Heyman: Eloy/Kopech may not be promoted this year

[southsider2k5]

 

[Balta1701]

Really dude you pasted the tweet link but you couldn't post the short text excerpt that we care about? I guess at least I get to pad my post count by fixing this...

Quote

Chicago White Sox

— Still getting the idea the White Sox may not bow to the pressure and bring up Eloy Jimenez. They may see this like Kris Bryant and Ronald Acuña, which could mean next year, and not necessarily at the start of the year, either … 

— Michael Kopech also has been hit in the minors. But don’t necessarily look for him to be promoted anytime soon, either … 

— Nice story on the powerful Daniel Palka by James Fegan of The Athletic … 

— Yoan Moncada recently was timed in 3.60 seconds to first base (yes, it was on a bunt; still good though).

 

[chitownsportsfan]

No shit.

[Brian]

I'd be shocked if Eloy isn't at least a Sept call up. Is Kopech on an innings limit this year?

[Bob Sacamano]

At this point, good.

[chitownsportsfan]

5 minutes ago, Tony said:

I've been under the belief this is an April 15th situation all along, and it's seeming more likely every day. 

I'm currently in the "acceptance" phase.  Anger has left me.

[ptatc]

8 minutes ago, Tony said:

I've been under the belief this is an April 15th situation all along, and it's seeming more likely every day. 

That should be the case. If they haven't brought them up already, you wait until the next service timeline.

[ptatc]

2 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'm currently in the "acceptance" phase.  Anger has left me.

Yes. I think they realized that it's going to take Giolito, Lopez and Moncada didn't progress this year as they would have liked. Thus they aren't going to compete next year.

I think if those 3 were lights out this year, Kopech and Jimenez would have been up already and they would compete next year.

[chitownsportsfan]

21 minutes ago, ptatc said:

Yes. I think they realized that it's going to take Giolito, Lopez and Moncada didn't progress this year as they would have liked. Thus they aren't going to compete next year.

I think if those 3 were lights out this year, Kopech and Jimenez would have been up already and they would compete next year.

Don't think one has anything to do with the other really.  I think this org is just chickenshit sometimes.

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

Really dude you pasted the tweet link but you couldn't post the short text excerpt that we care about? I guess at least I get to pad my post count by fixing this...

 

I will remember that clicking a link to read something is an unreasonable burden.

[Buehrle>Wood]

Kopech should have absolutely been called up this year. And I think that was the plan but the fo got cold feet because of his early struggles. Then they got caught looking once he turned it on. Not a good look for the fo but may as well wait at this point.

[fathom]

10 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

Kopech should have absolutely been called up this year. And I think that was the plan but the fo got cold feet because of his early struggles. Then they got caught looking once he turned it on. Not a good look for the fo but may as well wait at this point.

Have to wonder also if they thought they would unload Shields to create an opening.  Either way, Getz really messed up in that interview a few weeks ago.

[Dominikk85]

They absolutely shouldn't be up until late April next year, why waste service time on a 90+ loss team?

[Ducksnort]

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'm currently in the "acceptance" phase.  Anger has left me.

Same, except if they do wait for service time purposes, I really don't understand what Hahn means when he says to use Moncada and Giolito as blueprints to how these guys will be treated in terms of promotions. Moncada really ready last year to be called up last year, but Kopech and Eloy are. Maybe it's different because Gio and Moncada both already had major league time accrued before being traded to the Sox?

Edited August 17, 2018 by Scoots

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, [email protected] said:

They absolutely shouldn't be up until late April next year, why waste service time on a 90+ loss team?

If you were doing what was best for these 2 guys' development you would have called Eloy up late-July and you'd call Kopech up after his next 2 starts or so. Everyone's just kinda assuming that doing things that aren't best for their development won't be that big of a deal, so we'll take the service time as more important. 

[Dick Allen]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

If you were doing what was best for these 2 guys' development you would have called Eloy up late-July and you'd call Kopech up after his next 2 starts or so. Everyone's just kinda assuming that doing things that aren't best for their development won't be that big of a deal, so we'll take the service time as more important. 

So Moncada, Giolito, and Lopez would have been far less advanced this season had they spent another month in the minor leagues. 

 

Is it detrimental to all prospects when their season is over the first week of September? 

 

I have seen seen so many prospects called up in September over the years. Some excelled, some were horrible, but what I never  really saw was that call up being the catalyst to a great career. It sounds nice and all for people who want to whine they didn’t see these guys, but there really are no examples of guys not playing September baseball for a non contender costing them valuable development . 

[Balta1701]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

So Moncada, Giolito, and Lopez would have been far less advanced this season had they spent another month in the minor leagues. 

