Fernando Tatis Jr. thread

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 8/12/2020 at 8:01 AM, flavum said:

The Sox traded a future Hall of Famer when he was 17. It’s mostly funny.

Sox need to play in back to back ALCSs or win a World Series in the next 4-5 years to make this topic go away. 

Worst trades in MLB history are always discussed .For years we've heard about the Cubs trading Lou Brock. It's baseball lore now or is on it's way there should Tatis continue on the same trajectory.

.

[michelangelosmonkey]

19 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Ok yes we were all jumping to conclusions based on a single data point.Have it you way.  If you dont want to deal with reality theres nothing else to discuss.  You already made up your own history of events. Hahn had no power, Shield couldve been Cole Hamels or Randy Johnson, the Padres interest in Tatis was pure luck and Tatis was a one in 10,000 lotto ticket . IF the odds were that high for every player Marco Paddy ever signed he wouldn't have a job let alone be a highly respected talent evaluator.

Do you really think so little of your Soxtalk brethren that in a long thread on the trade that not one person hating the trade made any kind of sense and you have nothing to learn ?

Saying I'm not dealing with reality?  That I have nothing to learn?  I SAID you were right.  Shields WAS a disaster.  The trade WAS terrible.  But just because you "thought" he was terrible at the time, and many posters thought he was terrible, didn't make you right and the trade unsupportable.   Please show me the reality that Shields was guaranteed to be a disaster...you can't because it's not there.  You make it sound like I'm making up my own reality...that before his single terrible outing Shields in 2016 didn't have a 3.06 ERA and 1 WAR in the first 1/3 of the season after having years of success including some years of dominance.  Why is his run up to the trade different that Randy Johnson evidence I provided?  I think if you looked at RJ and Shields at the same age and after the 1/3 of the season RJ seemed way more likely to be done...and Seattle was spectacularly wrong about that.  And Tatis?  The VAST majority of young prospects end up being nothing.  Tatis was an international free agent and any team, including the San Diego could have had him for baseball chump change....now three years later he's the best player in baseball?  That's not luck?   As for denigrating my Soxtalk Brethren...they are all filled with strong opinions....Giolito is a disaster, Moncado is a disaster, Collins is a disaster, Madrigal is a disaster, Lopez is a disaster, Abreau is a disaster, Anderson is a disaster...this  week Grandal is a disaster, EE is done, Cease is worthless.  There is a TON of negativity...And you Cali...one of my favorite posters and more reasoned people here are wrong about this issue...wrong to be angry about trading for a chance to win and giving up a AAAA pitcher and a lottery ticket.  The trade at the time was a bold move to try to get the playoffs with a team that had major pieces.  It didn't work and ended up changing the organization approach.  But if it had worked...it would have been a fun play off ride with Sale unstoppable that year.  It would never be remembered except for our including that lottery ticket.     

[southsider2k5]

 

[caulfield12]

40 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

 

This directly contradicts Dennis Lin The Athletic story, who had Indians with first offer, and Rays as well as another team (pretty sure it was the Blue Jays) all making offers.

Nothing about the Cardinals.

 

Fernando Tatis Sr.: Toronto made an offer to us. At that time, he was in the DPL (Dominican Prospect League). We didn’t really know exactly what the offer was, and then they decided to sign Vladimir Jr. We had a lot of teams interested, but at that moment they didn’t have the money to sign him. They signed a lot of players before he was coming out.

A lot of people liked him, but in that moment they didn’t think that he cost that much money. A lot of people wanted to sign him, but they only wanted to spend $500,000, $600,000, $700,000, and we weren’t looking for that at that time.

Tatis Jr.: Cleveland was pretty close. Tampa. Who else? I didn’t have that many teams trying to sign me.

 

https://theathletic.com/884960/2019/03/25/everybody-was-surprised-but-here-we-are-an-oral-history-of-how-the-padres-acquired-fernando-tatis-jr/

[flavum]

2 homers (11), 7 rbi (28)

[WilliamTell]

4 minutes ago, flavum said:

2 homers (11), 7 rbi (28)

At least Machado is 0 for 5. I'll take that as a small consolation prize lol.

