Colome remains with White Sox, who always had ample interest in him

[Richie]

On ‎7‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 11:21 PM, greg775 said:

We got Colome for Omar. Any other team could have acquired Colome in the offseason for a similar type player. True Omar is having a very nice season, but he wasn't highly regarded at the time of the trade. That's all we are going to get for Colome, an Omar-type player. I mean, people, anybody coulda acquired Colome last offseason for scraps. They are not going to overpay for him just a few months later.

His value now is what matters. Not a few months ago...

A few months ago nobody would have given much of anything for Giolito. Do you think that means they wouldn't pay up for him now? 

Not to mention, that this is when relievers value is at it's peak. 

 

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by Richie

[Richie]

25 minutes ago, vilehoopster said:

YES !!!! And for years past next year. 

All you guys who want to trade Colome, I absolutely do not get you. Do you enjoy losing?? You all make no sense to me. 

No, we enjoy winning division titles and competing for a world series. Not keeping Colome for the sake of "winning" 80 games instead of 77-78 in a non-playoff season. 

[Sarava]

54 minutes ago, Richie said:

No, we enjoy winning division titles and competing for a world series. Not keeping Colome for the sake of "winning" 80 games instead of 77-78 in a non-playoff season. 

Nobody wants to keep him for the sake of winning a few more games this year. It's to have a good bullpen moving forward in to next year and beyond. Why are you against him being our closer for the next 2-4 years?

At a certain point you have to say it's time to build this up, instead of continuing to tear it down. The Sox have the pieces to move full steam ahead.

[Richie]

59 minutes ago, Sarava said:

Nobody wants to keep him for the sake of winning a few more games this year. It's to have a good bullpen moving forward in to next year and beyond. Why are you against him being our closer for the next 2-4 years?

At a certain point you have to say it's time to build this up, instead of continuing to tear it down. The Sox have the pieces to move full steam ahead.

I'm not saying that there isn't an argument for keeping Colome. There is. 

However, to suggest that anyone considering moving him to be "crazy" and "obsessed with losing" is just a meat ball take at it's finest. Totally absent of the rationale which would be behind a potential trade. 

You can "build up" by trading Colome. That would be the point here. You get a guy whose going to give you more value within your contention window than Colome would. Colome will be 31 next season. Many closers/relievers experience rapid drop offs as they get into their 30's. These guys often have enigmatic careers. Even if he remains a good closing option for a few years. We could get a legit prospect in exchange for him who could contribute as a rotational starter or possibly as an every day positional player for years to come. No one here is talking about a guy who still needs 2-3 years to develop. We are talking about a guy who is close now. 

That IS a trading to "win" move. Colome has been good, but he's far from special. There's plenty of Alex Colome's in baseball that we can go get. He's not a prime Kimbrel or Chapman. He's good... he's solid. 

 

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Richie

[HoosierSox]

Another benefit of trading Colome would be that we would be able to see how Bummer would do in that role. 

[greg775]

1 hour ago, Richie said:

You get a guy whose going to give you more value within your contention window than Colome would. Colome will be 31 next season. Many closers/relievers experience rapid drop offs as they get into their 30's. 

 

 

Simple question: What if Colome was 26? Would you still want to flip him? My guess is you and most of the rebuild people would because most feel we can acquire somebody just as good in the offseason to be our closer. Or let somebody on the current roster close. If Colome was 26 I'd be hoping he could be effective for several years as our closer.

Edited July 8, 2019 by greg775

[Balta1701]

19 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Simple question: What if Colome was 26? Would you still want to flip him? My guess is you and most of the rebuild people would because most feel we can acquire somebody just as good in the offseason to be our closer. Or let somebody on the current roster close. If Colome was 26 I'd be hoping he could be effective for several years as our closer.

If we only had control of this 26 year old player through the end of 2020 I'd certainly be listening. 2020 this team has a shot at making noise, but guys who are here for only 1 year of our window are guys we are going to have to replace or resign anyway because they hit free agency.

