2019 OD Roster Thread with a focus on Eloy

[ChiSoxJon]

6 minutes ago, bmags said:

All vets are aging.

(got em)

Guys like Harper and Manny that you break the bank for would be available in their primes however while these guys are past it...especially Donaldson...yuck

[TheTruth05]

4 minutes ago, Buehrlesque said:

Definitely. I'm sure the Sox will throw their hat in the ring, but I don't see any way they actually come away from either of those two though. Donaldson and Pollock aren't superstars, but they'll come at more reasonable prices on much shorter contracts.

I agree they'll be cheaper but if they're really looking to compete by 2020 will an injury prone Donaldson and Pollock really move the needle? They need to go big or go home and let the kids play.

[ChiSox59]

29 minutes ago, ChiSoxJon said:

Pretty sure we'd need to pay Manny more than that

Not interested in a 31 YO OFer when we have Avi and Eloy and maybe something in Engel with Luis Robert, Alex Call, and Luis Gonzalez almost up

Matt Harvey deal can't hurt, the hope would be for him to eat innings until Cease is ready and then flip him but his ego can stay elsewhere (I wanted Clay Buchholz this past offseason)

Regarding Manny, you're probably right.  But $33.5M AAV isn't exactly chump change.

I think Pollock is a fantastic fit for this team if the price is right. His injury history scares me, and he'll likely cost a draft pick.  But those are two reasons that you may be able to get him at a nice discount on his value.  I don't see any reason why the Sox shouldn't be interested in him if they can get him for 2-3 years and $18-20M AAV.  Who is he blocking?  The only true natural CFs in the system are Robert and Gonzalez, and neither are going to be in Chicago before mid to late 2020 best case scenario. You can always slide Pollock to LF or RF and Eloy to DH in 2020 if guys like Robert, Rutherford, Basabe and Adolfo are forcing the issue.  

Guys like Adam Engel and Alex Call aren't stopping me from acquiring a well above above average ML OF. 

[bmags]

No guarantees obviously, but Pollock has a .840 OPS in CF, and Donaldson would hopefully give us at least an .850 bat. Imagine two more Abreu-level production pieces in the lineup. Seems good!

Now, there's no guarantee they keep up their stats, but, that's why we could feasibly afford them.

[Wanne]

again...if I'm throwing big money at a FA....it ain't Machado...it's Arenado.

[Buehrlesque]

1 minute ago, TheTruth05 said:

I agree they'll be cheaper but if they're really looking to compete by 2020 will an injury prone Donaldson and Pollock really move the needle? They need to go big or go home and let the kids play.

What kids? Yolmer? Jose Rondon? Donaldson doesn't block anyone at 3B and represents serious bounceback upside. If he sucks, you lose nothing but $14 million-ish you otherwise wouldn't have spent anyway. If he's good, you're either in playoff contention or you can trade him for a prospect. I don't see any downside.

[bmags]

Just now, Wanne said:

again...if I'm throwing big money at a FA....it ain't Machado...it's Arenado.

We know Harper/Machado will be FAs this offseason, no reason to bank on Arenado being there in 2019.

[ChiSox59]

5 minutes ago, TheTruth05 said:

I agree they'll be cheaper but if they're really looking to compete by 2020 will an injury prone Donaldson and Pollock really move the needle? They need to go big or go home and let the kids play.

Dude, AJ Pollock is really good.  

I have minimal interest in Donaldson.  I'd be disappointed if the Sox go that direction unless its a 1 year deal with an eye on Arenado or Rendon in 2020. Honestly, I think Donaldson will accept the QO if he gets one. 

[Buehrlesque]

1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

Dude, AJ Pollock is really good.  

I have minimal interest in Donaldson.  I'd be disappointed if the Sox go that direction unless its a 1 year deal with an eye on Arenado or Rendon in 2020. Honestly, I think Donaldson will accept the QO if he gets one. 

I agree with this: Donaldson is best on a one-year deal, keeping multiple options open for 2020 and beyond. I don't think he'll get a QO — either the Jays will trade him this week or, if they don't, not offer one because they wouldn't want to block Vlad Jr. anyway.

Edit: and AJ Pollock is underrated, though injury-prone.

Edited August 29, 2018 by Buehrlesque

[TheTruth05]

9 minutes ago, Buehrlesque said:

What kids? Yolmer? Jose Rondon? Donaldson doesn't block anyone at 3B and represents serious bounceback upside. If he sucks, you lose nothing but $14 million-ish you otherwise wouldn't have spent anyway. If he's good, you're either in playoff contention or you can trade him for a prospect. I don't see any downside.

 

9 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Dude, AJ Pollock is really good.  

I have minimal interest in Donaldson.  I'd be disappointed if the Sox go that direction unless its a 1 year deal with an eye on Arenado or Rendon in 2020. Honestly, I think Donaldson will accept the QO if he gets one. 

The only problem i have with Donaldson is his shoulder and his ability to stay at 3b. I hope his arm strength is still there because we all know his bat can play. Another reason i wouldn't mind a multiyear deal with Donaldson is I'm not sure the Rockies don't just pay Arenado whatever he wants this offseason and he stays. 

