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Future White Sox Lineup #GetExcited


JUSTgottaBELIEVE

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Realistically, I could see us adding three big name free agents next year in Wheeler, Grandal, & Ozuna.  I know people here hate Wheeler for some reason, but dude has TOR stuff and will come much cheaper than Cole.  McCann has been awesome, but Grandal is the best catcher in the game and I’m not passing on his left-handed bat.  As for Ozuna, people seem to hate his defense (which isn’t good but better some here think), but I really don’t care if I can add his bat (which Statcast loves) and have Robert in between him and Jimenez.  Based on 2019 performance, there is zero reason to wait on the other AA OFs and adding a long-term solution in RF is a optimal way to spend our money.

Beyond that, I’d sign one high potential reliever like Betances (assuming he comes back healthy), a veteran swingman to serve as the #6 starter, and a stopgap for 2B like Kendrick or Forsythe.  And I’d try to resign Abreu to a 2/$25M extension.  With those additions you could have something like this next year.

  1. Garcia, CF# (Robert)
  2. Moncada, 3B#
  3. Jimenez, LF
  4. Ozuna, RF
  5. Grandal, C#
  6. Abreu, 1B/H (Vaughn)
  7. Anderson, SS
  8. Collins, DH/1B*
  9. Kendrick, 2B (Madrigal)
  • IF: Sanchez
  • OF: Tilson
  • OF: Cordell (platoons w/ Collins at DH)
  • BC: McCann
  1. Giolito
  2. Wheeler
  3. Cease
  4. Kopech
  5. Lopez (Dunning)
  • CL: Betances (or similar FA)
  • SU: Herrera
  • SU: Bummer*
  • MR: Burr (Burdi)
  • MR: Fry*
  • MR: Marshall (Hamilton/Hansen)
  • LR: Veteran FA

The pen would be a bit risky, but that team be a serious playoff contender IMO.

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12 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Are there any possible bats we can target with our depth? We have a lot of depth in the OF. Any package we can do where we trade 2 of them plus something else for a corner bat? Looking at the current standings, could that be from the Pirates, Padres (they're willing to trade anyone outside of Tatis, Machado, Hosmer apparently), Reds, Marlins, Mariners, Jays? 

All those guys’ stock is down and I’d rather not trade any depth (which looks scarcer & scarcer in the upper levels) when we have fucktons of money.  I get we’d all love a left-handed hitting, plus defensive RF but my I’ll take a talent like Ozuna for just cash than overpay for fit.

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7 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

It was crushing. But there is a legitimate chance the Sox could put themselves in a much better position without Machado than they’d be in with him if the money is spent. And that is coming from someone that wanted Machado as much as anyone. 

I struggle to come up with a better use of Free Agent money than a 26 year old stud. IMO, every other FA these idiots pursue will be either lesser players, older players, or both.

With that in mind, I struggle to come up with a scenario where this org ends up in a better spot spending the money on lesser, and/or older players. Maybe they still stupidly think it's 2004/2005, with the old CBA, where "spreading the money around" could work.

 

Alas, it's no longer 2005. And "spreading the money around" simply doesn't and simply hasn't worked in today's baseball industry. Opposing front offices are better and smarter than ever before.

And still, these imbeciles are trying to execute as if the world and the league hasn't changed since then.

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3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

All those guys’ stock is down and I’d rather not trade any depth (which looks scarcer & scarcer in the upper levels) when we have fucktons of money.  I get we’d all love a left-handed hitting, plus defensive RF but my I’ll take a talent like Ozuna for just cash than overpay for fit.

For sure. Just thinking more about defense too as there were concerns about an outfield of Eloy and Ozuna in the corners. Personally, I would prefer to spend money over trading anyone myself.

Edit: I like the Conforto idea that was kicked around but the Mets are a game under .500 and 6 out as of right now. Plus I don't think we could get Conforto for just depth. I think a team would definitely beat a "depth" offer.

Edited by soxfan2014
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20 minutes ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

I struggle to come up with a better use of Free Agent money than a 26 year old stud. IMO, every other FA these idiots pursue will be either lesser players, older players, or both.

With that in mind, I struggle to come up with a scenario where this org ends up in a better spot spending the money on lesser, and/or older players. Maybe they still stupidly think it's 2004/2005, with the old CBA, where "spreading the money around" could work.

 

Alas, it's no longer 2005. And "spreading the money around" simply doesn't and simply hasn't worked in today's baseball industry. Opposing front offices are better and smarter than ever before.

And still, these imbeciles are trying to execute as if the world and the league hasn't changed since then.

I wanted machado too but the Astros won a World Series two years ago after bringing in a number of free agents like Beltrán and Reddick and McCann.  They didn’t sign a “big fish”

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2 minutes ago, Nardiwashere said:

I wanted machado too but the Astros won a World Series two years ago after bringing in a number of free agents like Beltrán and Reddick and McCann.  They didn’t sign a “big fish”

Helps when you develop young stars like Springer, Altuve, Correa, Bregman.