[Chicago White Sox]

20 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Simple question: What if Colome was 26? Would you still want to flip him? My guess is you and most of the rebuild people would because most feel we can acquire somebody just as good in the offseason to be our closer. Or let somebody on the current roster close. If Colome was 26 I'd be hoping he could be effective for several years as our closer.

Aaron Bummer is 25 years old and under control for a long ass time.  I would be willing to listen on him (as you should with everyone), but outside of an obscene package I would not seriously consider moving him.  

Colome is different because he is older, doesn’t have elite stuff, and is only under team control for one more year.  If someone is willing to overpay for that, we should take advantage of said offer and use our financial flexibility to replace him in the offseason.  If not, you keep and let him be the closer on a 2020 team with playoff ambitions.

[OneDog847]

Send Colome to Texas for Joe Palumbo and Sam Huff. 

[bmags]

37 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Simple question: What if Colome was 26? Would you still want to flip him? My guess is you and most of the rebuild people would because most feel we can acquire somebody just as good in the offseason to be our closer. Or let somebody on the current roster close. If Colome was 26 I'd be hoping he could be effective for several years as our closer.

my only philosophy on baseball (as a young person) is that old players like colome are useless (as are saves, since I am a statnik) and should be force retired. If that's not possible, flipping them is an okay consolation prize. White sox should seek to ensure their roster is as young player as possible, as the old players may rub off on them and turn them old.

[Whiterat29]

21 minutes ago, bmags said:

my only philosophy on baseball (as a young person) is that old players like colome are useless (as are saves, since I am a statnik) and should be force retired. If that's not possible, flipping them is an okay consolation prize. White sox should seek to ensure their roster is as young player as possible, as the old players may rub off on them and turn them old.

Nobody wants old guys rubbing off on them.

[Chicago White Sox]

35 minutes ago, bmags said:

my only philosophy on baseball (as a young person) is that old players like colome are useless (as are saves, since I am a statnik) and should be force retired. If that's not possible, flipping them is an okay consolation prize. White sox should seek to ensure their roster is as young player as possible, as the old players may rub off on them and turn them old.

I’m literally dying from laughter right now...well done!

[Richie]

2 hours ago, greg775 said:

Simple question: What if Colome was 26? Would you still want to flip him? My guess is you and most of the rebuild people would because most feel we can acquire somebody just as good in the offseason to be our closer. Or let somebody on the current roster close. If Colome was 26 I'd be hoping he could be effective for several years as our closer.

See, this is what I am talking about. I don't "want to flip Colome". 

I "want" to flip Colome IF the deal makes our team better. I would be willing to trade ANYONE if I felt the White Sox benefited. If we don't get that in an offer for Colome? Of course, I don't want to ship him off. 

All I want... is to make the White Sox a winner. 

You and a couple of others have this weird angle on trading players. Where you think those entertaining the idea of doing so just "want to trade for the sake of it" or something. You completely ignore the whole compensation aspect of it. It's just odd... it's like you can't see beyond tomorrow's game. "Ah! Why would you trade our closer!?"... "Uhm, well we got players in return for our closer. Look, we got --"... "What!? Wait... no... but why is our closer gone!"

What if Colome was 26? 

He's not. 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Richie

[greg775]

2 hours ago, bmags said:

my only philosophy on baseball (as a young person) is that old players like colome are useless (as are saves, since I am a statnik) and should be force retired. If that's not possible, flipping them is an okay consolation prize. White sox should seek to ensure their roster is as young player as possible, as the old players may rub off on them and turn them old.

Not funny. Do you deny my accusations against the stat people do not have a good portion of truth in them? Fans are suddenly scared to death to sign anybody on our own team over 32. Do you deny this has become reality? If we get rid of Abreu the advanced stat advocates will have their wish. Almost everybody on our WS window teams that are not pitchers will be under 30 and well under 30 in fact (assuming McCann is also shipped out). Meanwhile, Manny Machado will be 29 during the 2021 season, perilously close to 30. Yet several of the pitchers will be 35 or older as Sox are going to have to spend some money on veteran starters and a closer once we dump Colome. He'll have to be replaced in 2021 with 2020 looking like another rebuild season.

