Fernando Tatis Jr. thread

[caulfield12]

3 for his last 23.

Six games without a homer.

Under 1.000 OPS.

9 k's.

Batting average from over .300 now down to .277.

 

Really his first slump since the first couple of weeks of the season, then the shoulder injury.  18 games missed on the year (first shoulder, then the Covid-19 scare, then 2 days for an oblique strain), still 3rd in homers with 17.

15 errors in 46 games.   On pace for 47 if he continues with same projected rate and plays in the final 98 games (pretty unlikely.)

2.7 bWAR. 2.4 fWAR.

6.8 and 6.5 projections over the full season (and that's, once again, based on playing 46 out of 64 games.)

Edited June 10, 2021 by caulfield12

[Harry Chappas]

13 hours ago, fathom said:

Of course Tatis absolutely sucked against the Cubs

it is f'ing annoying that he couldn't light them up.  He will now go crazy for two weeks.  I have him in fantasy baseball so it's a double whammy.

[caulfield12]

https://www.mlb.com/news/mom-makes-catch-with-baby-in-hand

[oldsox]

Watched part of the Rockies/Padres game yesterday, after Tatis hit his 477 foot jack, and the announcer said, "When his career is over, the Tatis trade will probably go down as the worst in MLB history."  IOW, exceeding the Lou Brock trade.

I wish Preller would write a book and use a chapter to discuss how this trade went down.

[Quin]

16 minutes ago, oldsox said:

Watched part of the Rockies/Padres game yesterday, after Tatis hit his 477 foot jack, and the announcer said, "When his career is over, the Tatis trade will probably go down as the worst in MLB history."  IOW, exceeding the Lou Brock trade.

I wish Preller would write a book and use a chapter to discuss how this trade went down.

While the Sox should never live down this trade, Preller should definitely lead off with "provide other teams with questionable and/or false medical data"

[Two-Gun Pete]

On 6/10/2021 at 2:21 PM, caulfield12 said:

https://www.mlb.com/news/mom-makes-catch-with-baby-in-hand

Yeah, I wish you (and more importantly, MLB) wouldn't spread these sorts of videos around. I mean, Americans are already renowned for doing stupid shit. And encouraging Americans to do stupid shit means that they WILL do stupid shit.

I get that its great that the catch was made in THIS case, but it'll be fookin tragic if/when the next hard-hit ball is missed by whomever is holding an infant.

YMMV.

1 hour ago, oldsox said:

Watched part of the Rockies/Padres game yesterday, after Tatis hit his 477 foot jack, and the announcer said, "When his career is over, the Tatis trade will probably go down as the worst in MLB history."  IOW, exceeding the Lou Brock trade.

I wish Preller would write a book and use a chapter to discuss how this trade went down.

All of us that watched that season KNEW that they had to back up the truck, and sell, sell, sell well before this moronic trade was even a rumor.

That this org was so stoopud to believe that that roster, with that manager only needed James Shields to magically compete proves that stupidity is a disease. 

Its 5 years on, and I'm still enraged by it. I think I got banned (again) from WSI when it happened.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Two-Gun Pete

[oldsox]

5 hours ago, Quin said:

While the Sox should never live down this trade, Preller should definitely lead off with "provide other teams with questionable and/or false medical data"

Quin, your response is too simplistic.  Everybody knew Shields was damaged goods; he couldn't get anybody out in his last few pre-trade starts.  What we don't know is how the dialogue went down between the two GM's.  Hahn got hoodwinked, or worse.

[Quin]

3 minutes ago, oldsox said:

Quin, your response is too simplistic.  Everybody knew Shields was damaged goods; he couldn't get anybody out in his last few pre-trade starts.  What we don't know is how the dialogue went down between the two GM's.  Hahn got hoodwinked, or worse.

Oh yeah, most def. Again, the Sox should never, ever live this trade down. Shields was hot garbage at the time and they shouldn't have given up anything more than EJ, I'd anything at all.

But Preller's deals that season (I'm including Boston and Miami) show the man wasn't making deals in good faith.

Maybe it was cosmic justice for the Sirotka trade, who knows.

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, Quin said:

Oh yeah, most def. Again, the Sox should never, ever live this trade down. Shields was hot garbage at the time and they shouldn't have given up anything more than EJ, I'd anything at all.

But Preller's deals that season (I'm including Boston and Miami) show the man wasn't making deals in good faith.

Maybe it was cosmic justice for the Sirotka trade, who knows.

One thing that annoys me is this idea we wouldn't or couldn't have signed Robert had we somehow retained Tatis, Jr.

