Your Offseason Plan

[ChiSoxFanMike]

9 minutes ago, fathom said:

My weekly thought on what happens:

sign:  Grandal/Familia/Gio G/CarGo

trade for:  Seager and cash for Collins

Yolmer and Nate Jones for Domingo Santana

 

?????

[Chicago White Sox]

39 minutes ago, fathom said:

My weekly thought on what happens:

sign:  Grandal/Familia/Gio G/CarGo

trade for:  Seager and cash for Collins

Yolmer and Nate Jones for Domingo Santana

 

I don’t like this plan at all...needs more whale.

[fathom]

25 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I don’t like this plan at all...needs more whale.

I don’t like it either, but it’s far more realistic than outbidding the big money teams

 

[caulfield12]

The idea of Domingo Santana makes SENSE, Yolmer and Nate would seemingly be more valuable to the Brewers than many other teams...like Avi, there's a huge amount of variance in his fWAR numbers the last three seasons (0.3, 3.3, 0.7).  He's actually the same age (26) as Garcia as well.

The MAIN selling point would be arbitration control through 2021.

We could do worse, for sure, he fits the timeline...has upside, and we've made quite a few deals with MIL recently, such as Swarzak/Saladino/Soria/Cedeno, etc.

Not to mention that we're unarguably better off helping a rival of the Cubs, right?

 

[Chicago White Sox]

Trying to be objective here, but I think we’re going to be incredibly active over the next two weeks.  I really think at a minimum we’ll add two starters, one more reliever, a corner OF, a backup catcher, and either a 3B or a 2B.

I feel that the path forward with the pitching additions is pretty clear.  Add one impactful starter to a multi-year deal to serve as the anchor to a young staff.  Add another starter (preferably with some upside) to a one year deal.  Add one more veteran RH reliever.  I lean towards this also being a bounce-back type / short-term type option.

On the positional side the priority is clearly to land a whale.  I do think no matter what, RF & 3B will be addressed this offseason.  As much as this pains me, I’m pretty confident Yoan will be moving to 3B unless we add Machado (in which he stays at 2B).  Doing so also allows us to go out and add one of the many 2B free agents to a one-year deal.  Harper is obviously the primary target for the OF, but McCutchen & Brantley both seem like options if a two year deal can get it done.

I don’t think there’s any chance we sign Grandal and go with a more affordable option at backup catcher.  Maldonado seems like a guy who could make sense if we can get him on a one year deal.  The biggest question mark for me is clearly CF.  Pollack is the only free agent that is starting caliber and going five years with him just seems crazy to me with our OF depth.  Having said that, I can’t imagine entering the 2019 season with Engel being handed the job, but I really don’t know what the alternative would be if they’re committed to Yoan in the infield.

[caulfield12]

Well, if you sign Pollock to 4 years, you're blocking Robert in the OF (not to mentioning making those other 4 outfield prospects trade bait), or you'd simply have to move Jimenez to DH in order to accommodate an OF comprised of Pollock, Robert and Harper.

A nice (albeit expensive) problem to have.

If Pollock can find anyone to sign him for 4 or 5 years, I think the White Sox won't chase that.  3 would probably be their limit on a player with so much risk attached, or 3 and some type of mutually-agreed upon option/buyout.

Coming off another injury-plagued season, he might prefer to go with a shorter-term deal at a higher average per year, but there's risk for him and his agent either way.  The lack of quality OF options available definitely works in his favor, at least in this particular market.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Trying to be objective here, but I think we’re going to be incredibly active over the next two weeks.  I really think at a minimum we’ll add two starters, one more reliever, a corner OF, a backup catcher, and either a 3B or a 2B.

I feel that the path forward with the pitching additions is pretty clear.  Add one impactful starter to a multi-year deal to serve as the anchor to a young staff.  Add another starter (preferably with some upside) to a one year deal.  Add one more veteran RH reliever.  I lean towards this also being a bounce-back type / short-term type option.

On the positional side the priority is clearly to land a whale.  I do think no matter what, RF & 3B will be addressed this offseason.  As much as this pains me, I’m pretty confident Yoan will be moving to 3B unless we add Machado (in which he stays at 2B).  Doing so also allows us to go out and add one of the many 2B free agents to a one-year deal.  Harper is obviously the primary target for the OF, but McCutchen & Brantley both seem like options if a two year deal can get it done.

