never wore a varsity jacket. And him going to Harvard & Northwestern for graduate degrees are only good things, no matter how badly some here would like to spin it otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Rick Hahn may prove to be a terrible GM, but it won’t be because he never wore a varsity jacket. And him going to Harvard & Northwestern for graduate degrees are only good things, no matter how badly some here would like to spin it otherwise. Look around pro sports. Plenty of guys didn't play their sports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footlongcomiskeydog Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 15 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Rick Hahn may prove to be a terrible GM, but it won’t be because he never wore a varsity jacket. And him going to Harvard & Northwestern for graduate degrees are only good things, no matter how badly some here would like to spin it otherwise. Those degrees sure cost a pretty penny. Too bad they haven't been able to buy a winning season on the South Side since Mr. Hahn took over. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 54 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: Hmmm... This sounds like a familiar discussion. Generally, NOT the greatest sign when most random message board posters have more high school or university experience in the sport you are GM in, with Theo Epstein (soccer instead) being a notable exception in baseball. Well at least everyone isnt blaming KW for all of the bad moves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 (edited) He's got an elite educational background, not uncommon with modern GMs. He's spent his front office entire career with one team - not ideal. He's already had a chance - and he failed. People get 2nd chances, but usually with a different organization. Too many excuses. I don't see much discernible progress...sometimes there isn't any and teams just suddenly improve. Nevertheless, there should be some timetable and some accountability - and on Williams as well. Edited August 9, 2018 by GreenSox 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, GreenSox said: He's got an elite educational background, not uncommon with modern GMs. He's spent his front office entire career with one team - not ideal. He's already had a chance - and he failed. People get 2nd chances, but usually with a different organization. Too many excuses. I don't see much discernible progress...sometimes there isn't any and teams just suddenly improve. Nevertheless, there should be some timetable and some accountability - and on Williams as well. This is a great post. The fact that he wasted Chris Sale, Prime Quintana and quite possibly will waste Prime Rodon is a huge indictment on his ability to identify talent. There is a valid argument to be made that JR has a lot to do with the Sox FO, and if that is the case he should just have baseball people and run the damn team himself. At least at that point we'd not have any illusion of accountability being possible until there was new ownership. Edited August 9, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 40 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: This is a great post. The fact that he wasted Chris Sale, Prime Quintana and quite possibly will waste Prime Rodon is a huge indictment on his ability to identify talent. There is a valid argument to be made that JR has a lot to do with the Sox FO, and if that is the case he should just have baseball people and run the damn team himself. At least at that point we'd not have any illusion of accountability being possible until there was new ownership. This is the same group that drafted and signed Sale when scouts were saying he was a reliever, then turned him into one of the best starters in baseball. Not to mention the extension they got him to sign. Quintana was signed as a MiLB free agent and turned into an excellent starter, signed to a cheap extension and then sold off for the price of a front line starter at his absolute peak value. Or are those things not part of accountability? Are you just ignoring them? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 (edited) 12 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: This is the same group that drafted and signed Sale when scouts were saying he was a reliever, then turned him into one of the best starters in baseball. Not to mention the extension they got him to sign. Quintana was signed as a MiLB free agent and turned into an excellent starter, signed to a cheap extension and then sold off for the price of a front line starter at his absolute peak value. Or are those things not part of accountability? Are you just ignoring them? The extensions only matter because of what they were able to gain in trade because Both Sale/Q were signed to such nice team friendly extensions. Where the accountability comes in is that they had two seasons to get a damn supporting cast around Sale/Quintana/Abreu/Eaton/Rodon and they failed miserably. They weren't allowed to spend the money, there was failure in player development, and the fact they couldn't convince JR to open the wallet a little more and they didn't make any shrewd moves for distressed assets is an epic waste of that talent. KW did that and that is how he kept his job for as long as he did. They had a hell of a core and they put absolutely nothing around them. That is a fireable offense. Edited August 9, 2018 by Jack Parkman 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 6 hours ago, Jack Parkman said: The extensions only matter because of what they were able to gain in trade because Both Sale/Q were signed to such nice team friendly extensions. Where the accountability comes in is that they had two seasons to get a damn supporting cast around Sale/Quintana/Abreu/Eaton/Rodon and they failed miserably. They weren't allowed to spend the money, there was failure in player development, and the fact they couldn't convince JR to open the wallet a little more and they didn't make any shrewd moves for distressed assets is an epic waste of that talent. KW did that and that is how he kept his job for as long as he did. They had a hell of a core and they put absolutely nothing around them. That is a fireable offense. JR did open his wallet, they had opening day payrolls north of $120 million on paper both those years (an incident in spring training affected the 2016 payroll) and spent more than $60 million in the offseason between 2014-2015. They had higher payrolls those years than the Astros had coming into the season last year. That's not the problem. The problem is that opening your wallet will not win you a title with a 70 win team. It's a lesson we should have learned years ago, but 2015 should have taught it to everyone. If you actually look at who was available on the free agent market, the White Sox weren't going to make themselves substantially better on the free agent market any of those years, a huge chunk of the money spent on free agents those years went to guys like Chase Headley and Alex Gordon and Jayson Heyward who were either bad at the start or bad within 1-2 years. It happened both years, you go on the free agent market, you've got a 50% chance of a terrible contract. Especially given that they had nothing of value to trade those years beyond the scraps that they did trade, the problem was not money, it was that they were a 70 win team based on the talent they had after 2014 with virtually nothing of use coming up internally, and you can't make a 70 win team into a 90 win team using free agents alone. Even the Yankees don't have the money to do that, the bust rate is too high and there simply aren't enough good free agents. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 8 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said: Rick Hahn may prove to be a terrible GM, but it won’t be because he never wore a varsity jacket. And him going to Harvard & Northwestern for graduate degrees are only good things, no matter how badly some here would like to spin it otherwise. The key to being a good GM is not their athletic ability but their managerial ability. A good GM surrounds himself with good managers in the FO and in the field. Hopefully Hahn has done that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 13 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: JR did open his wallet, they had opening day payrolls north of $120 million on paper both those years (an incident in spring training affected the 2016 payroll) and spent more than $60 million in the offseason between 2014-2015. They had higher payrolls those years than the Astros had coming into the season last year. That's not the problem. The problem is that opening your wallet will not win you a title with a 70 win team. It's a lesson we should have learned years ago, but 2015 should have taught it to everyone. If you actually look at who was available on the free agent market, the White Sox weren't going to make themselves substantially better on the free agent market any of those years, a huge chunk of the money spent on free agents those years went to guys like Chase Headley and Alex Gordon and Jayson Heyward who were either bad at the start or bad within 1-2 years. It happened both years, you go on the free agent market, you've got a 50% chance of a terrible contract. Especially given that they had nothing of value to trade those years beyond the scraps that they did trade, the problem was not money, it was that they were a 70 win team based on the talent they had after 2014 with virtually nothing of use coming up internally, and you can't make a 70 win team into a 90 win team using free agents alone. Even the Yankees don't have the money to do that, the bust rate is too high and there simply aren't enough good free agents. What incident in spring training? One thing is for sure, a lot is riding on the Q trade and Kopech bailing Hahn out of trouble. Just imagine where they would be without those three players in terms of the general fanbase attitude. In the end, I guess we’ll eventually find out how valuable how valuable he is on the open market...an assistant GM job on the financial/contracts side, but not in player evaluation. That’s probably the main reason KW has been kept on the payroll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 8 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: Look around pro sports. Plenty of guys didn't play their sports. Luhnow also developed the most sophisticated player evaluation system/database for any sports team in the world...along with assistants from MIT, NASA, Cal Tech, etc. On the other hand, we’re still seemingly half stuck in the traditional way because of KW and JR. What is our market niche or identity around the game? Keeping players healthy and Don Cooper? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 6 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: What incident in spring training? One thing is for sure, a lot is riding on the Q trade and Kopech bailing Hahn out of trouble. Just imagine where they would be without those three players in terms of the general fanbase attitude. In the end, I guess we’ll eventually find out how valuable how valuable he is on the open market...an assistant GM job on the financial/contracts side, but not in player evaluation. That’s probably the main reason KW has been kept on the payroll. You really forgot the LaRoche drama already? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 I don’t know why we’re referring to it so obliquely then...it’s like talking about a cholera outbreak that killed hundreds. And if that was the case, why spend more “bad money” on James Shields when they were already desperate, like gamblers trying to turn a loss into break even? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 (edited) All GMs make good moves and bad moves. The bottom line is wins. Rick is last in the league since he took over an operation his fingerprints were all over anyways. Considering historically, the White Sox have had much better health than their rivals, there is no excuse. The clock should be ticking. Yes, this year was bound to suck. Next year wasn't bound to suck, but it's looking like that may change. There needs to be improvement, not only with the talent level, but with how they play the game. The Ricky's boys don't quit is nice, but as Ozzie says, they are a young team that loses a lot. Those teams usually hustle. Getting a 23 year old trying to establish himself in the major leagues to hustle isn't that tall of a task. Edited August 9, 2018 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.