[JuliusO1274]

After today this deserves a bump. The more time goes on the worse it looks.

[caulfield12]

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/29685137/padres-fernando-tatis-jr-angers-rangers-late-grand-slam-rout

 

[SoxAce]

The fact that Tatis had to apologize for hitting a grand slam on a 3-0 count is the epitome of everything that’s wrong with baseball.

Bauer at least gets it.

 

[caulfield12]

15 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

The fact that Tatis had to apologize for hitting a grand slam on a 3-0 count is the epitome of everything that’s wrong with baseball.

Bauer at least gets it.

 

https://www.dallasnews.com/sports/rangers/2020/08/18/i-didnt-like-it-rangers-manager-chris-woodward-not-pleased-with-fernando-tatis-jr-swinging-3-0-with-large-lead/

[caulfield12]

8 hours ago, flavum said:

2 homers (11), 7 rbi (28)

https://www.mlb.com/news/fernando-tatis-jr-grand-slam-third-career-multihomer-game?partnerId=zh-20200818-156906-MLB&qid=1026&bt_ee=%2FBNke3AzQAiO%2Bskb1D0gOrG8NaHI2CEDQvKlO6Rm3DuxK2YmW9Y5cLTSIAa3xCF%2B&bt_ts=1597750277795

[SCCWS]

38 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

The fact that Tatis had to apologize for hitting a grand slam on a 3-0 count is the epitome of everything that’s wrong with baseball.

Bauer at least gets it.

 

Agree

[bmags]

While I think it's dumb to be mad about that, I think this also has just become an outrage topic.

Bad: player hits home run and celebrates - then gets a hard object thrown at his head

Not even as close to bad: player hits home run and celebrates - losing manager says "that's bad"

We really gonna act like in football coaches don't get mad about a team going for it on 4th down up 21 or "running up the score"?

Players should be able to celebrate without getting injured, but it feels like people are trying to get upset if the opposing pitcher or manager doesn't say "yeah that was great, we all love celebrations, I really appreciate getting to see that up close"

[wrathofhahn]

Who needs Tatis when you can draft a slap hitter like Madrigal?

[knightni]

This thread serves no positive purpose and it can't be undone.

Let sleeping dogs lie or it will be locked and dissenters will be suspended.

[Chicago White Sox]

Seriously, unless it’s SoxFest and you plan on putting Hahn on blast, you might as well act if we never actually had Tatis in the first place.

[oldsox]

I am not dissenting, but he did have 2 homers yesterday with 7 RBI.  Just contributing.

[knightni]

10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Seriously, unless it’s SoxFest and you plan on putting Hahn on blast, you might as well act if we never actually had Tatis in the first place.

It's not like Hahn hasn't already been blasted for it already.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

57 minutes ago, bmags said:

While I think it's dumb to be mad about that, I think this also has just become an outrage topic.

Bad: player hits home run and celebrates - then gets a hard object thrown at his head

Not even as close to bad: player hits home run and celebrates - losing manager says "that's bad"

We really gonna act like in football coaches don't get mad about a team going for it on 4th down up 21 or "running up the score"?

Players should be able to celebrate without getting injured, but it feels like people are trying to get upset if the opposing pitcher or manager doesn't say "yeah that was great, we all love celebrations, I really appreciate getting to see that up close"

Why do people continue to compare untimed sports to timed sports?

Also, why are you excusing a manager's inability to accept the realities of the game? 

Tatis' own fucking manager called him out for playing hard and playing his game regardless of the situation. That's so damn embarrassing. Hosmer and Machado TALKED TO HIM lol. Machado is an asshole; he literally has done dirty and cheap things on the diamond that could cause injury and he's going to give me a speech on what is right and wrong about a 3-0 count swinging away? Tatis should demand a trade.

The Nationls blew a 4 run lead yesterday in the 9th. The Rangers have scored 16 runs in the 8th and 9th inning in a game before. 

Baseball has no clock, there is no point in which you should stop trying to hit the baseball. 