I don’t think there’s any chance we sign Grandal and go with a more affordable option at backup catcher.  Maldonado seems like a guy who could make sense if we can get him on a one year deal.  The biggest question mark for me is clearly CF.  Pollack is the only free agent that is starting caliber and going five years with him just seems crazy to me with our OF depth.  Having said that, I can’t imagine entering the 2019 season with Engel being handed the job, but I really don’t know what the alternative would be if they’re committed to Yoan in the infield.

That's a lot to add in 2 weeks unless you meant we'll add all that this off season. As much as I think they add this year next year is a better starting pitcher market and they probably shouldn't add that much unless they are clearly confident they can get the whale. That's the problem ,wait to add around the whale or try to convince the whale we'll add after he is acquired.

I also wouldn't be that confident about moving Yoan to 3rd base since the Sox seem to be stressing defense a bit more now . In my mind I often think they miss out on the whales which could signal the same thing as last year which is add some relievers and enough starting pitching to cover innings which means no one like Corbin or Happ . I guess we will find out if the TV contract influences this year or not . Just like with the whales the Sox have to do some selling on the long term competitive window to the TV people and might come up short in both. I can easily see this ending up another bad year though not as bad as last year.

If the winter meeting come and go with minimal Sox activity then the bloom is off the rose.

[Chicago White Sox]

11 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

That's a lot to add in 2 weeks unless you meant we'll add all that this off season. As much as I think they add this year next year is a better starting pitcher market and they probably shouldn't add that much unless they are clearly confident they can get the whale. That's the problem ,wait to add around the whale or try to convince the whale we'll add after he is acquired.

I also wouldn't be that confident about moving Yoan to 3rd base since the Sox seem to be stressing defense a bit more now . In my mind I often think they miss out on the whales which could signal the same thing as last year which is add some relievers and enough starting pitching to cover innings which means no one like Corbin or Happ . I guess we will find out if the TV contract influences this year or not . Just like with the whales the Sox have to do some selling on the long term competitive window to the TV people and might come up short in both. I can easily see this ending up another bad year though not as bad as last year.

If the winter meeting come and go with minimal Sox activity then the bloom is off the rose.

Sorry, I meant over the course of the offseason.  And just to be clear, I’m speculating what I think the Sox will do, not what I would do necessarily.  There are definitely some interesting arms hitting the market next year, but I get the feeling they want to add a quality vet to stabilize the rotation and take some pressure off the kids right now.  To your point, I think it also helps the whale pursuit by signaling we plan to be active.  

As for Yoan, I dislike the idea of moving him to 3B but Rick has mentioned the possibility twice this offseason already.  IMO, they’re simply waiting on Machado before officially making a move.  And if that happens, I think at least one of the veteran 2B free agents (Murphy, Dozier, Schoop) can be had on a cheap one year deal and serve as a bridge to Madrigal.

[fathom]

So all the beat writers are suggesting the Sox are going to go after the following at the Winter Meetings:

- catcher (Grandal)

- veteran starter (Gio and Shoemaker)

- reliever (Familia)

- outfielder and/or 3rd base (Brantley and Tim Beckham)

Predictions? (mine)

Edited December 8, 2018 by fathom

[GreenSox]

Any of those except for Grandal would be okay.  But only do a couple.
 Grandal would be terrible.

[beautox]

The Hahn and KW are going to shove plan.

Trade Fulmer & Palka to the Mariners for Mallex Smith, Kyle Seager and Carlos Santana, Mariners chip enough money so it makes sense

Trade Robert, Collins & Dunning for Realmuto with window to extend.

Trade Rutherford, Burger & Medeiros to the D'backs for Grienke & Ray

Sign Harper

DH - Santana# - 2

C - Realmuto - 3.7

1B - Abreu - 2.4

2B - Moncada# - 2.2

SS - Anderson - 1.3

3B - Seager* - 2.7

LF - Jimenez - 3.3

CF - Smith* - 1.8

RF - Harper* - 4.9

 

SP - Greinke - 3.4

SP - Ray* - 3.2

SP - Lopez - .9

SP - Rodon* - 1.5

SP - Giolito - .2

 

CL - Colome - .5

SU - Fry* - .5

SU - Burdi - 1.9

MR - Bummer* - .1

MR - Burr - . 3

LO - Banuelos* - .2

LR - Hamilton - .1

 

C - Castillo# - 2.1

IF - Sanchez# - 1.5
UT - Rondon - .3

UT - Garcia# - .6

 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

9 hours ago, beautox said:

The Hahn and KW are going to shove plan.

