The Rick Hahn Dynasty

[mqr]

23 hours ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

We had a Kenny Williams problem.  He took over a 95 win team with the #1 rated farm system in 2000 and left a dumpster fire 12 years later.  

After multiple division championships, winning seasons and a world series. Kenny the GM wasn't great by any means, but to act like he was THE problem (Or now getting in the way of the great Rick Hahn) is ridiculous.

Edited April 11, 2019 by mqr

[TheTruth05]

21 minutes ago, GreatScott82 said:

Exactly. The White Sox have been irrelevant for 10+ years now. They embarked on a rebuild that the fans bought into, because their old ways of doing business was piss poor and led to crappy records and uninspiring on-field performances. They set themselves up perfectly for this 2019 offseason to connect on a generational talent to expedite this rebuild, and got bogged down by $50 million. Pathetic. The dagger in all of this is that they probably were being ridiculously presumptuous in believing guys like Bogaerts or Arenado would be there the next winter.... NOPE! I've already heard Hahn mention, "When the time comes, we will eventually start looking to trade some of our prospect depth to acquire outside talent". Welp, so much for prospect depth and development. Due to their shortcomings, the White Sox will go back to their old ways of doing business. Not good! White Sox fans deserve better. JR is out of touch with the reality of modern baseball an KW and Hahn are bad at their jobs. For every good move they make, and there has been a few, they probably have made 2-3 bad moves. Not a good ratio if you ask me. 

Make this post the banner. A+

[Greg Hibbard]

Does Rick Hahn get any credit for locking up Tim Anderson long term in what's looking like a VERY good deal?

If I recall correctly, a lot of people thought he wasn't even a totally legit option as late as mid last year.

Or are we just doing just bad stuff in this thread?

Edited April 11, 2019 by Greg Hibbard

[chitownsportsfan]

5 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Does Rick Hahn get any credit for locking up Tim Anderson long term in what's looking like a VERY good deal?

If I recall correctly, a lot of people thought he wasn't even a totally legit option as late as mid last year.

Or are we just doing just bad stuff in this thread?

They basically bet on TA being a 1.5 WAR player and that's so far about what he's been.  Hahn is fine at negotiating  pre-arb extensions.  It's the one thing you could say he's actually good at.  But he has brutal weaknesses elsewhere.

Edited April 11, 2019 by chitownsportsfan

[Balta1701]

4 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Does Rick Hahn get any credit for locking up Tim Anderson long term in what's looking like a VERY good deal?

If I recall correctly, a lot of people thought he wasn't even a totally legit option as late as mid last year.

Or are we just doing just bad stuff in this thread?

Yes, if this deal turns out well he gets credit for it. 

What is done with that deal? Can we build a team around that deal? If not, can we trade him for something useful before he hits free agency? What is the return on that deal like?

Those questions...sound suspiciously like a repeat of what happened over the last few years with 3 other players. 

[Dick Allen]

5 minutes ago, Greg Hibbard said:

Does Rick Hahn get any credit for locking up Tim Anderson long term in what's looking like a VERY good deal?

If I recall correctly, a lot of people thought he wasn't even a totally legit option as late as mid last year.

Or are we just doing just bad stuff in this thread?

So no one is to take what happens in the first 11 games of the season as meaningful unless it fits the narrative that the rebuild is going smoothly? 

Anderson made strides last year in the field without a doubt. His hitting, after a decent start, fell back to previous norms. We will see what happens. I do know he will not hit .500. Hopefully he will improve to the point where he really is a guy we want at SS for a good team.

[greg775]

2 hours ago, GreatScott82 said:

Exactly. The White Sox have been irrelevant for 10+ years now. They embarked on a rebuild that the fans bought into, because their old ways of doing business was piss poor and led to crappy records and uninspiring on-field performances. They set themselves up perfectly for this 2019 offseason to connect on a generational talent to expedite this rebuild, and got bogged down by $50 million. Pathetic. The dagger in all of this is that they probably were being ridiculously presumptuous in believing guys like Bogaerts or Arenado would be there the next winter.... NOPE! I've already heard Hahn mention, "When the time comes, we will eventually start looking to trade some of our prospect depth to acquire outside talent". Welp, so much for prospect depth and development. Due to their shortcomings, the White Sox will go back to their old ways of doing business. Not good! White Sox fans deserve better. JR is out of touch with the reality of modern baseball an KW and Hahn are bad at their jobs. For every good move they make, and there has been a few, they probably have made 2-3 bad moves. Not a good ratio if you ask me. 