 

Is it detrimental to all prospects when their season is over the first week of September? 

 

I have seen seen so many prospects called up in September over the years. Some excelled, some were horrible, but what I never  really saw was that call up being the catalyst to a great career. It sounds nice and all for people who want to whine they didn’t see these guys, but there really are no examples of guys not playing September baseball for a non contender costing them valuable development . 

So dude, you're saying that there's no examples of a team not calling a guy up in September even though they were ready, and that guy totally flopping or getting hurt when he was called up the next year? Which means...you went through all of the failed prospects in baseball history to check? Either that or you're applying one of those totally unproveable standards.

[Dick Allen]

9 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

So dude, you're saying that there's no examples of a team not calling a guy up in September even though they were ready, and that guy totally flopping or getting hurt when he was called up the next year? Which means...you went through all of the failed prospects in baseball history to check? Either that or you're applying one of those totally unproveable standards.

That isn’t what I am saying. Dude. You are saying that not calling them up is hurting their development. Prove it. Give an example of someone who spent too much time in the minor leagues. Someone who would have been a building block had they just beeen called up in September. I can list guys who were great in September and sucked when the bell rang for spring training. These guys have taken their Septembers off their entire professional careers. Kopech even served a lengthy suspension, yet, somehow, some way they are still considered  elite prospects. They still were able to develop. I don’t know how, but I think it’s a sign they will be OK if they go home in a couple of weeks and show up at Soxfest in January.

Calling them up now would be a waste. Meaningless games, many against teams similarly situated, makes them basically spring training games. They might get something out of it, but nothing that would leave them far behind next year, especially if they are as good as you think. Sending them home is a small price to pay for the extra control. And as long as they perform well, that extra year will be quite valuable whether the team is good or bad at that point. They would either be huge pieces of a contender or trade bait. Now, they would be playing glorified spring training games.

Edited August 17, 2018 by Dick Allen

[Balta1701]

3 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

That isn’t what I am saying. Dude. You are saying that not calling them up is hurting their development. Prove it. Give an example of someone who spent too much time in the minor leagues. Someone who would have been a building block had they just beeen called up in September. I can list guys who were great in September and sucked when the bell rang for spring training. These guys have taken their Septembers off their entire professional careers. Kopech even served a lengthy suspension, yet, somehow, some way they are still considered  elite prospects. They still were able to develop. I don’t know how, but I think it’s a sign they will be OK if they go home in a couple of weeks and show up at Soxfest in January.

No, that's not what I said. I said everyone is assuming that it won't make a difference. It probably won't. But that's an assumption.

[Dick Allen]

16 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

So dude, you're saying that there's no examples of a team not calling a guy up in September even though they were ready, and that guy totally flopping or getting hurt when he was called up the next year? Which means...you went through all of the failed prospects in baseball history to check? Either that or you're applying one of those totally unproveable standards.

I have examples of guys who stayed down the extra time and still were stars. I have examples of guys called up in September and shining, who wound up doing nothing in their career. If not playing in the major leagues next month is going to hurt these guys, they weren’t going to be good anyway.

[Dick Allen]

6 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

No, that's not what I said. I said everyone is assuming that it won't make a difference. It probably won't. But that's an assumption.

You might want to re read what you wrote. You said if they were doing what is best for their development, Eloy would have been called up last month, and Kopech after 2 more starts. 

36 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

If you were doing what was best for these 2 guys' development you would have called Eloy up late-July and you'd call Kopech up after his next 2 starts or so. Everyone's just kinda assuming that doing things that aren't best for their development won't be that big of a deal, so we'll take the service time as more important. 

 

[Balta1701]

3 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

You might want to re read what you wrote. You said if they were doing what is best for their development, Eloy would have been called up last month, and Kopech after 2 more starts. 

 

Please tell me what is incorrect about that statement. You cannot mention service time, you have to tell me how Eloy does not deserve a callup and how Kopech does not deserve a callup, and how waiting for next year is actually better for their development. 

[pcq]

Elroy needs to take fly balls from Ricky. Kopech could be ready. Moncada still needs seasoning. 

[JuliusO1274]

3 hours ago, Brian said:

I'd be shocked if Eloy isn't at least a Sept call up. Is Kopech on an innings limit this year?

I'd be shocked if he is a Sept call up. I wanted him up this year but now it is too late. Calling him up in Sept still wastes a year of control. If they were going to call him up this year it should have been weeks ago, months even. 

[iWiN4PreP]

15 minutes ago, JuliusO1274 said:

I'd be shocked if he is a Sept call up. I wanted him up this year but now it is too late. Calling him up in Sept still wastes a year of control. If they were going to call him up this year it should have been weeks ago, months even. 

Yup, 100%.