Jump to content

***Day 1 MLB Draft Thread***


Heads22

Recommended Posts

17 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

Frank Thomas over Willie Mays is the homer-est thing I've heard since Hawk retired.

As a right handed hitter? No one is talking about as an overall player.

Pretty simple here, but franks career ops is 974 and Mays was 941. Frank had an ops north of 1000 7 times over a 10 year period. Mays did it 5 times in his career.

Peak Frank Thomas (his 5 best years) are pretty much better than almost anyone who has ever played the game.

What's funny is your a Sox fan and you're arguing against something that's pro-Sox that was actually true.

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Here  you go "Pal".  Something to peruse.  

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/mayswi01.shtml

 

Seriously what are you citing? Do you even know what this discussion is about?

No one is arguing Frank Thomas was a better overall player than willie Mays. Frank Thomas was a better hitter though.

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, The Sir said:

I was gonna agree with this at first thought, but when Ray says, "as a hitter solely", maybe he has a point. 1991-1997 Thomas had a 1.056 OPS, with six seasons over 1.000 and his max season at 1.217. Neither Mays nor Dimaggio nor Aaron did that, although Dimaggio was interrupted by WWII.

I mean that is fine, it just isn't cut and dried at all.  Yeah, Frank is one of the best RH Hitters of all time for certain.  But you could easily look at any of those guys, especially Mays, and picking a difference is splitting hairs somewhere.  

You could easily be comping Frank with Jeff Bagwell (94-01), Albert Pujols (01-10) and Miguel Cabrera(10-15) and have similar numbers.  Frank is an All Time Great.  And the best Sox player ever.  My favorite player ever.  I don't know how you can claim him to be better than some of these other guys though.  It is splitting hairs to make whatever argument you want.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

As a right handed hitter? No one is talking about as an overall player.

Pretty simple here, but franks career ops is 974 and Mays was 941. Frank had an ops north of 1000 7 times over a 10 year period. Mays did it 5 times in his career.

Peak Frank Thomas (his 5 best years) are pretty much better than almost anyone who has ever played the game.

What's funny is your a Sox fan and you're arguing against something that's pro-Sox that was actually true.

But think about how much fresher a player can be for his at bats when he isn’t playing the field for over half of them in his career?

But I guess the comeback would be, “well how many greenies did Mays take?”

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

I mean that is fine, it just isn't cut and dried at all.  Yeah, Frank is one of the best RH Hitters of all time for certain.  But you could easily look at any of those guys, especially Mays, and picking a difference is splitting hairs somewhere.  

You could easily be comping Frank with Jeff Bagwell (94-01), Albert Pujols (01-10) and Miguel Cabrera(10-15) and have similar numbers.  Frank is an All Time Great.  And the best Sox player ever.  My favorite player ever.  I don't know how you can claim him to be better than some of these other guys though.  It is splitting hairs to make whatever argument you want.

Lol yet you're laughing at me saying Frank is better... now its splitting hairs? So what were you laughing about exactly? 

People can be critical of me for a lot of things, but if I misunderstand or say something wrong I admit it and move on. You didnt understand the discussion, assumed I said Frank was better overall, laughed and were wrong. It's ok to admit it and move on.

Frank is absolutely in the argument for top 5 right handed hitter of all-time, as I wrote and which triggered the discussion.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

As a right handed hitter? No one is talking about as an overall player.

Pretty simple here, but franks career ops is 974 and Mays was 941. Frank had an ops north of 1000 7 times over a 10 year period. Mays did it 5 times in his career.

Peak Frank Thomas (his 5 best years) are pretty much better than almost anyone who has ever played the game.

What's funny is your a Sox fan and you're arguing against something that's pro-Sox that was actually true.

The OPS is close and Thomas had the big advantage of pitchers using a shorter mound.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

As a right handed hitter? No one is talking about as an overall player.

Pretty simple here, but franks career ops is 974 and Mays was 941. Frank had an ops north of 1000 7 times over a 10 year period. Mays did it 5 times in his career.

Peak Frank Thomas (his 5 best years) are pretty much better than almost anyone who has ever played the game.

What's funny is your a Sox fan and you're arguing against something that's pro-Sox that was actually true.

If you want to use OPS as a proxy, here is the career list (1st 4 are all LH). Of course OPS might not be the best metric if it doesn't support Hank Aaron among the best, if not the best RH hitter ever, or do I understand you to say Frank was a better hitter than Aaron?

5.    Jimmie Foxx+ (20)    1.0376    R
6.    Hank Greenberg+ (13)    1.0169    R
7.    Rogers Hornsby+ (23)    1.0103    R
8.    Manny Ramirez (19)    .9960    R
9.    Mike Trout (9, 27)    .9936    R
10.    Mark McGwire (16)    .9823    R
11.    Mickey Mantle+ (18)    .9773    B
12.    Joe DiMaggio+ (13)    .9771    R
13.    Stan Musial+ (22)    .9757    L
14.    Frank Thomas+ (19)    .9740    

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Seriously what are you citing? Do you even know what this discussion is about?

No one is arguing Frank Thomas was a better overall player than willie Mays. Frank Thomas was a better hitter though.

Based on what? I don't want to tear down Frank, but his prime, as mentioned was 91-97.  7 seasons.  Mays had 13 straight seasons without having an OPS lower than .924.  He also never played fewer than 151 games in that stretch.  4 times in that stretch he hit more homers than Frank's career high.  He also hit double digit triples 5 times in that stretch.  Stole double digit bases 9 times (do steals not count, it is offensive but not hitting.  Ok maybe they shouldn't count).  He knocked in triple digits 10 times in that span.  He didn't BB like Frank did, but Frank had over 350 TB once in his career, Mays did 7 times.  

There can be a very strong case made for either guy.  To try to claim it definitively, is silly.

Edited by turnin' two
Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Wanne said:

I believe so...at the end of another fucking competitive balance reach around.

Featuring 2 more picks by the D-Backs and the Padres, who are in such desperate need of competitive balance that they signed a $300M free agent this offseason.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, ptatc said:

The OPS is close and Thomas had the big advantage of pitchers using a shorter mound.

Fair point certainly. I'd argue Mays had the big advantage of not spending his entire career playing against a league that was 50% users... as well as playing in an era with less talent overall.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Lol yet you're laughing at me saying Frank is better... now its splitting hairs? So what were you laughing about exactly? 

People can be critical of me for a lot of things, but if I misunderstand or say something wrong I admit it and move on. You didnt understand the discussion, assumed I said Frank was better overall, laughed and were wrong. It's ok to admit it and move on.

Frank is absolutely in the argument for top 5 right handed hitter of all-time, as I wrote and which triggered the discussion.

What triggered the discussion was you saying he was one of the three best RH hitters ever.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Quin said:

Featuring 2 more picks by the D-Backs and the Padres, who are in such desperate need of competitive balance that they signed a $300M free agent this offseason.

RIGHT?!?!  Really just frosts my ass MLB does this....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...