Pollock is a no for me, he's real good but his injury history might leave us back with a Engel/Cordell/Injury Prone Leury battle for CF anyway. I do think both these guys will be in higher demand than most think. Obviously not Machado/Harper demand but once those two guys are off the board it's these 2. 

Edited August 29, 2018 by TheTruth05

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said:

I don't believe the Sox see anything of value there.  They completely left Guerrero exposed for the Rule 5, and he didn't really do much to prove them wrong.  Stephens has done nothing at AAA to convince me he is ready for MLB in April.  Spencer Adams might have a great era, but past that?  4 K's per 9 IP would get murders in MLB.  His pure stuff doesn't do anything for me.  Send them all back to Charlotte and let them see if they can change minds.

Personally, I'd like to see Cease with the big club in early May after a few starts in AAA. That may sound aggressive but the Braves have been equally or more aggressive with promotions for a few of their pitchers at an even younger age in recent years. For the most part, those guys have succeeded at the MLB level too.

Have a schmuck like Covey cover the 5th ststter spot in April and then by May roll out a rotation of Kopech, Rodon, Giolito, Lopez, Cease. Guys like Covey, Stephens etc can serve as a long man/spot starter if needed until Dunning is ready.

Edited August 29, 2018 by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

[ChiSox59]

1 minute ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Personally, I'd like to see Cease with the big club in early May after a few starts in AAA. That may sound aggressive but the Braves have been equally or more aggressive with promotions for a few of their pitchers at an even younger age. For the most part, those guys have succeeded at the MLB level too.

 I see basically no scenario where Cease in the the majors before late June, and even then only if he is straight fire in AAA, and the Sox are actually around .500 or better. 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

Just now, ChiSox59 said:

 I see basically no scenario where Cease in the the majors before late June, and even then only if he is straight fire in AAA, and the Sox are actually around .500 or better. 

Not saying it's likely but saying it's my preference.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

If the Sox are considering signing a FA pitcher this winter, I hope it's someone of value and not another Gonzalez, Holland, Shields type where they are wasting both dollars and opportunity (missed playing time for a young guy).

[southsider2k5]

43 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

 I see basically no scenario where Cease in the the majors before late June, and even then only if he is straight fire in AAA, and the Sox are actually around .500 or better. 

Agreed.  He hasn't even hit AAA yet, has only made 10 starts in AA, and only pitched 124 innings this year besides.

[iWiN4PreP]

I *really* hope the White Sox aren't afraid of using the insane payroll advantage they have this offseason.

We should most certaintly make a huge play for either/both of Harper/Machado. If we get either one, that immediately puts our rebuild into a contender. I am partial to Harper as I think he has more potential to be game changing over the next 10 years compared to Machado, but Machado fits a nice position need of 3b.

 

Now, if we get one of them, I'd want to get another FA as well, perhaps Pollock fits nicely if the price is right. I could see us swinging Pollock + Machado as a great scenario. I think Pollock's market won't be amazing considering he is older and very much injury prone and somewhat declining.

I'd also like to get 1 SP. I'm not sure yet who's available.

I'd also throw around the idea of trading Rodon. I know this site is split 50/50 on the idea, but his peripheals are not great. If he continues his ace like run down the stretch and we can pawn him off for 3 valuable pieces to the rebuild, that's a major win for us. One poster on this site mentioned the Braves with a deal around their prospect catcher, Gohara, and another good piece. That seems like a good trade for both teams. I'd love it.

IF we can get a good trade out of Avi, we take that, but that is highly doubtful.

C Omar/Castillo

1b Abreu

2b Moncada

3b Machado

SS Timmy Anderson

OF Eloy / Pollock / Fill in with Avi or Palka or Delmonic or Engel

DH Whatever is left from the fill in

 

 

EDIT: I should also add that there are so many different ways we can go this offseason and next. It will be very hard to disappoint me. The only way I will be a disappointed fan this off season is if the team does NOTHING. They might have the best financial situation of any team this offseason, put it to good use and at the very least get some good players to flip at the deadline if the idea is to not contend next year and give the rebuild another year.

Edited August 29, 2018 by iWiN4PreP

[beautox]

23 hours ago, TheTruth05 said:

With their history with Manny I think Manny would sign here way before signing with the Red Sox.Money being equal of course

People thought the same thing about David Price and look where he is.

[TheTruth05]

15 minutes ago, beautox said:

People thought the same thing about David Price and look where he is.

If anything the experience Price has had with the media/fans over there should hurt the BoSox chance

[beautox]

15 minutes ago, TheTruth05 said:

If anything the experience Price has had with the media/fans over there should hurt the BoSox chance

it should but it wont.

Having said that I would hope that the white sox spend big this offseason, we're going to likely have a protected pick and our opening day payroll should be right around 18M before ARB for Abreu, Avisail, Rodon, Yolmer, Leury & Xavier.