Excellent post. Except for the third sentence. I never bought into the rebuild. Hate every minute of it. Folks, you don't have to totally rebuild/tank in the pathetic Central Division. I mean get good enough to contend and win it 2 to 3 out of every five years and see what happens in the playoffs. 

[Dick Allen]

The AL Central is the Sox saving grace. It probably is the only division in baseball where a team that doesn't spend huge money has at least a shot of sustained winning. 

[oldsox]

Just noticed that the apple of Rick Hahn's eye, James Shields, is the last pitcher to give up a hit to Chris Davis.  Sometime last September.

[greg775]

Actually that Eloy trade might nullify the one in which we lost you-know-who to the Padres.  If Eloy is a Hall of Famer, that's an incredible feather for Hahn. Q has been a capable pitcher but he's no Sandy Koufax.

[Moan4Yoan]

13 hours ago, Tony said:

It doesn’t nullify anything. 

The Q trade has a chance to be an absolute STEAL for the Sox, both now and in the future. 

The Tatis trade has a chance to be an absolute DISASTER for the Sox, both now and in the future. 

They should be applauded for one and criticized for the other. 

Exactly.  We could have both guys right now as cornerstones.  For a team that is cheap and won’t spend big money on big free agents, Tatis would have been huge to have right now.  Shields was a bum and did absolutely zero for the Sox.  He was acquired by Hahn and Kenny in a futile attempt to compete during a mediocre season.

Edited April 13, 2019 by Harper2Sox

[NWINFan]

Ultimately RIck Hahn will be judged on this rebuild. It's his baby. He decided on a definite course and has to see it through. Prospects have to be called up at the right time and then developed in the right way. He must realize now that big-time free agents will not be coming to the White Sox. So he must find a way to create a veteran presence on this team without big contracts. A lot is riding on this. It the rebuild doesn't succeed, the White Sox will probably become the Pirates.  One thing is certain: this process is painfully slow. We will see if it gets slower.

[WBWSF]

Hahn has the worse record of any GM in MLB the last 6 seasons. He has wasted millions of dollars on bad players. He won't sign any premium free agents but will waste millions of dollars on LaRoche, Shields, Jay, Alonso and numerous other players. He should count his blessings he still has a job.

[StringerBell44]

As painful as the start of the season has been...I can't help but wonder what all the gloom and doom fuss is about.  The White Sox have loads of talent throughout the organization - even if some of the players are currently hurt - and some are already making strides at the MLB level.  Assuming Andrew Vaughn falls to #3 this draft and Kopech returns to 100%...the only glaring need would be adding a veteran, top of rotation-ish pitcher AKA Gerrit Cole.  

 

2021 Line-up:

1.)  Robert  -  CF

2.)  Madrigal  -  2B

3.)  Moncada  -  3B

4.)  Jimenez  -  RF

5.)  Vaughn  -  1B

6.)  Abreu/Free Agent  -  DH

7.)  Anderson  -  SS

8.)  Collins/Zavala  -  C

9.)  Basabe  -  RF

 

2021 Rotation:

1.)  Cease

2.)  Kopech

3.)  Cole

4.)  Rodon

5.)  Dunning/Giolito/Lopez

 

 

I realize 2021 isn't tomorrow, but it also isn't thattt far away.  MLB rebuilds don't happen overnight, but I could def get behind a 2021 roster composed of those players.  Stay positive.

[poppysox]

On 4/12/2019 at 10:52 PM, greg775 said:

Actually that Eloy trade might nullify the one in which we lost you-know-who to the Padres.  If Eloy is a Hall of Famer, that's an incredible feather for Hahn. Q has been a capable pitcher but he's no Sandy Koufax.

The trades of Sale, Q & Eaton along with pre-arb early extensions show RH's overall negotiation abilities.  The Shields deal is the only black mark for me.  In hind sight we overpaid for Shields but we were shoring up the rotation.  The Cubs overpaid for Q just like we overpaid for Shields.  You're not going to win them all.