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8 minutes ago, Nardiwashere said:

I wanted machado too but the Astros won a World Series two years ago after bringing in a number of free agents like Beltrán and Reddick and McCann.  They didn’t sign a “big fish”

We need 2 competent starters and a reliable right fielder.  If we had that right now we would be contending for the Central.

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20 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Helps when you develop young stars like Springer, Altuve, Correa, Bregman.

I was responding to a comment saying “nowadays” it doesn’t work to sign  multiple good free agents who may be older... as if everything changed in the last 18 months.  There’s no set rule to constructing a team.  

14 minutes ago, poppysox said:

We need 2 competent starters and a reliable right fielder.  If we had that right now we would be contending for the Central.

Agree.  If they didn’t get hit with so many pitching injuries (Rodon, Kopech, Dunning) and if they kept Avi, this team is probably the second wild card team right now.

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7 minutes ago, Flash said:

He's been mentioned before but Ian Happ, now in Iowa for Cubs might be worth dealing for. Lots of swing and miss (30%) but SH with some pop who can play multiple positions. Shouldn't cost too much in trade.

Are you saying this because even championship teams have shitty players?  I mean that guy is dogshit 

Edited by Jerksticks
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2 hours ago, Two-Gun Pete said:

I struggle to come up with a better use of Free Agent money than a 26 year old stud. IMO, every other FA these idiots pursue will be either lesser players, older players, or both.

I am not going to repeat posts I've made in this very thread within the past 48 hours, but the Sox could sign Cole, Wood, Grandal, Gennett and Abreu this offseason for less money than Machado got.  I would take those 5 guys over Machado every single day.  

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3 hours ago, Moan4Yoan said:

Guys like Cole and Rendon are pipe dreams.  They will be the top tier talent this offseason and will receive the top offers.  The Sox only hope is a guy like Puig continuing to have a bad season and getting him on a discount.  Anyone who thinks otherwise hasn’t been following the Sox.

I mean, we get you're a negative guy, but the Sox have clearly changed their tune on a number of things in recent history.

1. They did a legit rebuild that no one thought they'd ever do.

2. They spent $50M an a teenager, and paid a $25M tax in doing so.

3. Just last week they drafted 8 high schoolers, something they haven't done in a very long time (if ever?).

4. Within the past 6 months, they have offered both Machado and Harper mega-deals that would have smashed their previous largest contract by almost $200 million.  Its safe to say they were in the top 3-4 most aggressive teams bidding for their services. 

The Sox have clearly changed the way their operate in recent year,s and anyone that thinks otherwise hasn't been paying attention, or just doesn't care to view the operations of the White Sox in an anything other than a negative lens.

I completely agree that Cole is going to receive top offers.  The Sox may well not win the bidding.  But I imagine they'll be in the mix, and as I said yesterday, they're fucking idiots if they're unwilling to pay him $150-170M over 5-6 years.  They can't force the guy to sign the dotted line, but I suspect they'll be competitive.  

There is a clear delineation between last offseason and this coming offseason.  We all knew that Machado and/or Harper would jumpstart the rebuild.  We all wanted them.  But we also knew that this team was not ready for prime time.   Next offseason is different, in many way, and the Sox can make the argument 2020 is the beginning of their actual window.  I suspect the trend of things changing to continue this offseason.  Including all arb eligible players, the Sox payroll will be in $45-50M range next season before adding any free agents.  They clearly are not going to operate in that area, and could easily add $60-70M+ to the payroll.

Machado would have been awesome.  I wanted him more than anything.  But not even being a fanboy, its so easy to see how that is going to be a bullet dodged. That contract could have crippled the Sox flexibility, and as of now, they are one of the most contractually nimble organizations in baseball. Open your eyes and try to be objective instead of continuing to scream into the void.      

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11 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I mean, we get you're a negative guy, but the Sox have clearly changed their tune on a number of things in recent history.

1. They did a legit rebuild that no one thought they'd ever do.

2. They spent $50M an a teenager, and paid a $25M tax in doing so.

3. Just last week they drafted 8 high schoolers, something they haven't done in a very long time (if ever?).

4. Within the past 6 months, they have offered both Machado and Harper mega-deals that would have smashed their previous largest contract by almost $200 million.  Its safe to say they were in the top 3-4 most aggressive teams bidding for their services. 

The Sox have clearly changed the way their operate in recent year,s and anyone that thinks otherwise hasn't been paying attention, or just doesn't care to view the operations of the White Sox in an anything other than a negative lens.

I completely agree that Cole is going to receive top offers.  The Sox may well not win the bidding.  But I imagine they'll be in the mix, and as I said yesterday, they're fucking idiots if they're unwilling to pay him $150-170M over 5-6 years.  They can't force the guy to sign the dotted line, but I suspect they'll be competitive.  

There is a clear delineation between last offseason and this coming offseason.  We all knew that Machado and/or Harper would jumpstart the rebuild.  We all wanted them.  But we also knew that this team was not ready for prime time.   Next offseason is different, in many way, and the Sox can make the argument 2020 is the beginning of their actual window.  I suspect the trend of things changing to continue this offseason.  Including all arb eligible players, the Sox payroll will be in $45-50M range next season before adding any free agents.  They clearly are not going to operate in that area, and could easily add $60-70M+ to the payroll.

