Is Luis Gonzalez really this good?

[zisk]

       Having the best year by any position player not named Eloy. Statistically his defense is first rate, although I've never seen him play.

 He's been slightly older than some of our other prospects, but not old for his league. Just how good is this guy?

 

[soxfan49]

He's "inarguably" the best OF prospect in the system.

[maggsmaggs]

He's really had a terrific year. IMO, second most likely OF to be a future major leaguer. His defense, left-handedness and general hitting ability should make him at worst a reserve outfielder. 

[southsider2k5]

Its pretty darned exciting to see one of the kids we drafted doing so well to start his career.  I am excited, but I really want to see him repeat to some level at AA.

[Jose Abreu]

I've said this before, but between Jimenez, Robert, Adolfo, Gonzalez, Basabe, Rutherford, Walker, and Call, I feel really good about us producing 3 internal MLB outfielders. We should have a lot of money to spend on the infield and the rotation, since the bullpen prospects are similarly stacked. 

[Jack Parkman]

6 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

I've said this before, but between Jimenez, Robert, Adolfo, Gonzalez, Basabe, Rutherford, Walker, and Call, I feel really good about us producing 3 internal MLB outfielders. We should have a lot of money to spend on the infield and the rotation, since the bullpen prospects are similarly stacked. 

I feel really good about them producing four, pushing Eloy to DH. I feel really optimistic about them being able to internally fill the top of the rotation as well. I have a really good feeling that the following will stick in the rotation: Kopech, Cease and Giolito. They need a LH starter and they'll be ok. I think that Dunning or Hansen are still wild cards as well, due to health. I think that core will be good for a while. 

[Jerksticks]

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

I feel really good about them producing four, pushing Eloy to DH. I feel really optimistic about them being able to internally fill the top of the rotation as well. I have a really good feeling that the following will stick in the rotation: Kopech, Cease and Giolito. They need a LH starter and they'll be ok. I think that Dunning or Hansen are still wild cards as well, due to health. I think that core will be good for a while. 

Yea.  Arenado would sure ice the cake

[Jose Abreu]

2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

I feel really good about them producing four, pushing Eloy to DH. I feel really optimistic about them being able to internally fill the top of the rotation as well. I have a really good feeling that the following will stick in the rotation: Kopech, Cease and Giolito. They need a LH starter and they'll be ok. I think that Dunning or Hansen are still wild cards as well, due to health. I think that core will be good for a while. 

I agree. We can also convert one to 1B (probably one of Eloy/Adolfo) if we have to, leaving room for Robert in center, Basabe at a corner, and Gonzalez/Rutherford/somebody at the other 

[Jack Parkman]

12 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

I agree. We can also convert one to 1B (probably one of Eloy/Adolfo) if we have to, leaving room for Robert in center, Basabe at a corner, and Gonzalez/Rutherford/somebody at the other 

I still like the option of trading Rodon to the Braves for Gohara/Allard/Contreras. That deal, while it doesn't give quite the value of the Q deal, would be more than acceptable for me. 

[Timmy U]

I think Gohara has off field issues that would make me wary.  Look at why the M’s basically gave him away.

[Chicago White Sox]

He should start cracking top 100 lists after this season and has passed both Adolfo & Rutherford on my list of top OF prospects in the system, right behind Basabe.

[soxfan49]

What am I missing on Basabe? I don't watch much of any MILB but looking at stats, he doesn't hit for much power, doesn't steal many bases and usually hits in the .260 range.

[SoxAce]

2 hours ago, Jose Abreu said:

I agree. We can also convert one to 1B (probably one of Eloy/Adolfo) if we have to, leaving room for Robert in center, Basabe at a corner, and Gonzalez/Rutherford/somebody at the other 

If you're talking defense, Adolfo blows Rutherford out of the water there. 

[steveno89]

26 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

What am I missing on Basabe? I don't watch much of any MILB but looking at stats, he doesn't hit for much power, doesn't steal many bases and usually hits in the .260 range.

