New Owner

[WBWSF]

Sometime, somewhere, someday the White Sox will have a new owner. I wish it was sooner rather than later.  I read recently where Theo Epstein wants to own a baseball team. He has been very successful running both Boston and the Bad Guys on the Northside. Owning a baseball team is on his bucket list.  Wouldn't it be something if he bought the White Sox? I don't think any White Sox fan would object to his owning the team.

[southsider2k5]

Does Theo Epstein have a spare billion dollars? 

[Buehrle>Wood]

Theo epsteins networth is listed at 25 million. I cant imagine him being worth more than 100 mil and that's being very generous. Why would anyone want that?

 

Cuban or bust, if the Reinsdorfs would sell to him. No Selig to stop him

 

 

Edited September 19, 2018 by Buehrle>Wood

[Balta1701]

6 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Does Theo Epstein have a spare billion dollars? 

Does Derek Jeter? Magic Johnson? 

[ptatc]

11 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

Sometime, somewhere, someday the White Sox will have a new owner. I wish it was sooner rather than later.  I read recently where Theo Epstein wants to own a baseball team. He has been very successful running both Boston and the Bad Guys on the Northside. Owning a baseball team is on his bucket list.  Wouldn't it be something if he bought the White Sox? I don't think any White Sox fan would object to his owning the team.

Where is he going to get the extra hundreds of millions of dollars he needs to overspend on starting pitching he can't develop?

[Buehrle>Wood]

3 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Does Derek Jeter? Magic Johnson? 

Those guys have hundreds of millions and still only have very small stakes in the teams they own. They both paid more than double what theo is worth for a very small fraction of the team

[NorthSideSox72]

Reminder: Jerry Reinsdorff is not the sole owner of the White Sox. Heck he's not even the largest shareholder. He is ONE OF the biggest holders, but the reason you see him is he's the Chairman and speaks for the ownership group. In other words, Reinsdorff selling his stake does not mean the team is being sold.

 

[Balta1701]

14 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

Those guys have hundreds of millions and still only have very small stakes in the teams they own. They both paid more than double what theo is worth for a very small fraction of the team

Exactly. I think Billy Beane is a part owner of the As for the same reason. They become the public face of the franchise but they represent a group of behind the scenes investors. 

[southsider2k5]

36 minutes ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

Those guys have hundreds of millions and still only have very small stakes in the teams they own. They both paid more than double what theo is worth for a very small fraction of the team

This. Theo isn't buying a team.  Someone else may put him in charge, but he isn't buying a team.

[Dick Allen]

Theo doesn't need a ton of money personally to buy a team. He puts the group together and sets it up so he has total control, just like JR.  He gets a share of the team. Who knows, maybe he cuts a deal based on performance for even a bigger share. Considering his success, he probably wouldn't have a hard time finding investors. 

Edited September 19, 2018 by Dick Allen

[Harry Chappas]

I could see JR or his estate selling his stake to Theo. 

[caulfield12]

Is there any GM more likely to get $2-4 billion in investment behind him?

 

[GenericUserName]

1 hour ago, NorthSideSox72 said:

Reminder: Jerry Reinsdorff is not the sole owner of the White Sox. Heck he's not even the largest shareholder. He is ONE OF the biggest holders, but the reason you see him is he's the Chairman and speaks for the ownership group. In other words, Reinsdorff selling his stake does not mean the team is being sold.

 

Actually I think it does. Here is the relevant quote from a 2013 Tribune article:

Quote

Since 1981, when Reinsdorf headed a group that bought the team for $19 million, he never has been a majority owner of the team, just one of dozens of investors. But Reinsdorf, who recently became the longest-tenured owner in Major League Baseball, always has held virtually unfettered control of the team because he holds a majority stake in the corporation that runs the team, according to interviews with Reinsdorf and other partners.

He said that gives him — and the executors of his will, whom he declined to name — authority to sell without the approval of other investors. Experts said that, if sold today, the team could easily surpass the $800 million paid two years ago for the San Diego Padres, a team with just 13 winning seasons and scant tradition.

And a couple more relevant ones from the article:

Quote

Reinsdorf reportedly owned 4 percent to 5 percent of the team at the beginning but has gradually increased his stake. Four partners told the Tribune that Reinsdorf now owns 14 percent. Reinsdorf said that figure is "significantly understated" but declined to provide another amount.