Edited August 18, 2020 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

In addition Sox fans need to get over Tatis; it's just weird. The Sox have started to show signs of being a good drafting/developing organization and when you become that, you're inevitably going to trade away some lottery tickets and talent that pans out.

[bmags]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Why do people continue to compare untimed sports to timed sports?

Also, why are you excusing a manager's inability to accept the realities of the game? 

Tatis' own fucking manager called him out for playing hard and playing his game regardless of the situation. That's so damn embarrassing. Hosmer and Machado TALKED TO HIM lol. Machado is an asshole; he literally has done dirty and cheap things on the diamond that could cause injury and he's going to give me a speech on what is right and wrong about a 3-0 count swinging away?

The Nationls blew a 4 run lead yesterday in the 9th. The Rangers have scored 16 runs in the 8th and 9th inning in a game before. 

Baseball has no clock, there is no point in which you should stop trying to hit the baseball. 

1) I missed that the rangers threw behind Machado after, so that's the stuff that's actually b.s., I thought the opposing manager was just salty. I think it's dumb, but I don't really feel the need to whine about an opposing manager feeling like his team was embarrassed and placing the focus off his team.

2) Having read the padres managers comments, it really seemed like he was more upset that Tatis was given a "take" sign, and he swung. Personally, I think the signs to swing or take on 3-0 are peak over-managing, but it happens.

I am just annoyed by the overkill transition from the legitimate campaign to stop hitting batters after stuff like this (like TA), to at the time believing the outrage was at the opposing manager saying he doesn't like it. I think it's dumb, but not same stratosphere as trying to throw at Machado the next pitch.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

6 minutes ago, bmags said:

1) I missed that the rangers threw behind Machado after, so that's the stuff that's actually b.s., I thought the opposing manager was just salty. I think it's dumb, but I don't really feel the need to whine about an opposing manager feeling like his team was embarrassed and placing the focus off his team.

2) Having read the padres managers comments, it really seemed like he was more upset that Tatis was given a "take" sign, and he swung. Personally, I think the signs to swing or take on 3-0 are peak over-managing, but it happens.

I am just annoyed by the overkill transition from the legitimate campaign to stop hitting batters after stuff like this (like TA), to at the time believing the outrage was at the opposing manager saying he doesn't like it. I think it's dumb, but not same stratosphere as trying to throw at Machado the next pitch.

I agree with part of your first point; it is literally Woodwards job to protect his players so him ripping him means nothing to me. My entire issue is with Tingler the dingle berry ripping into his own player for hitting a grand slam instead of taking a pitch. That is so comically absurd. Anyone who thought Ricky was the worst manager in baseball needs to give that title up, because Tingle stole the show.

Hosmer and Machado had a talk with him; Hosmer literally told the Rangers dugout he'd talk to him right after he hit it. It's embarrassing for the game. Tatis hit a grand slam to take the MLB home run lead as a 20 year old kid and his manager is talking about how it was mean to do to the other team and his own teammates are saying he was wrong. Zach Davies the only Padre that got it; the Padres bullpen is trash too which is why this is all so hilarious.

So wait? Are you telling me if the Rangers came back from down 7 in the 8th that they would have said the win didn't count? If MLB wants a slaughter rule to protect feelings then implement one, otherwise stfu and take your grand slam beatings like a man.

Edited August 18, 2020 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[hogan873]

Absolutely ridiculous that Tatis Jr was expected to apologize for hitting a grand slam on a 3-0 count with a big lead.  Maybe the other team shouldn't have walked the bases loaded with one of the best hitters in baseball due up.  Bauer is right in his tweet.  Apologizing for being good is so stupid, and I can see why people hate baseball.  This isn't freaking little league.  To hell with their feelings.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

Exactly.  It's not little league baseball it's Major League Baseball. The players want their game played a certain way because it's the best league in the world and they love the game more than you do.  I will never understand when fans get mad at the players for wanting their game to be played at the highest level.  

[flavum]

His manager gave him the take sign on 3-0 up 7 runs in the 8th. Nothing wrong with that. Tatis hit a grand slam. Great, it worked out for him. But hitting 3-1 is still a good count to hit, or you get the rbi walk.