Moncada hopes to stay at 2b

[southsider2k5]

 

[kevo880]

I think it comes down to 2 things:

Does Madrigal develop as anticipated and then take over as a gold glove caliber 2nd baseman, which could then move Moncada to 3rd

or

Do the Sox sign Machado this offseason or Arenado next offseason, thus making Madrigal a super sub or Moncada/Madrigal trade bait to upgrade at a different position.

[southsider2k5]

Of note here, Yoan Moncada led all 2Bs in OOZ plays with 90.

[Jose Abreu]

Moving a physically gifted defensive second baseman (as proven by his range stats) to third base because of a prospect who's still in single-A is pretty foolish and probably not something that has ever happened. It reminds me of the meathead "move Tim Anderson to center field!" stuff from May

[hi8is]

Easy. Put Madrigal at catcher.

[Special K]

Let's say we sign one of Arenado or Machado.  I'd favor leaving Moncada at 2B.  

Is Madrigal playing CF an option?  

[Bananarchy]

1 hour ago, Special K said:

Let's say we sign one of Arenado or Machado.  I'd favor leaving Moncada at 2B.  

Is Madrigal playing CF an option?  

Too soon to say.  The speculation about Madrigal is a little silly right now.  When he comes up we'll have a better idea who Moncada is.  Until then, there's really nothing to talk about.

[oldsox]

1 hour ago, kevo880 said:

I think it comes down to 2 things:

Does Madrigal develop as anticipated and then take over as a gold glove caliber 2nd baseman, which could then move Moncada to 3rd

or

Do the Sox sign Machado this offseason or Arenado next offseason, thus making Madrigal a super sub or Moncada/Madrigal trade bait to upgrade at a different position.

Pipe dreams.  Ain't gonna happen.  Forgetaboutit.

Maybe Moncada should lose a few pounds.  Looks pretty chunky.

[Lillian]

It may sound premature, but Madrigal will likely move quickly through the system and could be on the team by 2020. Playing him anywhere but 2ND isn't plausible. He does not profile anywhere else, as we have discussed. If we wasted last year's #4 pick, on a bust, this rebuild has more problems than even the pessimists think. Moncada has the tools to play other positions. If Madrigal is a success, Yoan is the one to move to another position.

Oh, yes and Machado will not be coming to the Sox. You can bet on it!!  If it happens, I'll eat some crow, but it just doesn't seem likely, for so many reasons, which have also been discussed here.

Edited October 1, 2018 by Lillian

[Flash]

The Milwaukee Brewers lost 90 games in 2016. They brought in Craig Counsell part way into the season as manager. They made a few moves to position to compete and improved nicely in 2017. Most casual fans would be hard pressed to name more than one or two members of their starting pitching rotation at end of 2017. All they did to start 2018 was trade for Yelich (lock for MVP) and sign Cain as FA (top 5 MVP) while improving their BP every chance they got. At deadline they trade for Moustakas and Schoop. Still doubt casual fans can name more than 3 starters but after today, they are the odds on favorite to take NL and I wouldn't bet against them for the whole enchilada. My point....you need a plan and a willingness to execute it.

[Bananarchy]

12 minutes ago, Lillian said:

It may sound premature, but Madrigal will likely move quickly through the system and could be on the team by 2020. Playing him anywhere but 2ND isn't plausible. He does not profile anywhere else, as we have discussed. If we wasted last year's #4 pick, on a bust, this rebuild has more problems than even the pessimists think. Moncada has the tools to play other positions. If Madrigal is a success, Yoan is the one to move to another position.

Oh, yes and Machado will not be coming to the Sox. You can bet on it!!  If it happens, I'll eat some crow, but it just doesn't seem likely, for so many reasons, which have also been discussed here.

Even if Madrigal comes up in 2020, we're still too early to worry about Moncada's future.  2019 will say a lot

[Boopa1219]

I'd leave Moncada at 2B, I think any and all talk of him moving off the position is very premature. 

Development takes time, I expect him to take the next step with the glove next year.

[Bananarchy]

2 minutes ago, Joshua Strong said:

I'd leave Moncada at 2B, I think any and all talk of him moving off the position is very premature. 

Development takes time, I expect him to take the next step with the glove next year.

This.  We're already writing off our best prospect.  

It's infuriating how much Sox fans are like Cub fans.  

[Lillian]

I for one, am certainly not "writing off Moncada". The point is that he has the ability to play other positions. Madrigal really only profiles as a second baseman. Thank you, "Flash". I couldn't have said it better, myself.

Edited October 1, 2018 by Lillian

[Flash]

Its not a matter of him developing his glove and I don't know how anyone could possibly construe Lillians comment as 'writing off our best prospect' (which he isn't). The fact is we drafted Madrigal and he will be our 2nd baseman, most likely by 2020. Since Moncada has played 3rd in the past and given our need there, he is a likely candidate to move there. Whats so hard to understand?  

[southsider2k5]

44 minutes ago, oldsox said:

Pipe dreams.  Ain't gonna happen.  Forgetaboutit.

Maybe Moncada should lose a few pounds.  Looks pretty chunky.

Lmao, wat?

[Jose Abreu]

9 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Lmao, wat?

What's funny is what he dismissed as a "pipe dream" is probably a more likely event than the chance that Moncada's problem is his weight 

[Balta1701]

2 hours ago, Flash said:

Its not a matter of him developing his glove and I don't know how anyone could possibly construe Lillians comment as 'writing off our best prospect' (which he isn't). The fact is we drafted Madrigal and he will be our 2nd baseman, most likely by 2020. Since Moncada has played 3rd in the past and given our need there, he is a likely candidate to move there. Whats so hard to understand?  