Trade Fulmer & Palka to the Mariners for Mallex Smith, Kyle Seager and Carlos Santana, Mariners chip enough money so it makes sense

Trade Robert, Collins & Dunning for Realmuto with window to extend.

Trade Rutherford, Burger & Medeiros to the D'backs for Grienke & Ray

Sign Harper

DH - Santana# - 2

C - Realmuto - 3.7

1B - Abreu - 2.4

2B - Moncada# - 2.2

SS - Anderson - 1.3

3B - Seager* - 2.7

LF - Jimenez - 3.3

CF - Smith* - 1.8

RF - Harper* - 4.9

 

SP - Greinke - 3.4

SP - Ray* - 3.2

SP - Lopez - .9

SP - Rodon* - 1.5

SP - Giolito - .2

 

CL - Colome - .5

SU - Fry* - .5

SU - Burdi - 1.9

MR - Bummer* - .1

MR - Burr - . 3

LO - Banuelos* - .2

LR - Hamilton - .1

 

C - Castillo# - 2.1

IF - Sanchez# - 1.5
UT - Rondon - .3

UT - Garcia# - .6

 

I;d be more shocked at the Sox trading their prospects right now than I would be over getting Harper or Machado.

[wrathofhahn]

I just hope whatever we do there is a clear plan in place and we aren't just spending money because we have it.

[Dam8610]

23 hours ago, beautox said:

The Hahn and KW are going to shove plan.

Trade Fulmer & Palka to the Mariners for Mallex Smith, Kyle Seager and Carlos Santana, Mariners chip enough money so it makes sense

Trade Robert, Collins & Dunning for Realmuto with window to extend.

Trade Rutherford, Burger & Medeiros to the D'backs for Grienke & Ray

Sign Harper

DH - Santana# - 2

C - Realmuto - 3.7

1B - Abreu - 2.4

2B - Moncada# - 2.2

SS - Anderson - 1.3

3B - Seager* - 2.7

LF - Jimenez - 3.3

CF - Smith* - 1.8

RF - Harper* - 4.9

 

SP - Greinke - 3.4

SP - Ray* - 3.2

SP - Lopez - .9

SP - Rodon* - 1.5

SP - Giolito - .2

 

CL - Colome - .5

SU - Fry* - .5

SU - Burdi - 1.9

MR - Bummer* - .1

MR - Burr - . 3

LO - Banuelos* - .2

LR - Hamilton - .1

 

C - Castillo# - 2.1

IF - Sanchez# - 1.5
UT - Rondon - .3

UT - Garcia# - .6

 

There's no way you're getting that trade from the Mariners. Not even JeDi is that dumb. That's one quality player, one good enough player to not be considered a salary dump, and a salary dump. You'd need to give up something of substance for that.

[GreenSox]

This belongs more in the "Creative trades" thread, but I couldn't find it.
Anyway, for my money, the 2018 Sox pitcher of the year was Jayce Fry.   He's got 4 or 5 pitches.  Kd a lot of guys; excellent WHIP.   Reminds me a lot of MB - he throws that filthy stuff could be a really good control lefty.  I hate trading good pitching.
But I'm a sell-high and buy low guy.

The Cubs need a lefty reliever...the only one they have is the Chef, Justin Wilson and he's pretty awful.

So to that end,  Jayce Fry for Ian Happ.

[Heads22]

I agree; there's no reason to overvalue a RP

[TheFutureIsNear]

I'll try 1 of these crazy off seasons...

 

Sign Bryce Harper- 12 years $408M...Give him an opt out clause after 3 years. 

