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You can criticize Coop if you want to, but it'd be weird to claim that he's old school because he's pushing pitchers from curveballs to sliders when that's exactly what the new thinking in baseball is

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1 minute ago, Jake said:

You can criticize Coop if you want to, but it'd be weird to claim that he's old school because he's pushing pitchers from curveballs to sliders when that's exactly what the new thinking in baseball is

We criticize him for being old school because he teaches pitchers to a)  sacrifice velocity for control and b) throw sinkers. Both of those are bad in today's game. 

I don't understand messing with a guy with a ++ curveball. Giolito, with his current fastball and a curve is exactly what you want in today's pitcher. He has a 95 mph fastball that hitters have trouble picking up. Low fastballs get kilt, and sinkers/2 seamers have the highest BAA in aggregate of any pitch from 2016-present. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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8 minutes ago, fathom said:

His slider was significantly better on the Nats. He looks like a totally different pitcher, in a bad way, from his Nats days.

Yes, his 5 ERA while walking more per nine, and giving up more than a hit an inning looked much better than last year - especially the last two months, in which he was very good. 

No chance. It's been two starts this year. Relax.

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2 minutes ago, fathom said:

Should have traded Jace. Bullpen sucks 

Yep. Should have sold high on him last year ala Tommy Kahnle. Fry is gonna be out of baseball once the the 3 batter minimum reliever rule takes effect. 

Edited by OneDog847
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Just now, OneDog847 said:

Yep. Should have sold him last year ala Tommy Kahnle. Fry is gonna be out of baseball once the the 3 batter minimum reliever rule takes effect. 

Thats a stupid rule, hope it doesnt take effect.

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9 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

He didn't have a slider. He only threw a curveball. The weird thing is both Giolito and Lopez have both picked up a slider and completely lost their curveballs since joining the Sox. I really don't know why they taught Giolito a slider because he didn't need it. His curve was always ++ before he got here. 

It sure looked like a slider in his big strikeout game against the Braves

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1 minute ago, fathom said:

It sure looked like a slider in his big strikeout game against the Braves

A hard curveball with short break looks like a slider. It doesn't mean it isn't a curveball though. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yes, his 5 ERA while walking more per nine, and giving up more than a hit an inning looked much better than last year - especially the last two months, in which he was very good. 

No chance. It's been two starts this year. Relax.

Wasn’t he one of the worst pitchers in baseball in terms of metrics for almost all the year?

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2 minutes ago, fathom said:

Wasn’t he one of the worst pitchers in baseball in terms of metrics for almost all the year?

Yes. He was right there with Giolito amongst the bottom 5 qualified pitchers in FIP and xFIP. 

Last year in xFIP: 

Giolito: 5.46

Lopez: 5.22.

They were the two worst in baseball in that regard. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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Just now, fathom said:

Wasn’t he one of the worst pitchers in baseball in terms of metrics for almost all the year?

What metrics would those be? Some metrics made it look for much of the year like his ERA may have overstated his success, but they wouldn't have led to the conclusion that he was pitching badly

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