Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) I was going to say, I'm in favor any move that shows Avi the door, even if it is signing a 38-year old DH (a very productive one at that). Edited November 7, 2018 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 I like a Cruz signing at 2/30. I think it makes sense for both parties. He would have been one of, if not the best hitters on the team last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 2 hours ago, Capital G said: I like this for the same reason I'd like a Haap type signing. If we also sign Machado or, I can dream, Machado + Corbin this opens our window to the AL C in 2019. Especially if Cleve decides to sell. What's the worst that could happen? We have Cruz on a 1 year deal (maybe 2), no one else signs with us, we suck again this year. We can flip him at the trade deadline to a team in contention that could use his bat (and if he sucks we eat his contract. Again, no biggie due to our low payroll). Not like the $ we would spend on him would tie us up in our rebuild window and/or keep us from signing one or more of Machado/Harper/Corbin. I can live with this in 2019 Castillo/Narvarez Abreu Moncada Anderson Machado OF: Palka Engel (we'd likely need him and have to deal w/ his bat if we plan on having Palka in the OF) Eloy DH: Cruz SP: Rodon Lopez Haap/Gio Gonz/etc (If somehow we land Corbin of course move him to #1) Gio Covey With a very weak ALC (assuming Cleve does sell) we could win the ALC in 2019 and still have contracts of Cruz/Haap fall off once were ready to bring up our young guys and still have payroll flexibility. Corbin is IMO too risky for what he's likely to get paid. I think for the money you'd spend on Corbin, or close to it, you could likely get Yusei Kikuchi, Gio Gonzalez, Michael Brantley, and Nelson Cruz. I think the latter four put the team in better position to contend alongside Machado than the former. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 Just now, Dam8610 said: Corbin is IMO too risky for what he's likely to get paid. I think for the money you'd spend on Corbin, or close to it, you could likely get Yusei Kikuchi, Gio Gonzalez, Michael Brantley, and Nelson Cruz. I think the latter four put the team in better position to contend alongside Machado than the former. Yeah I don't really want Corbin. Completely fine with gambling on guys like Gio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 11 hours ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said: This should be the only reason to bring him in, but I really want nothing to do with Cruz. Keep him away if at all possible. He's entering his age 38 season and already showed slight signs of regression this past season. Did he? 137 wRC+ with 37 homers. 153 wRC+ with 30 homers against LHP. He would have been the best offensive player on the Sox last year by a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: Did he? 137 wRC+ with 37 homers. 153 wRC+ with 30 homers against LHP. He would have been the best offensive player on the Sox last year by a lot. I had to look this up because those splits would be extreme. He hit 11 homers against lefties (.266 avg) last year, 16 against righties (and a .253 avg). Edited November 7, 2018 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Y2Jimmy0 said: Did he? 137 wRC+ with 37 homers. 153 wRC+ with 30 homers against LHP. He would have been the best offensive player on the Sox last year by a lot. His age seems to indicate he isn't long for the major leagues. And his production, while still great, did go down a bit last season. And he's a DH. Would you be surprised if at age 38 he gets injured or his production drops significantly? Do you really think the White Sox have much of a chance to contend in 2019? Do you really think 38 year old DHs bring back significant prospects at the trade deadline? It isn't worth paying him. If he were a few years younger, then sure. Not now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: His age seems to indicate he isn't long for the major leagues. And his production, while still great, did go down a bit last season. And he's a DH. Would you be surprised if at age 38 he gets injured or his production drops significantly? Do you really think the White Sox have much of a chance to contend in 2019? Do you really think 38 year old DHs bring back significant prospects at the trade deadline? It isn't worth paying him. If he were a few years younger, then sure. Not now. Unless they really think they have a chance in 2020 and they think Cruz won't suddenly fall off over the next couple years. You get Kopech back in2020, Cease should be up day 1 that year (assuming everything goes right this year and he comes up at some point), Lopez, hopefully huge strides from Giolito this year and you never know. Of course, there are a lot of "ifs" in this scenario like the above situations, signing Machado, the young position players and starters and bullpen, being good, signing a good starter, etc. Edited November 7, 2018 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capital G Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 On 9/26/2018 at 10:03 AM, Dick Allen said: 1 hour ago, Dick Allen said: The White Sox lost 100 games with one of the weakest schedules in baseball. To think Machado, Happ, Cruz, and Eloy makes them instant contenders is very wishful thinking. The Sox used to add guys like Cruz and Happ to teams that had guys like Sale and Q and Eaton and in his prime Jose Abreu, and it didn't work. Typically I would agree. But at those times there was always a team that was a clear cut playoff contender. Tigers/Royals/Indians. IF Cleve sells who is going to be a far and above better team than the team I outlined? Not the Tigers and Royals. Not the Indians if they sell. Minny? Not to mention signing a Haap and Cruz for a couple years wont hurt us if it does not work out. We don't lose prospects and we don't have to worry about salaries. Whether it works or not our rebuild is not impacted at all. We either compete this year or we don't and we flip Cruz. Even if for some reason Cruz bombs he'd be gone before he is blocking anyone in the minors and his salary would not keep us from FA this or next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 7 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said: I had to look this up because those splits would be extreme. He hit 11 homers against lefties (2..6 avg) last year, 16 against righties (and a .253 avg). I did have this wrong. He hit 11 homers vs LHP and 26 vs RHP. This part is same though. Vs LHP: 153 wRC+, .389 wOBA vs RHP: 126 wRC+, .350 wOBA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Capital G said: Typically