That really doesn't make sense...this idea what how badly that trade went, and there was "only" evidence of the player Tatis was eventually going to be the first two months of the 2017 season (Robert signed at the end of May that year)...that it somehow pushed the White Sox to double down with Luis Robert, even though the Cardinals actually offered more money.

Law didn't declare Tatis the #1 prospect in baseball until after the minor league All-Star breaks, 2018.

https://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/missions/article/ESPN-s-Law-Missions-Tatis-No-1-prospect-in-13089606.php

 

More than anything, because of the subsidy for the Shields contract (which we should have received ANYWAY, see Thome deal for Rowand), we gave up talent instead of absorbing a bigger financial hit...taking the cheap way out.   Fine, give up EJ, he was already tarnished but had some prospect glitter remaining.

Edited June 18, 2021 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

22nd homer in about 60 less plate appearances and 14 fewer games than Vladdy Guerrero, Jr.

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2021&month=0&season1=2021&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2021-01-01&enddate=2021-12-31&sort=5,d

Semien, Tatis, Jr., Moncada all in the top 11 for MLB...all with White Sox ties

[caulfield12]

Story on the company that makes personalized bats for TA7, Tatis, 20% of MLB...

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/31045959/where-did-fernando-tatis-jr-get-awesome-bat-company-mlb-next-big-thing

[caulfield12]

16 errors, far and away major league lead.

3 strikeouts.

Tried to force yet another double play throw (to make the highlight reels and ESPN/MLB Network) that wasn’t there while hurdling in the air over the baserunner.  Led to a 2-2 tie at the time.

Somehow managed to beat Dodgers seven out of their last eight meetings.

 

https://www.espn.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_/position/ss/sort/errors/count/8/order/false

Javy Baez (13), Iglesias, Torres and Bichette other shortstops in double figures but with more GP.

Tatis extrapolated pace is for just under 50 errors, but will likely to closer to 40 due to number of games already missed.

Edited June 24, 2021 by caulfield12

[South Side Hit Men]

The White Sox could have used three home runs last night. Thank you Rick Hahn for decades of torture,

 

[caulfield12]

27th homer to tie Vladdy Jr, Ohtani way out front with 31.

Hardest hit homer of career at 116 EV.

 

Two hardest hit in team history were Franchy Cordero bombs at 116.3 and 116.9 back in 2018.

Vladdy with 1.109 OPS, Tatis at 1.091 and Ohtani 1.066…only three over 1.000 in majors.

 

Not as much talk about moving him off SS these days.  Jinxed, error #18…but something tells me they’re willing to live with it for now, unless/until it starts to affect his hitting.  Has managed to separate the two for the most part.

He also did something I’ve never seen on a baseball field just now.  He jumped into the air to snare a liner, and actually kicked to get even more elevation.  Almost like he was swimming upwards to get the ball.  Had to be at least a high 30’s or low 40’s vertical.   Sorta like the result of the game is secondary at this point.

 

Human Baseball Player Double Jumps Live On Camera

Luke Plunkett

Tue, July 6, 2021, 4:35 PM

Look, I’m Australian and know almost nothing about the sport of baseball, but I know enough about it—and the human beings playing it—to know that this is not normal.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/human-baseball-player-double-jumps-233500354.html

Edited July 7, 2021 by caulfield12

[oldsox]

How does one explain to an Australian who knows almost nothing about baseball that this player (Tatis, Jr.) was given about $800,000 by another team at age 16 and then traded for an over the hill, old, and expensive pitcher named James Shields, all this before Tatis had ever played a professional game?

[Balta1701]

7 hours ago, oldsox said:

How does one explain to an Australian who knows almost nothing about baseball that this player (Tatis, Jr.) was given about $800,000 by another team at age 16 and then traded for an over the hill, old, and expensive pitcher named James Shields, all this before Tatis had ever played a professional game?

You find a list of the worst trades in MLB history, make sure it includes the Lou Brock deal on there somewhere because if it doesn't then it isn't a good list (the ones I just checked...didn't?), and say that teams have been doing really stupid things in baseball for its entire history.

[caulfield12]

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/padres/story/2021-07-30/padres-fernando-tatis-rockies-jon-gray-ryan-weathers
 

Left shoulder again. Third time this season.

Unfortunate for baseball if both he and Acuna are down, Soto on a team going nowhere…Ohtani and Vladdy Jr. hard pressed to make it to the post-season.

Everyone is going to start pushing for him to undergo surgery, since he’s been dealing with the exact same problem since 2016/17.

[ron883]

8 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/padres/story/2021-07-30/padres-fernando-tatis-rockies-jon-gray-ryan-weathers
 

Left shoulder again. Third time this season.

Unfortunate for baseball if both he and Acuna are down, Soto on a team going nowhere…Ohtani and Vladdy Jr. hard pressed to make it to the post-season.