I want to see the sox go after Harper or Manny and land one of them. Additionally I think Corbin and Grandal should be high on the list all told add about 70M in AAV to the payroll.

With Machado                    With Harper

DH - Delmonico*                DH - Delmonico*
C - Grandal#                        C - Grandal#
1B - Abreu                            1B - Abreu
2B - Moncada#                    2B - Moncada#
SS - Anderson                      SS - Anderson
3B - Machado                      3B - Sanchez#
LF - Jimenez                          LF - Jimenez
CF - Leury#                           CF - Leury#
RF - Garcia                            RF - Harper*

 

SP - Corbin*
SP - Kopech
SP - Rodon*
SP - Giolito
SP - Lopez

CL - Burdi
SU - Fry*
SU - Hamilton
MR - Bummer*
MR - Burr
LO - Cedeno*
LR - Fulmer

C - Narvaez*
UT - Sanchez# or Rondon
UT - Rondon or Cordell
OF - Engel

[Jose Abreu]

Jose Rondon should be given a serious look at third base in September, as I think he has the chance to be better there as a starter than Yolmer. 

[TheTruth05]

14 minutes ago, beautox said:

it should but it wont.

Having said that I would hope that the white sox spend big this offseason, we're going to likely have a protected pick and our opening day payroll should be right around 18M before ARB for Abreu, Avisail, Rodon, Yolmer, Leury & Xavier.

I want to see the sox go after Harper or Manny and land one of them. Additionally I think Corbin and Grandal should be high on the list all told add about 70M in AAV to the payroll.

With Machado                    With Harper

DH - Delmonico*                DH - Delmonico*
C - Grandal#                        C - Grandal#
1B - Abreu                            1B - Abreu
2B - Moncada#                    2B - Moncada#
SS - Anderson                      SS - Anderson
3B - Machado                      3B - Sanchez#
LF - Jimenez                          LF - Jimenez
CF - Leury#                           CF - Leury#
RF - Garcia                            RF - Harper*

 

SP - Corbin*
SP - Kopech
SP - Rodon*
SP - Giolito
SP - Lopez

CL - Burdi
SU - Fry*
SU - Hamilton
MR - Bummer*
MR - Burr
LO - Cedeno*
LR - Fulmer

C - Narvaez*
UT - Sanchez# or Rondon
UT - Rondon or Cordell
OF - Engel

We’ll see this winter, I honestly think Sox have a very good chance of luring Machado by overpaying a bit.Hes a major hole filled for years to come. Harper is the one I don’t think would consider playing for a smaller market team like the Sox.Maybe it’s just the vibe he gives that he’s ready for a big market team (cubs,dodgers,yanks). I say sign Machado,Keuchel and Kimbrel to help the young relievers get their footing in the bullpen next season. I think Grandal would be nice but Narváez becoming a dude might make the Sox keep them from spending on C.

[beautox]

2 minutes ago, TheTruth05 said:

We’ll see this winter, I honestly think Sox have a very good chance of luring Machado by overpaying a bit.Hes a major hole filled for years to come. Harper is the one I don’t think would consider playing for a smaller market team like the Sox.Maybe it’s just the vibe he gives that he’s ready for a big market team (cubs,dodgers,yanks). I say sign Machado,Keuchel and Kimbrel to help the young relievers get their footing in the bullpen next season. I think Grandal would be nice but Narváez becoming a dude might make the Sox keep them from spending on C.

If there were odds given for Machado vs. Harper, I'm with you I'm more inclined to believe Manny comes here. Keuchel will be 31 by opening day, on the other hand Corbin will be 29 for the majority of next season. I'm not against getting a vet for the bullpen but Kimbrel is going to command a lot of money for an area the sox have shown an ability to excel at. Narvaez is certainly becoming a dude but his defense and framing(104th) are so bad, his arm is solid but thats about all he has going for him behind the dish; I view him as a luxury as a back up but a suspect as a starter. With such a young staff across the board focusing on someone like Grandal would be a boon, top 3 in framing and offense. 

[Chicago White Sox]

I find it more likely Reinsdorf approves making a winning offer to Machado or Harper than Corbin.  The Yankees are going to be all over him and he’s going to a get contract in length that we’ve been typically unwilling to consider for pitchers.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

These are the exact kind of discussions I was hoping to get in my Let there be light thread.That's what I get for writing more than a few paragraphs ? . Good discussions guys . I really like some of the ideas on which free agents to pursue though I haven't seen any relief pitchers mentioned. Kimbrel anyone ?

[Lillian]

Is there a veteran player, with an expensive contract, on a team that is not ready to contend? I'd love to see the Sox pick up someone like that, for a couple of years, until a few more of the top prospects are ready. That might be preferable to committing to a long term, expensive contract, when we don't really know what we have in so many of these promising youngsters. Of course he would have to play a position that fills a hole, but such a player should be more affordable than the $300M to $400M deals, which both Harper and Machado are likely going to demand. Sometimes teams are willing to part with guys like that, just for the salary relief. Preferably, he would only have a couple of years left on his current contract.