Machado would have been awesome.  I wanted him more than anything.  But not even being a fanboy, its so easy to see how that is going to be a bullet dodged. That contract could have crippled the Sox flexibility, and as of now, they are one of the most contractually nimble organizations in baseball. Open your eyes and try to be objective instead of continuing to scream into the void.      

I think most reasonable people can see the Sox worldview has changed since the rebuild.  It's going to take actual results with actual top FA signings to change the mind of some people which is also fine.  

That being said yeah, maybe we dodged a bullet with Machado but not being able to outbid the Padres with almost no financial reponsibilities contractually is a clown show.  I personally believe they are going to start spending money on premium talent but I can't blame anybody that is pessimistic.  This FO has largely been a giant joke.

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7 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

I am not going to repeat posts I've made in this very thread within the past 48 hours, but the Sox could sign Cole, Wood, Grandal, Gennett and Abreu this offseason for less money than Machado got.  I would take those 5 guys over Machado every single day.  

Now that's a sensible way to spend Jerry's money.

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11 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Realistically, I could see us adding three big name free agents next year in Wheeler, Grandal, & Ozuna.  I know people here hate Wheeler for some reason, but dude has TOR stuff and will come much cheaper than Cole.  McCann has been awesome, but Grandal is the best catcher in the game and I’m not passing on his left-handed bat.  As for Ozuna, people seem to hate his defense (which isn’t good but better some here think), but I really don’t care if I can add his bat (which Statcast loves) and have Robert in between him and Jimenez.  Based on 2019 performance, there is zero reason to wait on the other AA OFs and adding a long-term solution in RF is a optimal way to spend our money.

Beyond that, I’d sign one high potential reliever like Betances (assuming he comes back healthy), a veteran swingman to serve as the #6 starter, and a stopgap for 2B like Kendrick or Forsythe.  And I’d try to resign Abreu to a 2/$25M extension.  With those additions you could have something like this next year.

  1. Garcia, CF# (Robert)
  2. Moncada, 3B#
  3. Jimenez, LF
  4. Ozuna, RF
  5. Grandal, C#
  6. Abreu, 1B/H (Vaughn)
  7. Anderson, SS
  8. Collins, DH/1B*
  9. Kendrick, 2B (Madrigal)
  • IF: Sanchez
  • OF: Tilson
  • OF: Cordell (platoons w/ Collins at DH)
  • BC: McCann
  1. Giolito
  2. Wheeler
  3. Cease
  4. Kopech
  5. Lopez (Dunning)
  • CL: Betances (or similar FA)
  • SU: Herrera
  • SU: Bummer*
  • MR: Burr (Burdi)
  • MR: Fry*
  • MR: Marshall (Hamilton/Hansen)
  • LR: Veteran FA

The pen would be a bit risky, but that team be a serious playoff contender IMO.

You cant go into the season with that good of a roster and questionable pen. I'd add another vet starter and throw Roson and Lopez in the bullpen. 

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4 minutes ago, poppysox said:

That's what was said when we were bidding on Abreu & Belle.

So all you have to reference is a signing in 1996 (23 freaking years ago!) and Abreu who was only $68 million total, which is not even close to what Cole will receive?

Keep trying.  It’s not happening and I will be here to tell you I told you so.

Edited by Moan4Yoan
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Why do people talk about Wheeler? Has anyone seen his numbers this year? They make Javier Vazquez look like an ace. If you're getting him for 2/24 sure, but I wouldn't give him more years and dollars than that. 

Dylan Covey is out performing him in run prevention this year. That is all you need to know. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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2 minutes ago, Moan4Yoan said:

So all you have to reference is a signing in 1996 and Abreu who was only $68 million total, which is not even close to what Cole will receive?

Keep trying.  It’s not happening and I will be here to tell you I told you so.

I don't think you or I have any idea who the FO is going after.  Because they didn't overpay a couple of guys doesn't mean they won't make meaningful adjustments to the lineup.

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9 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Guess who played RF tonight for the Red Sox...I know he sucks defensively but that lineup with JDM in RF and Abreu at DH might score 900 runs. Especially if they also signed Grandal to catch.

I think JDM is definitely attainable, but I don’t see them adding him and then resigning Abreu.  If you add JDM, it’s to be the DH pure and simple.

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3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I think JDM is definitely attainable, but I don’t see them adding him and then resigning Abreu.  If you add JDM, it’s to be the DH pure and simple.

Agreed and nothing wrong with going with a lesser bat in RF that can play D. 

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What does JD get in free agency? Aging first basemen haven't been treated kindly in free agency in recent years. I would love to get him. I don't think the contract would be too bad either. 

 

Edit: I just checked his contract. I'm not sure that he opts out. Maybe if he gets promises that the contract gets topped.  

Edited by ron883
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