Everyone is going to start pushing for him to undergo surgery, since he’s been dealing with the exact same problem since 2016/17.

What is wrong with his shoulder exactly? 

[Quin]

32 minutes ago, ron883 said:

What is wrong with his shoulder exactly? 

Keeps dislocating it. Don't 100% quote me on this, but after he dislocated it from his swing, surgery was recommended - basically was told it'll keep happening, but each time would be worse than the last if he doesn't have surgery. Surgery would be season ending. He and the team took the gamble on this one. 

[ron883]

On 7/9/2021 at 8:30 AM, oldsox said:

How does one explain to an Australian who knows almost nothing about baseball that this player (Tatis, Jr.) was given about $800,000 by another team at age 16 and then traded for an over the hill, old, and expensive pitcher named James Shields, all this before Tatis had ever played a professional game?

It's simple. Just tell him "Kenny always gets his guy". 

[ron883]

2 hours ago, Quin said:

Keeps dislocating it. Don't 100% quote me on this, but after he dislocated it from his swing, surgery was recommended - basically was told it'll keep happening, but each time would be worse than the last if he doesn't have surgery. Surgery would be season ending. He and the team took the gamble on this one. 

That sounds awful. Props to him for sticking it out and dealing with all the pain. Putting off surgery and constantly dislocating it seems like something that could have long-term implications... Am I talking out of my ass @ptatc?

[caulfield12]

10 hours ago, Quin said:

Keeps dislocating it. Don't 100% quote me on this, but after he dislocated it from his swing, surgery was recommended - basically was told it'll keep happening, but each time would be worse than the last if he doesn't have surgery. Surgery would be season ending. He and the team took the gamble on this one. 

https://www.outkick.com/david-chao-md-fernando-tatis-jr-injures-his-same-shoulder-for-a-fifth-time-this-year/
 

Fifth time since spring training…the one swinging and the one handed follow-through was arguably the worst.

 

Certainly, another MRI is coming. If there is no new structural damage, the team and player could decide once again to rehab and keep playing since the Padres are very much in contention for a playoff spot. Labral repair will come when there is more damage, risk of long-term issues or the team is out of playoff consideration. Tatis and the team have made the decision for a calculated risk to continue through four episodes, but now there is a fifth.

Kudos to Tatis for playing through quite effectively so far this season with 31 home runs and 23 stolen bases. I hope he can continue to be effective without causing further damage. The question is when will the player and team say enough is enough. Surgery is a matter of when, not if.

[greg775]

4 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

https://www.outkick.com/david-chao-md-fernando-tatis-jr-injures-his-same-shoulder-for-a-fifth-time-this-year/
 

Fifth time since spring training…the one swinging and the one handed follow-through was arguably the worst.

 

Certainly, another MRI is coming. If there is no new structural damage, the team and player could decide once again to rehab and keep playing since the Padres are very much in contention for a playoff spot. Labral repair will come when there is more damage, risk of long-term issues or the team is out of playoff consideration. Tatis and the team have made the decision for a calculated risk to continue through four episodes, but now there is a fifth.

Kudos to Tatis for playing through quite effectively so far this season with 31 home runs and 23 stolen bases. I hope he can continue to be effective without causing further damage. The question is when will the player and team say enough is enough. Surgery is a matter of when, not if.

This injury sounds especially painful, bad. Sounds like he went down in a heap again. It's all over Twitter. Obviously the right think to do is get it fixed now, playoffs be darned. Baseball can't be fun when you have a significant injury and pain. In this day and age especially it's surprising he'd play with constant subluxation of shoulder, repeat episodes. Sad.

[EloyJenkins]

1 hour ago, greg775 said:

This injury sounds especially painful, bad. Sounds like he went down in a heap again. It's all over Twitter. Obviously the right think to do is get it fixed now, playoffs be darned. Baseball can't be fun when you have a significant injury and pain. In this day and age especially it's surprising he'd play with constant subluxation of shoulder, repeat episodes. Sad.

And with every other team loading up...no guarantee they even make it past wild vard game anyways. His career is more important to their Future than yet another issue.

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, EloyJenkins said:

And with every other team loading up...no guarantee they even make it past wild vard game anyways. His career is more important to their Future than yet another issue.

At the very least, looks like this time he will be out something like 10-14 days…

Without a reliable 3rd starter, it’s hard to imagine them even winning the divisional series right now, but they are ultra confident against the Dodgers (beat them six of last seven)…have a feeling he will give it at least one more go before giving up on the season. 
 

Kim is a Gold Glove level SS, he just hasn’t been able to make much headway offensively as the adjustment usually is so massive. That said, they’ve played some of their best ball of the year coming together without various top players in the lineup this year.