Is anyone else embarrassed and somewhat worried about the lengths White Sox going to get Machado?

[Roughneck]

Here's the likely scenario:

Sox: Here's a huge contract. We're going to win a bunch of titles and run a train on the American League. Join us or perish.

Machado: That's cool and all, but you would still kinda suck in 2019.

Sox: Well, what if we brought over your best friends so you could play alongside them for a year until we're respectable?

 

The Sox assumed $13 mil and one-year contracts for veteran players. It's not like they're building Machado his own private clubhouse and giving him geisha.

[Soxbadger]

Its not embarrassing because they are signing MLB players who are possibly better than what the Sox have. Its an interesting strategy and could possibly work.

[GREEDY]

1 hour ago, bschmaranz said:

Did we just "get rid" of Narvaez?  I feel like you're simplifying it too much.  We got a hell of a bullpen arm for essentially a BAD catcher. 

You got a "hell of a bullpen arm" for about what he would have signed for in free agency (2/20).  

[YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES!]

3 minutes ago, Roughneck said:

Here's the likely scenario:

Sox: Here's a huge contract. We're going to win a bunch of titles and run a train on the American League. Join us or perish.

Machado: That's cool and all, but you would still kinda suck in 2019.

Sox: Well, what if we brought over your best friends so you could play alongside them for a year until we're respectable?

 

The Sox assumed $13 mil and one-year contracts for veteran players. It's not like they're building Machado his own private clubhouse and giving him geisha.

But would they give him his own area in the clubhouse where he could cheat on his wife?

[Goober]

Very, makes sox look like a sorry bunch of losers

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, GREEDY said:

You got a "hell of a bullpen arm" for about what he would have signed for in free agency (2/20).  

What exactly is the market for a back up catcher?

[Princess Dye]

It would be egg on our face if it doesnt work out. Then again, we are a tank team. The 76ers did worse to get to where theyre at.

 

Drake goddam Laroche was embarassing as all hell and unlike here that was all just pure loss, no potential for reward at all. 

[southsider2k5]

Just now, Princess Dye said:

It would be egg on our face if it doesnt work out. Then again, we are a tank team. The 76ers did worse to get to where theyre at.

 

Drake goddam Laroche was embarassing as all hell and unlike here that was all just pure loss, no potential for reward at all. 

Their GM was out trolling their own teams players on twitter under anonymous accounts.  THAT is embarrassing.

[GREEDY]

6 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

What exactly is the market for a back up catcher?

Nothing, that is what I was pointing out.  You din't get "a hell of a bullpen arm" as stated.  You got to the right to pay the "hell of a bullpen arm" about what he is worth, when there was several similar options available in free agency.

The Sox *might* have gotten some value in being able to non-tender Colome after '19 if he is bad or hurt.  

I believe the organization overestimated the reliever market and wanted to sell high on Narvaez.  

Edited January 8, 2019 by GREEDY

[SoxSteve]

1 hour ago, vilehoopster said:

Because I am both embarrassed and worried. 

We get his brother-in-law for $9 million when there's no place to play him ? That's not enough so we then sign his other MIami training partner? Did White Sox keep Castillo at catcher and get rid of the other two because Castillo is a Machado buddy? 

Too me, there is a level of desperation here that is approaching pathetic. It's embarrassing, and it's gonna be super/ ultra/ meta (pick your adjective of choice) embarassing if Sox did all this and then don't get Machado. Seriously, signing his buddies and then not signing Machado will make the Sox a laughing stock of the league, and much worse, of the fans on the North Side. 

Plus I have another worry. What if we do sign him? Are we creating a prima donna who will be impossible to control. If we have a Machado and his buddies clubhouse, who is gonna really be running the team? Are the Sox setting themselves up for a situation like Lebron James had in Cleveland? James ran the Cavaliers for a while there. He told the owners to fire the coach and bring him his choice as coach and the Cleveland owners did what he said. He told them who to trade and trades to make and the owners did that too. If once we do get Manny, isn't there a real possibility that this could happen with the White Sox. 

First of all, there are indications that Machado can be a problem: the dirty play (stomping 1st basemen's feet). There's also the lazy play; you know you're lazy when you get booed in LA during the World Series. So, he does have issues coming in. 