I would agree. But at those times there was always a team that was a clear cut playoff contender. Tigers/Royals/Indians. IF Cleve sells who is going to be a far and above better team than the team I outlined? Not the Tigers and Royals. Not the Indians if they sell. Minny? Not to mention signing a Haap and Cruz for a couple years wont hurt us if it does not work out. We don't lose prospects and we don't have to worry about salaries. Whether it works or not our rebuild is not impacted at all. We either compete this year or we don't and we flip Cruz. Even if for some reason Cruz bombs he'd be gone before he is blocking anyone in the minors and his salary would not keep us from FA this or next year. People keep mentioning this but they're only talking about a couple key pieces that are almost gone anyway (Kluber) and they would likely be getting back a guy or two that could help them next year or after (think a guy like Clint Frazier who doesn't have a spot currently but who would easily be in the linup on other teams). Edited November 7, 2018 by soxfan2014 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 Yeah and cleveland is so well run. Pretty sure they could tear it down today and their rebuild would arrive faster than ours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 5 minutes ago, bmags said: Yeah and cleveland is so well run. Pretty sure they could tear it down today and their rebuild would arrive faster than ours. Yeah. They have Kluber, Bauer, Carrasco to deal. 5 years control of Jose Ramirez and 3 of Lindor. They would get a lot back for those 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capital G Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 41 minutes ago, Dam8610 said: Corbin is IMO too risky for what he's likely to get paid. I think for the money you'd spend on Corbin, or close to it, you could likely get Yusei Kikuchi, Gio Gonzalez, Michael Brantley, and Nelson Cruz. I think the latter four put the team in better position to contend alongside Machado than the former. 40 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said: Yeah I don't really want Corbin. Completely fine with gambling on guys like Gio. What's the worry about Corbin? Just the money or his performance? I don't know much about him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 29 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: His age seems to indicate he isn't long for the major leagues. And his production, while still great, did go down a bit last season. And he's a DH. Would you be surprised if at age 38 he gets injured or his production drops significantly? Do you really think the White Sox have much of a chance to contend in 2019? Do you really think 38 year old DHs bring back significant prospects at the trade deadline? It isn't worth paying him. If he were a few years younger, then sure. Not now. Why does it matter though if it’s on a short-term contract? Adding Cruz is an easy way to improve the team and doesn’t prevent us from making other splashier additions. I’m all for it if the price is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Capital G said: What's the worry about Corbin? Just the money or his performance? I don't know much about him. Really good, but suddenly got amazing last year so seems to be a regression candidate you'd be paying full price for. Was a pretty average pitcher before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dam8610 Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 5 minutes ago, Capital G said: What's the worry about Corbin? Just the money or his performance? I don't know much about him. Basically with Corbin, you're risking paying ace prices for a #3 starter, with likely a 6ish year commitment to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Capital G said: What's the worry about Corbin? Just the money or his performance? I don't know much about him. Personally, just not huge on guaranteeing lots of money and years to arms. Edited November 7, 2018 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) I don’t see this as anything more than making Cruz aware that the Sox would give him a soft place to land if his market falls apart I guess we, as fans, are conditioned to think of team salary as a transient, temporal resource that comes and goes from year to year — but to an owner, I gotta believe $30M is $30M. I’m not saying there’s no situation where we could end up with him, but if you think that it won’t affect the White Sox ability or willingness to spend big later, I think you’re crazy. Edited November 7, 2018 by Eminor3rd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raBBit Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 Thing that is interesting about Cruz is his track record is very consistent yet he will have few suitors. How many teams in the AL are trying to compete and don't already have a DH? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 (edited) 2 minutes ago, raBBit said: Thing that is interesting about Cruz is his track record is very consistent yet he will have few suitors. How many teams in the AL are trying to compete and don't already have a DH? That's what I was thinking too. He's at the end of his career and doesn't have a ring. That could be important if offers are close. Astros, who are listed in the original tweet, make a ton of sense for him. Edited November 7, 2018 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vote4Pedro Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 Now this seems like more of a “Sox” move.....let’s hope he’s just a complimentary piece if they do sign him versus the “star” you bring in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 On 11/7/2018 at 3:31 PM, Orlando said: I like a Cruz signing at 2/30. I think it makes sense for both parties. He would have been one of, if not the best hitters on the team last year. That is an understatement, over the last 3 years cruz has a higher ops+ than machado and Harper, he was a top hitter. However at his age decline or injury can come quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted November 9, 2018 Share Posted November 9, 2018 My gosh he blasted a lot of homers last season for a 37 year old. This six time all star would look good in the Cell if Father Time treats him well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted November 9, 2018 Share Posted November 9, 2018 On 11/6/2018 at 5:12 PM, Dick Allen said: They have to make it more attractive to Harper or Machado. But Cruz is 100 years old. What’s age except a number? Speaking of numbers who on the Sox hit 37 homers with 97 RBIs last year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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