Basabe could turn into a 5 tool player given his skillset: Scouting grades: Hit: 45 | Power: 50 | Run: 60 | Arm: 60 | Field: 55 | Overall: 50

I don't think the hit ever gets to 50, but 40/45 might be doable. You are looking at a ceiling of a plus defense, .240 to .260 hitter with the chance for 20 home runs and 20 steals. Certainly a valuable player.

Basabe is unlikely to crack the majors until 2020, and should start 2019 in AA, with the potential to be bumped up to AAA halfway or so through the season. Given time he could blossom into a starter. 

Edited August 20, 2018 by steveno89

[southsider2k5]

5 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

If you're talking defense, Adolfo blows Rutherford out of the water there. 

Depends on which part.  Adolfo has a cannon for an arm, but I would guess Rutherford has him beat everywhere else (range, reads, speed, etc)

[SoxAce]

9 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Depends on which part.  Adolfo has a cannon for an arm, but I would guess Rutherford has him beat everywhere else (range, reads, speed, etc)

Probably now since Adolfo essentially missed a year of development there. I would still wager his arm at least will help save the sox some runs moreso and be kinder in the analytics department (similar to Leury last year). His range has always been good whereas Rutherford's has been questioned in the past. 

Edited August 20, 2018 by SoxAce

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, SoxAce said:

Probably now since Adolfo essentially missed a year of development there. I would still wager his arm at least will help save the sox some runs moreso. His range has always been good. 

Yeah, not that Micker is supposed to be bad or anything, but Rutherford is supposed to be a guy who can play CF at the major league level defensively, with even a pretty good arm.

[turnin' two]

I have to say, I don't understand why it seems so many are still down-ish on Rutherford.  He is just 21 (and will be until May) he has really risen to the challenge this year. He has been in WS all year and is hitting .297/.347/.416.  Yeah, it would be nice to see more power, but he is still young and has hit 22 2B and 8 3B this season.  Gonzalez has probably out played him this season, but Blake is a year and a half younger and they are now at the same level.  I don't want to seem like I am tearing down Gonzalez, I am not.  I am on the bandwagon.  I just feel they are pretty darn similar in terms of their status, while it seems most have Rutherford as an afterthought.  I guess I just think that year is a big deal.  If Rutherford started next season in Kanny, that would be similar to where Gonzalez was this season.  

I would love a lineup that had Rutherford Robert and Gonzalez in the OF, with Adolfo and Eloy alternating at 1B and DH (or however that works out).  Though I wouldn't be surprised if Call, Basabe, Walker, Booker or someone else made their way in either.  

[SoxAce]

Not all of these guys will make it. AA is essentially a big death sentence as I've seen alot of prospects in the past covering FS struggle after people once thought they were something. If I were a betting man, I'd say Eloy is definitely in, Robert will essentially be in (especially with what the Sox invented in him) and the 3rd spot will be between the other guys. I believe one or two of those guys will also be traded at some point, whether that's a prospect swap or a bigger trade down the road. Adolfo has the biggest upside out of the rest of the guys (not counting Eloy or Robert) but he's definitely the biggest risk with him being made of glass. The other guys it depends on the day. Alot of good qualities I see in Basabe, Rutherford, Gonzalez, etc.

[Chicago White Sox]

38 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

What am I missing on Basabe? I don't watch much of any MILB but looking at stats, he doesn't hit for much power, doesn't steal many bases and usually hits in the .260 range.

Below are the top 11 hitters in the Carolina League based on wRC+.  Five of these guys are on the older side (+23 years old).  Two of the remaining guys are Keston Hiura & Carter Kieboom, both top 100 prospects.  Three of the others are Sox outfielders: Luis Gonzalez, Micker Adolfo, & Luis Basabe.

Out of these hitters, Basabe has the 2nd highest ISO at .237.  He has the second highest BB % at 13.9%.  He doesn't steal a ton of bases, but he does have plus speed.  He's also a legit CF with a plus arm capable of playing all three OF positions.  Outside of the K rate (which is a concern), there to like here for a 21 year old.  I'm super high on this kid.     