"No partner knows what I own," Reinsdorf said.

Quote

When shareholders in the general partner and limited partners die, their shares are inherited. If the deceased was a board member, an heir does not assume that board seat. Most heirs are uninvolved, although in interviews some said that they continue to attend games with their families.

But if a limited partner wants to sell his or her shares, Reinsdorf must approve it, and he even has matched offers from outsiders to keep people out. He recalled allowing only four outsiders to buy into the team. One was Andrew Berlin, a 53-year-old Chicago businessman who bought portions of shares from five investors beginning in 2007.

What is really interesting about that last one is that Berlin ended up selling and buying into the Cubs when he bought the South Bend team that became the Cubs affiliate, so I would assume JR bought those shares from Berlin further consolidating his stake though Berlin could still be an option for buying the whole team because he stated he wants to be a majority owner of a team.

Quote

If Jerry Reinsdorf's guidance is heeded, the executors of his will would run the Sox until the team is sold. The team's investors could not dispute a sale and would receive cash for their stakes. The limited partnership would be dissolved; if investors wanted to continue being involved with the team, they'd have to take it up with the new owner, according to Reinsdorf.

I guess what could happen is that they sell the team and the other owners still want to stick around so they buy in as part of the group with the new majority owner.

Edited September 19, 2018 by GenericUserName

[NorthSideSox72]

49 minutes ago, GenericUserName said:

Actually I think it does. Here is the relevant quote from a 2013 Tribune article:

And a couple more relevant ones from the article:

What is really interesting about that last one is that Berlin ended up selling and buying into the Cubs when he bought the South Bend team that became the Cubs affiliate, so I would assume JR bought those shares from Berlin further consolidating his stake though Berlin could still be an option for buying the whole team because he stated he wants to be a majority owner of a team.

I guess what could happen is that they sell the team and the other owners still want to stick around so they buy in as part of the group with the new majority owner.

Hm. Even if Reinsdorff and his board can sell the team via the representative corporation, I think the ownershop group still has sway just like shareholders in a publicly traded company. So, Reinsdorff could sell his stake and sell the corporation that manages the team as a company, but he would also need to sell the owners on the plan because they'd be able to override him if they organized a majority of "shares" to do so.

In other words, Jerry selling his stake and the corporation will mean a change, but only a limited one and one that the ownership group approves. That's my read anyway.

 

[Lip Man 1]

I have always believed and heard from sources that JR has complete, utter control of the team and day to day operations. In fact it is written into his contract that he has a free hand without having to consult the other owners. The other owners can offer opinions and disagree but have limited to no power to do anything about the operations of the club including selling it. JR does not need to gain their approval.

 I know a few years ago a group of other owners got together and tried to force a sale which was quickly killed by JR.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

22 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

I have always believed and heard from sources that JR has complete, utter control of the team and day to day operations. In fact it is written into his contract that he has a free hand without having to consult the other owners. The other owners can offer opinions and disagree but have limited to no power to do anything about the operations of the club including selling it. JR does not need to gain their approval.

 I know a few years ago a group of other owners got together and tried to force a sale which was quickly killed by JR.

 

There is a difference between operations, and sale of the organization. No one in their right mind would elect to own a share in a company if the ownership had zero control over who was in charge. Again, that's what shareholders do. They usually don't get involve in day to day, but they have say in things like selling the company and/or who runs the company.

 

[Dick Allen]

21 minutes ago, NorthSideSox72 said:

There is a difference between operations, and sale of the organization. No one in their right mind would elect to own a share in a company if the ownership had zero control over who was in charge. Again, that's what shareholders do. They usually don't get involve in day to day, but they have say in things like selling the company and/or who runs the company.

 

Apparently, no one who owns shares of the White Sox are in their right mind. JR, then his heirs, can do whatever they want. What is interesting is when board members die, they are replaced by no one. 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/whitesox/ct-xpm-2013-07-28-ct-spt-0728-white-sox-chicago-sports-20130728-story.html

Edited September 19, 2018 by Dick Allen

[NorthSideSox72]

2 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Apparently, no one who owns shares of the White Sox are in their right mind. JR, then his heirs, can do whatever they want. 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/whitesox/ct-xpm-2013-07-28-ct-spt-0728-white-sox-chicago-sports-20130728-story.html

That's not what the article says, and it's JR making assertions and there aren't any lawyers or anyone else speaking up that actually know this stuff. He has a lot of control to be sure. This is like any other corporation. The leaders of the corporation can try to sell the company, but if a majority of shareholders don't like it, they have ways to stop it. I am sure it is no different here.