So we got his buddies for him. Is it really a stretch to think that he will imput and where and when his buddies play? If he's unhappy because his buddies aren't playing, is it the really that hard to to think that word might come down from up high that his buddies need to be playing more and at whatever position they want? If he's unhappy with Renteria for getting on him to hustle more and work harder, is Rick gone? I could see this happening. Couldn't you?

Also, what position is Machado going to play?  We all assume 3rd base. But doesn't he prefer shortstop? What if he insists on playing short?  Is it bye bye Anderson after the Sox invested all that time in him and he's finally ready to start paying off. 

By looking at some of the comments on the various threads, I think there are some who agree with me that our pursuit of Machodo has become . . . . something. 

the two catchers we got rid of were terrible defensive catchers that couldn't frame or throw out a runner and had no pop in their bats. Alonso is a step up from Davidson in terms of OBP and defense at ist base. who give a shit how much money he is he is making.  Also a left handed power bat in a lineup full of righties. And a great Clubhouse guy from all accounts. Jay is much better in terms on OBP than Engle and that is exactly what this lineup needs. None of those moves are game changers but the lineup and relief pitching is a big step up from last year imo. And yes do whatever you have to do to get Machado!!!!!!

[Rowand44]

12 minutes ago, Goober said:

Very, makes sox look like a sorry bunch of losers

Because they have been a bunch of sorry losers for a while now.  They're trying to change that, signing Machado goes a long way in changing that perception of the team.

[OmarComing25]

1 hour ago, vilehoopster said:

Too me, there is a level of desperation here that is approaching pathetic. It's embarrassing, and it's gonna be super/ ultra/ meta (pick your adjective of choice) embarassing if Sox did all this and then don't get Machado. Seriously, signing his buddies and then not signing Machado will make the Sox a laughing stock of the league, and much worse, of the fans on the North Side. 

To be the laughingstock of the league would require others to actually think about us at all, which they currently do not do. A failed recruiting attempt with Machado isn't going to make them start doing it.

[southsider2k5]

I said this in a different thread last night, but if this were the Phillies or Yankees doing this, we'd have multiple posts wondering why Rick Hahn is asleep at the wheel and how little money and obligation that $13 million and one year of commitment is for each of these players.

[bmags]

15 minutes ago, Tony said:

I guess the spot I'm at right now is wondering where they are at in the process. It could be a few different things. 

1. Do the Sox feel less that confident about their chances, and are pulling out last-ditch efforts in an attempt to sign Machado? Based on what some of us are hearing, that doesn't seem to be the case...but who knows. 

2. Are things close to the finish line and this was requested by Machado? Couldn't Jay have been signed after Machado commits if that was the case? 

3. In the Sox mind, do making moves like acquiring Alonso and Jay make them think they don't have to be the highest bidder and Machado may still come to Chicago? Again, don't know..

Agree, and if these were done with less certainty, I think there is a 4th option where sox feel their bid is comfortably ahead where NYY can appear attractive, and are doing this so that if they are close/match with phillies they get the nod.

[BlackSox13]

I would only be embarrassed if the White Sox weren't doing all they can to land Machado. 

Much better than sitting around complaining about how the Sox are not making an effort.

[TheTruth05]

Just now, BlackSox13 said:

I would only be embarrassed if the White Sox weren't doing all they can to land Machado. 

Much better than sitting around complaining about how the Sox are not making an effort.

Well said, doing everything you can to land a generational talent is the opposite of embarrassing. 

[frogsplash31]

No more half measures. They're going all out. If they don't get Machado, they did all they could. No shame in that.

[Saufley]

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

I said this in a different thread last night, but if this were the Phillies or Yankees doing this, we'd have multiple posts wondering why Rick Hahn is asleep at the wheel and how little money and obligation that $13 million and one year of commitment is for each of these players.

Have to agree. I don't see where it hurts the long term plan. 

[SleepyWhiteSox]

Are you embarrassed that you invest your time into watching grown men play a game?

Who cares.  They're business moves to potentially help improve the team.  The ultimate goal is a winning baseball team.

[35thstreetswarm]

I think you can believe these moves are worth the risk and justifiable from a baseball and/or financial perspective...while still acknowledging that it would be pretty humiliating for the franchise if we end up with the Manny Machado superfriends and no Manny Machado.

 

 

 

 

[Capital G]

Torn.