[Moan4Yoan]

Just now, poppysox said:

The trades of Sale, Q & Eaton along with pre-arb early extensions show RH's overall negotiation abilities.  The Shields deal is the only black mark for me.  In hind sight we overpaid for Shields but we were shoring up the rotation.  The Cubs overpaid for Q just like we overpaid for Shields.  You're not going to win them all.

Shields was older and bad at the time he was acquired.  His velocity was already declining.  You don’t overpay for pitchers like that.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

20 hours ago, StringerBell44 said:

As painful as the start of the season has been...I can't help but wonder what all the gloom and doom fuss is about.  The White Sox have loads of talent throughout the organization - even if some of the players are currently hurt - and some are already making strides at the MLB level.  Assuming Andrew Vaughn falls to #3 this draft and Kopech returns to 100%...the only glaring need would be adding a veteran, top of rotation-ish pitcher AKA Gerrit Cole.  

 

2021 Line-up:

1.)  Robert  -  CF

2.)  Madrigal  -  2B

3.)  Moncada  -  3B

4.)  Jimenez  -  RF

5.)  Vaughn  -  1B

6.)  Abreu/Free Agent  -  DH

7.)  Anderson  -  SS

8.)  Collins/Zavala  -  C

9.)  Basabe  -  RF

 

2021 Rotation:

1.)  Cease

2.)  Kopech

3.)  Cole

4.)  Rodon

5.)  Dunning/Giolito/Lopez

 

 

I realize 2021 isn't tomorrow, but it also isn't thattt far away.  MLB rebuilds don't happen overnight, but I could def get behind a 2021 roster composed of those players.  Stay positive.

Cole won’t happen but the future is very bright regardless. The offense is going to straight up mash. It’ll be fun to watch, unless of course one revels in their own misery.

[poppysox]

11 minutes ago, Harper2Sox said:

Shields was older and bad at the time he was acquired.  His velocity was already declining.  You don’t overpay for pitchers like that.

As I said...I wish we didn't.

 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

15 minutes ago, poppysox said:

The trades of Sale, Q & Eaton along with pre-arb early extensions show RH's overall negotiation abilities.  The Shields deal is the only black mark for me.  In hind sight we overpaid for Shields but we were shoring up the rotation.  The Cubs overpaid for Q just like we overpaid for Shields.  You're not going to win them all.

Yep. Anyone watching Q in the first half of 2017 could see he wasn’t the same pitcher he was was prior to that season. For whatever reason, I don’t know but he was off. And he hasn’t been the same pitcher since. I’m surprised Theo was willing to unload not just one but two prospects with huge ceilings for a declining pitcher.

[poppysox]

4 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Yep. Anyone watching Q in the first half of 2017 could see he wasn’t the same pitcher he was was prior to that season. For whatever reason, I don’t know but he was off. And he hasn’t been the same pitcher since. I’m surprised Theo was willing to unload not just one but two prospects with huge ceilings for a declining pitcher.

GM's do strange things when trying to find what they believe to be the final piece.  Many Cub fans believe Chapman was worth the price they paid.  

[pcq]

10 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Cole won’t happen but the future is very bright regardless. The offense is going to straight up mash. It’ll be fun to watch, unless of course one revels in their own misery.

It would not be crazy to have Robert on Charlotte by August 1. 

[Sleepy Harold]

16 hours ago, poppysox said:

GM's do strange things when trying to find what they believe to be the final piece.  Many Cub fans believe Chapman was worth the price they paid.  

They won the World Series, I think it was worth it for them. 

[Jose Abreu]

3 minutes ago, Sleepy Harold said:

 They won the World Series, I think it was worth it for them. 

We've had this debate plenty of times here, but I've always thought they would have won it without him too, and that's excluding that he wasn't particularly good in the postseason 

[ron883]

19 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

We've had this debate plenty of times here, but I've always thought they would have won it without him too, and that's excluding that he wasn't particularly good in the postseason 

The guy was unhittable in 28 regular season games for the Cubs. The wear and tear he saved from other relievers can't be overstated. The trade was worth it. 

[WBWSF]

I realize that the 2019 White Sox season is another season of tanking/losing on purpose/and a lost cause. Still, look at 3 of Hahns off season moves. If Alonso, Nova and Santana were traded today you couldn't get a bag of balls for them. On top of that millions of dollars are being spent on these stiffs. Hahn won't spend big money on premium free agents but will waste millions of dollars on Alonso, Nova and Santana.