Edited July 8, 2019 by greg775

[greg775]

57 minutes ago, Richie said:

See, this is what I am talking about. I don't "want to flip Colome". 

I "want" to flip Colome IF the deal makes our team better. I would be willing to trade ANYONE if I felt the White Sox benefited. If we don't get that in an offer for Colome? Of course, I don't want to ship him off. 

All I want... is to make the White Sox a winner. 

You and a couple of others have this weird angle on trading players. Where you think those entertaining the idea of doing so just "want to trade for the sake of it" or something. You completely ignore the whole compensation aspect of it. It's just odd... it's like you can't see beyond tomorrow's game. "Ah! Why would you trade our closer!?"... "Uhm, well we got players in return for our closer. Look, we got --"... "What!? Wait... no... but why is our closer gone!"

What if Colome was 26? 

He's not. 

I respect your post, but I'm assuming you want prospects for Colome. They 'could' make our team better in 2022 or so. If they pan out. I realize there's compensation to be had for colome but at the same time I don't want Nate Jones to be our closer next season and I don't want Frye or Bummer as I don't believe in lefty closers. I understand you want very good players for Colome, assuming you mean youngsters, prospects. 

I'm resigned to trading him, so I would guess we could use another stud outfielder prospect with Rutherford looking like a possible bust and perhaps a catcher prospect. We already have a lot of young arms but could probably add another. So if Colome is flipped I'd assume the goal is an outstanding hitting outfielder and/or catcher.

[greg775]

3 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

guys we are going to have to replace or resign anyway because they hit free agency.

We're not only going to have WS caliber teams in 2021-25 but ones winning with record low payrolls it appears. If we get rid of Abreu we'll have very few guys even making 10 million a year I'd suspect.

[Richie]

3 minutes ago, greg775 said:

I respect your post, but I'm assuming you want prospects for Colome. They 'could' make our team better in 2022 or so. If they pan out. I realize there's compensation to be had for colome but at the same time I don't want Nate Jones to be our closer next season and I don't want Frye or Bummer as I don't believe in lefty closers. I understand you want very good players for Colome, assuming you mean youngsters, prospects. 

I'm resigned to trading him, so I would guess we could use another stud outfielder prospect with Rutherford looking like a possible bust and perhaps a catcher prospect. We already have a lot of young arms but could probably add another. So if Colome is flipped I'd assume the goal is an outstanding hitting outfielder and/or catcher.

I respect your post, but I'm assuming you want prospects for Colome. They 'could' make our team better in 2022 or so. If they pan out. I realize there's compensation to be had for colome but at the same time I don't want Nate Jones to be our closer next season and I don't want Frye or Bummer as I don't believe in lefty closers. I understand you want very good players for Colome, assuming you mean youngsters, prospects. 

This is from my above post...

We could get a legit prospect in exchange for him who could contribute as a rotational starter or possibly as an every day positional player for years to come. No one here is talking about a guy who still needs 2-3 years to develop. We are talking about a guy who is close now. 

The term "prospect" does mean a player is 2-3 years away. I'm talking about guys who are already established well in AA or have moved to AAA. Guys who will be ready step in soon. Erik Fedde was brought up as a really good example. A guy who has already tasted the majors. 

However, the idea (to me) would be a starting pitcher or outfield prospect. Catcher is up in the air right now with how well McCann has been playing, along with Collins uncertainty. He looks overmatched at the plate, but it's still too early to write him off completely. 

 

 

[Chicago White Sox]

5 hours ago, greg775 said:

I respect your post, but I'm assuming you want prospects for Colome. They 'could' make our team better in 2022 or so. If they pan out. I realize there's compensation to be had for colome but at the same time I don't want Nate Jones to be our closer next season and I don't want Frye or Bummer as I don't believe in lefty closers. I understand you want very good players for Colome, assuming you mean youngsters, prospects. 