On one hand I am bc if we were not under such a bad light we would not need to.

On the other it shows were trying to land a big FA (and one that would actually be a great fit) which I have not seen in a while.

 

In the end it is what it is.... I am just glad were trying.

[greg775]

5 hours ago, vilehoopster said:

Because I am both embarrassed and worried. 

We get his brother-in-law for $9 million when there's no place to play him ? That's not enough so we then sign his other MIami training partner? Did White Sox keep Castillo at catcher and get rid of the other two because Castillo is a Machado buddy? 

Too me, there is a level of desperation here that is approaching pathetic. It's embarrassing, and it's gonna be super/ ultra/ meta (pick your adjective of choice) embarassing if Sox did all this and then don't get Machado. Seriously, signing his buddies and then not signing Machado will make the Sox a laughing stock of the league, and much worse, of the fans on the North Side. 

Plus I have another worry. What if we do sign him? Are we creating a prima donna who will be impossible to control. If we have a Machado and his buddies clubhouse, who is gonna really be running the team? Are the Sox setting themselves up for a situation like Lebron James had in Cleveland? James ran the Cavaliers for a while there. He told the owners to fire the coach and bring him his choice as coach and the Cleveland owners did what he said. He told them who to trade and trades to make and the owners did that too. If once we do get Manny, isn't there a real possibility that this could happen with the White Sox. 

First of all, there are indications that Machado can be a problem: the dirty play (stomping 1st basemen's feet). There's also the lazy play; you know you're lazy when you get booed in LA during the World Series. So, he does have issues coming in. 

So we got his buddies for him. Is it really a stretch to think that he will imput and where and when his buddies play? If he's unhappy because his buddies aren't playing, is it the really that hard to to think that word might come down from up high that his buddies need to be playing more and at whatever position they want? If he's unhappy with Renteria for getting on him to hustle more and work harder, is Rick gone? I could see this happening. Couldn't you?

Also, what position is Machado going to play?  We all assume 3rd base. But doesn't he prefer shortstop? What if he insists on playing short?  Is it bye bye Anderson after the Sox invested all that time in him and he's finally ready to start paying off. 

By looking at some of the comments on the various threads, I think there are some who agree with me that our pursuit of Machodo has become . . . . something. 

This is my kind of post. Worth reading. I didn't think it was somewhat embarrassing until we got Jay. Nobody can really convince me he deserves a spot on the team. It's still not "embarrassing" cause all those guys can play in MLB. I think it's somewhat embarrassing but no biggie.

[BlackSox13]

3 minutes ago, greg775 said:

This is my kind of post. Worth reading. I didn't think it was somewhat embarrassing until we got Jay. Nobody can really convince me he deserves a spot on the team. It's still not "embarrassing" cause all those guys can play in MLB. I think it's somewhat embarrassing but no biggie.

So you're saying the White Sox do not need a left handed hitting CF that can play defense as well?

 

[greg775]

21 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said:

So you're saying the White Sox do not need a left handed hitting CF that can play defense as well?

 

I respect the question but John Jay doesn't exactly hit. He doesn't steal bases. He doesn't knock in runs. I'd rather have righty hitting Engel who actually may have more pop in his bat than Jay (I'm not saying Engel is good, just perusing the stats of both). This article says it all. We got him to get Manny, his pal. That's fine, but doesn't mean I have to not fall asleep watching Jon Jay play ball.    https://southsideshowdown.com/2019/01/08/white-sox-sign-jon-jay/

Edited January 8, 2019 by greg775

[caulfield12]

5 hours ago, bschmaranz said:

Did we just "get rid" of Narvaez?  I feel like you're simplifying it too much.  We got a hell of a bullpen arm for essentially a BAD catcher. 

Yonder and Jay are also MLB caliber players and there's definite benefits to having them on the roster.  We desperately needed guys that can take a pitcher deep in counts and not strikeout like crazy.  If those two were utterly worthless talents I'd say you're right but they both make us better.

Yet he was cost-controlled, and fourth in the majors offensively.  Actually, along with Abreu, the only other position you could say that.  So while Narvaez might never repeat his numbers at Safeco, the odds of whoever we acquire via flip for Colome (who’s not exactly being underpaid) being a key contributor...or the Sox not having any catching issues to resolve all over again in 2020/21?, well, it is what it is.