In the end the ownership group probably will do whatever JR likes anyway, so this is probably all moot.

[Dick Allen]

3 minutes ago, NorthSideSox72 said:

That's not what the article says, and it's JR making assertions and there aren't any lawyers or anyone else speaking up that actually know this stuff. He has a lot of control to be sure. This is like any other corporation. The leaders of the corporation can try to sell the company, but if a majority of shareholders don't like it, they have ways to stop it. I am sure it is no different here.

In the end the ownership group probably will do whatever JR likes anyway, so this is probably all moot.

JR is a lawyer, and the only issue the others have is if he died. They did concede he can do what he wants as long as he's alive. I doubt he has any enemies, even if he wasn't a nice guy. He's made those guys a lot of money. 

 

To raise the money, Reinsdorf recruited his friends, relatives and holdovers from Veeck's ownership group. The minimum investment was $250,000 — 1.32 percent stake of the team, according to court records — though Reinsdorf said he waived that for some. They agreed to his plan, which made Reinsdorf the majority shareholder in the team's general partner, which is the controlling entity. The rest of the company is made up of limited partners and minority shareholders in the general partner, none of whom has any control, according to interviews with a dozen of them.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Dick Allen

[WBWSF]

23 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Apparently, no one who owns shares of the White Sox are in their right mind. JR, then his heirs, can do whatever they want. What is interesting is when board members die, they are replaced by no one. 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/whitesox/ct-xpm-2013-07-28-ct-spt-0728-white-sox-chicago-sports-20130728-story.html

In the article JR says his only goal is to break  even every year. Anybody who believes that statement believes in the Easter Bunny. This franchise is making nothing but money. If it wasn't JR would sell the team in a heartbeat.  Always remember the 2018 White Sox are 29th in MLB payroll and according to Forbes Magazine they are 14th in revenue. If anything I'm expecting the White Sox payroll to be very low for the foreseable future.

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, WBWSF said:

In the article JR says his only goal is to break  even every year. Anybody who believes that statement believes in the Easter Bunny. This franchise is making nothing but money. If it wasn't JR would sell the team in a heartbeat.  Always remember the 2018 White Sox are 29th in MLB payroll and according to Forbes Magazine they are 14th in revenue. If anything I'm expecting the White Sox payroll to be very low for the foreseable future.

At least for this season and last season remember that Robert's bonus and penalties ($25 million a season or so) don't count as part of the MLB payroll.

[Dick Allen]

If it were a break even business, people wouldn't be paying what they are paying to buy them.  JR went with the break even line years ago, and wisely stuck to it.  Publicly acknowledging he is making money on the White Sox can only be bad for him.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Dick Allen

[southsider2k5]

18 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

In the article JR says his only goal is to break  even every year. Anybody who believes that statement believes in the Easter Bunny. This franchise is making nothing but money. If it wasn't JR would sell the team in a heartbeat.  Always remember the 2018 White Sox are 29th in MLB payroll and according to Forbes Magazine they are 14th in revenue. If anything I'm expecting the White Sox payroll to be very low for the foreseable future.

They are also no where NEAR the most profitable.  They were tied for 13th there.  The Cubs made a $100 million+ profit last year, while the Sox made $30 million.

[WBWSF]

It should be pointed out that each MLB franchise is going up 10% in value every year.  I find it ironic that the two previous White Sox owners (Veeck and John Allyn) were  not making any money with the team and couldn't put a winning product on the field because they were going broke. You have a situation now where the team is making money but yet the ownership can't put out a winning product on the field. I honestly wish that the team wasn't making money because if it wasn't JR would sell the team.

 

[southsider2k5]

5 minutes ago, WBWSF said:

It should be pointed out that each MLB franchise is going up 10% in value every year.  I find it ironic that the two previous White Sox owners (Veeck and John Allyn) were  not making any money with the team and couldn't put a winning product on the field because they were going broke. You have a situation now where the team is making money but yet the ownership can't put out a winning product on the field. I honestly wish that the team wasn't making money because if it wasn't JR would sell the team.

 

Please don't use value as a substitute for revenue.  If you own a million dollar house, it doesn't mean you have a million dollars to spend.