I'm resigned to trading him, so I would guess we could use another stud outfielder prospect with Rutherford looking like a possible bust and perhaps a catcher prospect. We already have a lot of young arms but could probably add another. So if Colome is flipped I'd assume the goal is an outstanding hitting outfielder and/or catcher.

The prospects we potentially get from trading Colome can be used to improve the team next offseason.  The idea is to capitalize on an inflated market value (if it exists), add more prospect currency, and use our crazy financial flexibility to replace Colome.  While several posters here have suggested there won’t be a ton of high end relief options in free agency, the ability to take on money should expand that pool substantially and allow us to trade for a good arm or two at minimal prospect cost.  That would leave us with the prospect haul we got from Colome to help fill another pressing need.

Edited July 8, 2019 by Chicago White Sox

[poppysox]

Very interested to see how the next 3 weeks play out.  We will either work out an extension with Jose or trade him.  Colome decision will be made.  The outcome of the Abreu and Colome decisions will tell us a lot about intention to compete next year.  

[Chicago White Sox]

26 minutes ago, poppysox said:

Very interested to see how the next 3 weeks play out.  We will either work out an extension with Jose or trade him.  Colome decision will be made.  The outcome of the Abreu and Colome decisions will tell us a lot about intention to compete next year.  

We are most definitely going to try and compete next year with or without Abreu & Colome.

[poppysox]

1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

We are most definitely going to try and compete next year with or without Abreu & Colome.

I know what you are saying but Abreu is needed until Vaughn gets here and that's not next year.  Colome is needed here if next year is viewed as a go for it year rather than just being competitive.

[Chicago White Sox]

23 minutes ago, poppysox said:

I know what you are saying but Abreu is needed until Vaughn gets here and that's not next year.  Colome is needed here if next year is viewed as a go for it year rather than just being competitive.

But we can always replace them in free agency or via trade.  I think us moving either guy is more of a reflection of what the market was for these guys than our intention to compete next year.  The Sox aren’t going to waste another year of Moncada, Giolito, Anderson, Eloy, etc.

[SonofaRoache]

12 hours ago, Richie said:

I'm not saying that there isn't an argument for keeping Colome. There is. 

However, to suggest that anyone considering moving him to be "crazy" and "obsessed with losing" is just a meat ball take at it's finest. Totally absent of the rationale which would be behind a potential trade. 

You can "build up" by trading Colome. That would be the point here. You get a guy whose going to give you more value within your contention window than Colome would. Colome will be 31 next season. Many closers/relievers experience rapid drop offs as they get into their 30's. These guys often have enigmatic careers. Even if he remains a good closing option for a few years. We could get a legit prospect in exchange for him who could contribute as a rotational starter or possibly as an every day positional player for years to come. No one here is talking about a guy who still needs 2-3 years to develop. We are talking about a guy who is close now. 

That IS a trading to "win" move. Colome has been good, but he's far from special. There's plenty of Alex Colome's in baseball that we can go get. He's not a prime Kimbrel or Chapman. He's good... he's solid. 

 

 

Having Colome next year and maybe a few years after helps you win titles. I wouldn't trade him unless you get one good prospect. It should be a Gleybar Torres type of deal here. If you are only receiving offers for mediocre talents I wouldn't do it. 

[poppysox]

7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

But we can always replace them in free agency or via trade.  I think us moving either guy is more of a reflection of what the market was for these guys than our intention to compete next year.  The Sox aren’t going to waste another year of Moncada, Giolito, Anderson, Eloy, etc.

Easier said than done.  My point is the next three weeks have the potential of being interesting.

[poppysox]

Just now, SonofaRoache said:

Having Colome next year and maybe a few years after helps you win titles. I wouldn't trade him unless you get one good prospect. It should be a Gleybar Torres type of deal here. If you are only receiving offers for mediocre talents I wouldn't do it. 

I totally agree.