 

2 hours ago, Lillian said:

It may sound premature, but Madrigal will likely move quickly through the system and could be on the team by 2020. Playing him anywhere but 2ND isn't plausible. He does not profile anywhere else, as we have discussed. If we wasted last year's #4 pick, on a bust, this rebuild has more problems than even the pessimists think. Moncada has the tools to play other positions. If Madrigal is a success, Yoan is the one to move to another position.

Oh, yes and Machado will not be coming to the Sox. You can bet on it!!  If it happens, I'll eat some crow, but it just doesn't seem likely, for so many reasons, which have also been discussed here.

I'm skeptical about Madrigal moving as quickly as you folks think. It's all about one tool in his game - power. If he comes back next year with a power game, then he could move up rapidly as you think, but it the power game doesn't show up immediately, his hit tool will be big league quality quickly but it would be a punchless hit tool. He'll hit decently at every level, but the thing that will determine whether we want him as a big league starter is power, and do we really think that's just going to appear in one season?

[YonderLaroche]

2 hours ago, Flash said:

The Milwaukee Brewers lost 90 games in 2016. They brought in Craig Counsell part way into the season as manager. They made a few moves to position to compete and improved nicely in 2017. Most casual fans would be hard pressed to name more than one or two members of their starting pitching rotation at end of 2017. All they did to start 2018 was trade for Yelich (lock for MVP) and sign Cain as FA (top 5 MVP) while improving their BP every chance they got. At deadline they trade for Moustakas and Schoop. Still doubt casual fans can name more than 3 starters but after today, they are the odds on favorite to take NL and I wouldn't bet against them for the whole enchilada. My point....you need a plan and a willingness to execute it.

Yes, definetly GM of year in NL.  Sox could have easily traded for yellich (signed cheap til 2022!), Signed moustakas cheap , signed Cain etc but didn't do squat.  Brewers took advantage of the "tank on purpose" market and got excellent, cheap free agents and traded AAAA prospects for a MVP.  They also have a good manager , depth due to signings / trades / drafts.  Great job by the Brewers organization, a very fun team to watch, as the Sox try to imitate the 2013 Cubs for the third year 

[Boopa1219]

I was all for trading for Yelich as long as the cost centered along pitching prospects not named Kopech but what would’ve arguably set the Sox and their timeline back. 

I applaud the Sox for sticking to their guns and not trying to cheat this process, to painful now but the reward will be worth it. 

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, bryank1202 said:

Yes, definetly GM of year in NL.  Sox could have easily traded for yellich (signed cheap til 2022!), Signed moustakas cheap , signed Cain etc but didn't do squat.  Brewers took advantage of the "tank on purpose" market and got excellent, cheap free agents and traded AAAA prospects for a MVP.  They also have a good manager , depth due to signings / trades / drafts.  Great job by the Brewers organization, a very fun team to watch, as the Sox try to imitate the 2013 Cubs for the third year 

And won 76 games? Did you pay any attention to the rest of the roster? It would have been the dumbest thing possible to blow the present by drafting in the middle of the 1st round in 19 to assemble a team in 18 that wasn't going to win a thing, and trading a significant amount of our future talent to do it.

Do you even realize that it took 92 wins to make the playoffs this year in the AL Central? Are you seriously trying to tell me that those 3 players were worth 30 more wins this year?

Seriously this post is not thinking about reality even a minimal amount. 

 

[Eminor3rd]

This positional logjam stuff always - ALWAYS - works itself out. There’s no point in moving anyone for anyone when nobody is forcing anybody. It’s ridiculous to talk about anyone on the White Sox blocking anyone else at this point. When we have two dudes raking at the same position in the Majors, then the time to worry about it. Let’s try to even get there first. If that happens, and no one wants to move, then somebody gets traded for something useful. 

Its gonna be fine. 

Edited October 2, 2018 by Eminor3rd

[southsideirish71]

Moncada should spend this offseason working on his footwork and glove work at 2b.  He has amazing physical tools.  I think a focus on working on the technical side of being a fielder is going to help him over the long run.  

[Jose Abreu]

47 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

Moncada should spend this offseason working on his footwork and glove work at 2b.  He has amazing physical tools.  I think a focus on working on the technical side of being a fielder is going to help him over the long run.  

I agree, he has crazy range but his issue is sometimes messing up on a ball that's hit almost right to him, usually due to footwork. Relatively easy problem to fix, and if he does, he's among the top fielding second basemen in the league.

[Lillian]

10 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

 

I'm skeptical about Madrigal moving as quickly as you folks think. It's all about one tool in his game - power. If he comes back next year with a power game, then he could move up rapidly as you think, but it the power game doesn't show up immediately, his hit tool will be big league quality quickly but it would be a punchless hit tool. He'll hit decently at every level, but the thing that will determine whether we want him as a big league starter is power, and do we really think that's just going to appear in one season?

If we are only going to consider Madrigal a potential core piece of this rebuild, if he develops power, then the Sox have made a mistake, picking him #4. Power has not been part of his game and may never be. If that were the case, the Sox used a precious top Draft pick, to select a player, with the hope that he can become something, that he isn't. My guess is that the Sox wanted him because they value what he brings, not what he could bring, to the game, He is a tremendous contact hitter, in an age where everyone strikes out far too often. He is a great defensive player, at an important middle infield position. He has a very high baseball acumen and he is a team leader. He is not a power hitter and I don't think that he will become one. Although power would be a nice bonus, it is probably not something, upon which the Sox are going to insist, before promoting him to the Majors. He profiles as a potential Gold Glove second baseman, who could fill a valuable role, as a leadoff, or 2 hole hitter. If he demonstrates a capacity to perform those functions, at the Big League level, he'll be brought up.

Edited October 2, 2018 by Lillian