[southsider2k5]

2 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Below are the top 11 hitters in the Carolina League based on wRC+.  Five of these guys are on the older side (+23 years old).  Two of the remaining guys are Keston Hiura & Carter Kieboom, both top 100 prospects.  Three of the others are Sox outfielders: Luis Gonzalez, Micker Adolfo, & Luis Basabe.

Out of these hitters, Basabe has the 2nd highest ISO at .237.  He has the second highest BB % at 13.9%.  He doesn't steal a ton of bases, but he does have plus speed.  He's also a legit CF with a plus arm capable of playing all three OF positions.  Outside of the K rate (which is a concern), there to like here for a 21 year old.  I'm super high on this kid.     

Without knowing the entirety of MiLB prospects, the White Sox have to be able to make a case for having the best collection of OF prospects in all of baseball.

[Chicago White Sox]

8 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

Not all of these guys will make it. AA is essentially a big death sentence as I've seen alot of prospects in the past covering FS struggle after people once thought they were something. If I were a betting man, I'd say Eloy is definitely in, Robert will essentially be in (especially with what the Sox invented in him) and the 3rd spot will be between the other guys. I believe one or two of those guys will also be traded at some point, whether that's a prospect swap or a bigger trade down the road. Adolfo has the biggest upside out of the rest of the guys (not counting Eloy or Robert) but he's definitely the biggest risk with him being made of glass. The other guys it depends on the day. Alot of good qualities I see in Basabe, Rutherford, Gonzalez, etc.

There is also a race element here.  The first guys to the show will be given an opportunity to take a job and run with it.  I think that gives a huge advantage to Basabe.  He's been pretty solid in AA and is starting to show signs of adjusting.  The same applies to Gonzalez if he starts off hot at AA.  

[Chicago White Sox]

Just now, southsider2k5 said:

Without knowing the entirety of MiLB prospects, the White Sox have to be able to make a case for having the best collection of OF prospects in all of baseball.

With Eloy still in AAA the answer is most definitely yes.  Once he's called up it will get interesting.  However, the Sox will still have a consensus top 40 prospect in Robert, three guys who have all cracked top 100 lists in Basabe, Adolfo, & Rutherford, a guy who will likely make some lists in the offseason in Gonzalez, & our second round pick from this year's draft in Walker.  That doesn't even include any of the more fringe guys like Call who has actually been pretty solid in AA and probably warrants more attention.

[turnin' two]

9 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

Not all of these guys will make it. AA is essentially a big death sentence as I've seen alot of prospects in the past covering FS struggle after people once thought they were something. If I were a betting man, I'd say Eloy is definitely in, Robert will essentially be in (especially with what the Sox invented in him) and the 3rd spot will be between the other guys. I believe one or two of those guys will also be traded at some point, whether that's a prospect swap or a bigger trade down the road. Adolfo has the biggest upside out of the rest of the guys (not counting Eloy or Robert) but he's definitely the biggest risk with him being made of glass. The other guys it depends on the day. Alot of good qualities I see in Basabe, Rutherford, Gonzalez, etc.

This is what has been so encouraging about Alex Call.  He currently has an OPS over .800 in Birmingham.  Yeah, it took him a little time to get right after the injury plagued season last year, but he has betting hitting with authority (.451 SLG - 15 doubles 6 HRS) and walking (22 BB in 211 PA).  He has put himself back on the map as well.  

[fathom]

50 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Yeah, not that Micker is supposed to be bad or anything, but Rutherford is supposed to be a guy who can play CF at the major league level defensively, with even a pretty good arm.

Reports last year at the time of the trade is Blake didn't project as a CF defensively.  Also, from the games I've seen on tv, Gonzalez makes the most consistent hard contact between himself, Gonzalez and Basabe.  In regards to scouting the game logs, Basabe seems to strike out looking a lot and needs work on his stealing technique.