Sign Adam Jones- 2 years $18M

Sign Charlie Morton- 2 years $30M

Sign Clay Bucholz- 1 year $5M (or someone like him...Miley, Ross, Cahill- take your pick)

Sign Adam Warren- 2 years $8M

Sign Martin Maldanado- 1 year $4M

Trade Nate Jones and Carson Fulmer to the Phillies for Maikel Franco

Trade Yolmer Sanchez, AJ Puckett, and Ian Clarkin for Domingo Santana

 

I figure that to add about 70-75ish million to the payroll

 

C- Castillo/Maldanado

1B- Jose

2B- Moncada

SS- Anderson

3B- Franco

LF- Santana/Eloy 

CF- Harper/Jones

RF- Harper/Jones

DH- Santana/Eloy

Bench - Palka, Rondon, Leury

 

SP- Rodon

SP- Morton

SP- Lopez

SP- Giolito

SP- Bucholz

 

Long Relief- Dylan Covey

LH Middle Relief- Adam Bummer or Manny Banuelos 

RH Middle Relief- Ian Hamilton

RH Middle Relief- Juan Minaya

LH Setup- Jace Fry

RH Setup- Adam Warren

Closer- Alex Colome

 

Probably still not enough pitching but wanted to keep it somewhat realistic. We would still have pretty much all of our prospects to get pitching help as the season went on though. I'd rather overpay in prospects given what we have than give someone like Keuchle a huge deal is what it comes down to really. 

 

Edited December 9, 2018 by TheFutureIsNear

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

On 11/8/2018 at 3:35 AM, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

White Sox acquire C Keibert Ruiz and SS Gavin Lux from the Los Angeles Dodgers for SP Carlos Rodon

I love Rodon. I really do. But he only has 3 years left with the Sox, and his shoulder issues scare me. This may be the right time to move him, before he has another injury and tanks all of his value. I would say even this trade may be a little lobsided in the Sox favor, if not for the fact that, like Senzel, Ruiz is so totally blocked in the Dodgers system. Yes he is their #2 prospect according to Fangraphs....but their #1 prospect is ALSO a catcher, Will Smith. And Smith is just about ready for the majors. But they also have Austin Barnes in the majors. So Ruiz is a 20-year old switch hitting catcher with amazing plate discipline at his age, and spending half of his 2018 season as a 19-year-old in AA. He struck out only 8% of the time in AA, and walked almost as much, to go along with 12 HR. Also considered an above average defender. 

Gavin Lux is a guy who myself and many others really really wanted in the 2016 draft with our 2nd pick at #26. The Dodgers ended up popping him at #20 instead. Lux spent his age 20 season in A+ and AA where he hit .324 with 15 HR, 13 SB, a walk rate of about 11% and a K% just under 17%. Another kid with great plate discipline, a bit of pop, but plays a premium position with 60 grade speed. Oh, and he bats lefty. Still love me some Gavin Lux. He is rated the Dodgers #8 prospect.

 

Well that would have been a pretty fucking kick ass trade.

Rodon DID end up getting hurt again and completely tanking his value. Ruiz missed some time this year, but continued to improve his plate discipline, yet again trimming his already great K rate from 8% down to about 6.5%. Also, his BB rate jumped again from 6.3% to just under 9%. 30 BB to 22 K on the year in mostly AA, but a cup of coffee in AAA. Switch hitter, still only 21. With the Dodgers getting a great impact from Will Smith coming up, I think Ruiz should be targeted yet again this offseason as well for the Sox.

As for Gavin Lux.....well, we all know what that dude did. Was named the 2019 minor league player of the year by Baseball America and is now on his way to a World Series appearance with the Dodgers, hitting a HR in his first career postseason AB.

[BamaDoc]

On 10/5/2019 at 9:05 PM, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

Well that would have been a pretty fucking kick ass trade.

Rodon DID end up getting hurt again and completely tanking his value. Ruiz missed some time this year, but continued to improve his plate discipline, yet again trimming his already great K rate from 8% down to about 6.5%. Also, his BB rate jumped again from 6.3% to just under 9%. 30 BB to 22 K on the year in mostly AA, but a cup of coffee in AAA. Switch hitter, still only 21. With the Dodgers getting a great impact from Will Smith coming up, I think Ruiz should be targeted yet again this offseason as well for the Sox.

As for Gavin Lux.....well, we all know what that dude did. Was named the 2019 minor league player of the year by Baseball America and is now on his way to a World Series appearance with the Dodgers, hitting a HR in his first career postseason AB.

It would have been but it does make the assumption that the Dodgers would have accepted it.  They actually had a multitude of starting pitching.

[bmags]

How do you even find this stuff.

[bmags]

Just a heads up for those who saw it I'm moving DAs post to the other thread. This is just a weird Chili recall thread.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

11 hours ago, bmags said:

How do you even find this stuff.

Search function. It's a pretty cool new feature.