Bob Sacamano Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 It's possible Delmonico is the odd-man out on the Opening Day roster since he has an option left (not sure about Engel and Leury). They could go with Jay in LF, Engel in CF, and Palka in RF until Eloy comes up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 2 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said: It's possible Delmonico is the odd-man out on the Opening Day roster since he has an option left (not sure about Engel and Leury). They could go with Jay in LF, Engel in CF, and Palka in RF until Eloy comes up. Leury has none, but Delmonico, Palka, & Engel all have options remaining. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, soxfan2014 said: It's possible Delmonico is the odd-man out on the Opening Day roster since he has an option left (not sure about Engel and Leury). They could go with Jay in LF, Engel in CF, and Palka in RF until Eloy comes up. Or Yolmer...assuming Machado has to be signed for this offseason to make any sense...and Yolmer would have a lot more trade value at this point in time. How well can Leury play 3B? He’s almost exclusively played SS on the infield, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 2 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Leury has none, but Delmonico, Palka, & Engel all have options remaining. That's good since they'll need a spot for Eloy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 7 hours ago, GreenSox said: Having a better OBP than the players on a 62 win team is the standard for a good OBP? LOL . Oh and you forgot one: Narvaez @ .366 OBP, a player this board couldn't wait to get rid of (probably because he wasn't a blue-chip prospect, despite being under 30 and improving). This is so ridiculous - Jay is not a good player, won't help the Sox win, and will block younger players. Why? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 When will they announce ARod being brought in to take Steve Stone's place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Harold Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 6 hours ago, greg775 said: Jon Jay is 33 and not very good. I won't go on and on and get all greg-ged up about it, but folks I don't really wanna watch Jon Jay on my mlb.com subscription next season. I guess he could replace Engel and that wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. But ... geez, Jon Jay? Time to cancel that subscription, Soria pt. 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 I think it could be more likely Luery is traded than Sanchez. He could have some value to a contender than needed a utility guy. Delmonico certainly seems to have no place on this team anymore, which really isn’t that much of a loss. His performance no matter how much of it was hampered by injuries last season was not much to be desired. Good thing guys like Leury, Delmonico, and Engel are easily replaceable and not important to the rebuild. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 Just now, CWSpalehoseCWS said: I think it could be more likely Luery is traded than Sanchez. He could have some value to a contender than needed a utility guy. Delmonico certainly seems to have no place on this team anymore, which really isn’t that much of a loss. His performance no matter how much of it was hampered by injuries last season was not much to be desired. Good thing guys like Leury, Delmonico, and Engel are easily replaceable and not important to the rebuild. From a baseball and rebuilding prospective, I would prefer Delmonico and Leury, and Yolmer to Jon Jay. But if Jay gets you Machado, those 3 can go stratch. If Machado still goes to the Yankees, it's time for a change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 3 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: From a baseball and rebuilding prospective, I would prefer Delmonico and Leury, and Yolmer to Jon Jay. But if Jay gets you Machado, those 3 can go stratch. If Machado still goes to the Yankees, it's time for a change. https://nypost.com/2019/01/05/boras-client-may-show-creative-way-to-reach-harper-machado-deals/ This is old news, but the Sherman post makes just as much sense (that the Yankees are coming up with a really creative contract) makes as much sense as Hahn asking Machado if bringing Alonso and Jay on board would sway his decision. The only thing that makes you believe Machado to the Sox is that all these desperation (so crazy, they’re brilliant!) moves would look almost as laughable as the Stewart/LaRussa days in Arizona. https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/ranking-the-five-worst-moves-of-the-dave-stewart-era-with-the-diamondbacks/ Of course, that worst GM in modern MLB history saw his former team advance to the playoffs in 2017, regardless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 This thread is where Soxtalk has reached self parody. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 Here’s yet another compelling argument for signing players so late hurting MLB...season tickets or souvenir Harper/Machado jerseys can’t be given away as gifts at Christmastime...and corporations looking to invest in season tickets would have been much likelier to do that this past November than now waiting into Q1 2019. https://www.coloradoan.com/story/sports/mlb/columnist/gabe-lacques/2019/01/07/mlb-offseasons-hindering-baseball-bryce-harper-manny-machado/2502916002/ The biggest win, however, may be in convincing a large segment of fans that winning “efficiently” is almost as important as winning at all. And it’s created something akin to Stockholm syndrome: Unless that fan roots for the Yankees or Dodgers, he or she is accustomed to their team eschewing big-bucks expenditures and fears that one suboptimal contract will poison the entire operation. "Little old us, making a play for Bryce Harper? That’s just crazy!" Even the Yankees can pull this off; GM Brian Cashman's semi-annual "Bubba Crosby will be our center fielder" gambit used to be greeted with almost universal eyerolls. Now, he can say with a straight face Troy Tulowitzki will be his opening-day shortstop and largely avoid scorn. It's one thing for Cashman to bluff his way through winter, and time will reveal the Yankees' ultimate intent. But it's quite another that fans are willing to buy what he's initially peddling. Meanwhile, what, exactly, are teams supposed to promote? There was a time not long ago when the bulk of free agency was wrapped up a couple weeks before the New Year. And what timing! Clubs could sell holiday ticket packages generated by the excitement of the forthcoming new star. A few weeks later, said player might make his first appearance at a winter fan-fest event, slap some hands, generate some friendly Internet content and, theoretically, sell a few more tickets. So what happens two weeks from now, when Wrigley loyalists gather for their annual three-day Cubs Convention, and a team still in its prime yet in need of reinforcements offers up Daniel Descalso as its major addition? A franchise, mind you, that is about to launch its own TV network, is wringing every possible penny out of re-developing Wrigleyville and manages to sell naming rights to two ballpark entrances and even a bullpen gate. Pity poor Theo Epstein and Co. if Lou from Naperville demands such answers during a Q & A session. Baseball is still plenty healthy, even as death knells sound from within and without the industry. As more massive local TV contracts kick in, revenues should continue to rise. It’s awfully hard to ignore that 4% drop in attendance last year, though. Manfred blamed the brutal weather in April and May for that dip, and it certainly was a factor. Yet if a more cooperative polar vortex in 2019 ushers in a more pleasant April, the weather excuse won’t fly. And should this off-season wrap with a good 50% of teams still suffering from what Boras calls “non-competitive cancer,” it will be far easier to correlate that with soft box-office returns. In the meantime, gentle baseball consumer, get out your credit cards. Florida and Phoenix beckon, just weeks away now, followed by the regular season. It’s baseball, after all, and it’s hard not to have a good time. Especially if you’re merely rooting for the laundry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lillian Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 10 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: https://nypost.com/2019/01/05/boras-client-may-show-creative-way-to-reach-harper-machado-deals/ This is old news, but the Sherman post makes just as much sense (that the Yankees are coming up with a really creative contract) makes as much sense as Hahn asking Machado if bringing Alonso and Jay on board would sway his decision. The only thing that makes you believe Machado to the Sox is that all these desperation (so crazy, they’re brilliant!) moves would look almost as laughable as the Stewart/LaRussa days in Arizona. https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/ranking-the-five-worst-moves-of-the-dave-stewart-era-with-the-diamondbacks/ Of course, that worst GM in modern MLB history saw his former team advance to the playoffs in 2017, regardless. How do you think the player's agent would feel about such a contract? What is most advantageous for him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 @caulfield12 Control - Shift - V on PC Command - Shift - V on Mac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Lillian said: How do you think the player's agent would feel about such a contract? What is most advantageous for him? 1) Keeping his client happy 2) Setting another record for biggest contract in baseball, which puts a huge target on that player...which undoubtedly Harper would probably claim to enjoy. Edited January 8, 2019 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 1 minute ago, Quin said: @caulfield12 Control - Shift - V on PC Command - Shift - V on Mac ??? I have an I-Pad. The same one that turns LUIS Robert automatically into CAPS every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lillian Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 Here are Jay's Career stats, in various spots, in the batting order: I Split G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ Batting 1st 340 332 1559 1403 204 386 75 12 9 113 17 13 92 265 .275 .338 .365 .703 512 20 44 12 7 3 16 .332 93 Batting 2nd 260 241 1068 947 160 281 41 8 9 78 19 10 70 177 .297 .359 .385 .745 365 24 24 24 3 0 10 .356 104 Batting 3rd 12 1 13 12 2 3 2 0 1 6 0 0 0 1 .250 .308 .667 .974 8 0 1 0 0 0 0 .200 164 Batting 4th 8 1 14 12 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 3 .083 .214 .083 .298 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 .111 -17 Batting 5th 38 23 104 96 12 34 6 2 3 16 1 2 6 20 .354 .388 .552 .940 53 0 0 1 1 0 3 .419 156 Batting 6th 98 85 361 319 38 84 14 0 5 41 4 0 26 51 .263 .331 .354 .685 113 11 9 1 6 5 3 .294 88 Batting 7th 118 102 417 376 27 108 17 0 5 35 8 5 28 59 .287 .346 .372 .719 140 18 7 4 2 5 4 .328 97 Batting 8th 109 67 301 256 35 77 12 1 1 17 4 3 27 56 .301 .389 .367 .756 94 8 12 3 3 9 4 .376 108 Batting 9th 148 22 225 188 35 56 9 2 3 21 2 0 23 40 .298 .400 .415 .815 78 8 9 5 0 0 2 .366 123 Given his age, he is not likely to match his career stats, but anywhere around a .340, or higher OBP is fine for a 2 hole hitter. I still like Moncada as a leadoff hitter, given his speed. Jay profiles just fine as a #2, followed by the heart of the order. Hopefully, that would include Machado and, or Harper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 40 minutes ago, Quin said: This thread is where Soxtalk has reached self parody. No kidding. I can't believe people are ripping the FO for doing everything they can to help Manny with his decision. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FT35 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 16 minutes ago, Lillian said: Here are Jay's Career stats, in various spots, in the batting order: I Split G GS PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ Batting 1st 340 332 1559 1403 204 386 75 12 9 113 17 13 92 265 .275 .338 .365 .703 512 20 44 12 7 3 16 .332 93 Batting 2nd 260 241 1068 947 160 281 41 8 9 78 19 10 70 177 .297 .359 .385 .745 365 24 24 24 3 0 10 .356 104 Batting 3rd 12 1 13 12 2 3 2 0 1 6 0 0 0 1 .250 .308 .667 .974 8 0 1 0 0 0 0 .200 164 Batting 4th 8 1 14 12 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 3 .083 .214 .083 .298 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 .111 -17 Batting 5th 38 23 104 96 12 34 6 2 3 16 1 2 6 20 .354 .388 .552 .940 53 0 0 1 1 0 3 .419 156 Batting 6th 98 85 361 319 38 84 14 0 5 41 4 0 26 51 .263 .331 .354 .685 113 11 9 1 6 5 3 .294 88 Batting 7th 118 102 417 376 27 108 17 0 5 35 8 5 28 59 .287 .346 .372 .719 140 18 7 4 2 5 4 .328 97 Batting 8th 109 67 301 256 35 77 12 1 1 17 4 3 27 56 .301 .389 .367 .756 94 8 12 3 3 9 4 .376 108 Batting 9th 148 22 225 188 35 56 9 2 3 21 2 0 23 40 .298 .400 .415 .815 78 8 9 5 0 0 2 .366 123 Given his age, he is not likely to match his career stats, but anywhere around a .340, or higher OBP is fine for a 2 hole hitter. I still like Moncada as a leadoff hitter, given his speed. Jay profiles just fine as a #2, followed by the heart of the order. Hopefully, that would include Machado and, or Harper. Only thing is...this was back when baseball was baseball and not a collection of metric-driven behavior. Nowadays, teams stack their best hitters at the top of the lineup to get them the most ABs. I don't think the Sox would prefer a lineup that gets Jon Jay the most possible ABs. Now if they decide to play baseball again, then I think we see him 1 or 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 10 minutes ago, ptatc said: No kidding. I can't believe people are ripping the FO for doing everything they can to help Manny with his decision. Especially since if the Phillies or Yankees had done this, all we would hear are the Is Rick Hahn Sleeping jokes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 People hate on him for being a singles hitter. I would be completely ok with him hitting singles and being on base in front of Machado and Abreu. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lillian Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 Frankly, I had been thinking that, even with Machado, or Harper, the #2 hole, in the lineup, was a hole that would need to be filled, with a decent OBP hitter. That, coupled with the complete lack of offensive production from Engel, although you know I love his defense, made me consider acquiring either Pollock or Jay, for a centerfield placeholder, while Robert develops. I think this move is just fine, for a short term solution. Whoever plays CF this year, is going to have to be a plus defender, given the anticipated weak defense in the outfield corners. Even if they signed Harper, that problematic outfield defense would be an issue. Jay gives the Sox a competent defensive centerfielder and potentially fills the # 2 spot in the order, which was indeed a "hole". OPS is not that relevant, for the #2 hitter, as it is weighted heavily toward Slugging %. It is On Base % that makes a good #2 hitter. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
username Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 He's a very good defensive OF and is a great 4th OF/platoon bat. I don't understand how this is negative at all, worst case he splits time in CF and backs up the corners and provides a lefty bat. And if he has a bounceback year he's a really good stopgap and helps balance the lineup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 14 minutes ago, ptatc said: No kidding. I can't believe people are ripping the FO for doing everything they can to help Manny with his decision. Yes you can, you know what this board is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 51 minutes ago, Quin said: This thread is where Soxtalk has reached self parody. Get used to it. When more casual fans show up they don't quite get the big picture sometimes and when it's explained no one likes to back down . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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