Banuelos to IL; Fulmer recalled

[Jack Parkman]

I hate the service time games they're playing with Cease and Robert. The most important thing right now is that all of the youth on the team is good at the same time.

Bring up Cease after the ASB (or next week if they need a 5th starter), bring up Robert in August, Bring up Madrigal on 4/15/2020 and Vaughn as soon as he shows he's raking at AA. 

This offense and pitching staff needs to be firing on all cylinders by 2021. At that point they only have 3 years of Moncada and Giolito left, so they need to maximize that window and quit dicking around. 

Edited June 19, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[ptatc]

11 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

I hate the service time games they're playing with Cease and Robert. The most important thing right now is that all of the youth on the team is good at the same time.

Bring up Cease after the ASB (or next week if they need a 5th starter), bring up Robert in August, Bring up Madrigal on 4/15/2020 and Vaughn as soon as he shows he's raking at AA. 

This offense and pitching staff needs to be firing on all cylinders by 2021. At that point they only have 3 years of Moncada and Giolito left, so they need to maximize that window and quit dicking around. 

I don't think they are playing a service time game with Cease. I think it is more how to use his innings efficiently this year. I don't think they want to just shut him down in August. I think they want to limit his innings in the minors so they can have extended starts in the MLB.

[ChiSox59]

2 hours ago, Moan4Yoan said:

C’mon, this is hyperbole when it comes to Fulmer.  No one expected this from Fulmer but they expected more than these numbers from a 1st round pick:

6.72 ERA and 1.69 WHIP in 77.2 career innings

Coming from the dude that would surely roast the Sox if they DFAd Fulmer and he became even just a decent reliever elsewhere. SMH. 

[ChiSox59]

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

I hate the service time games they're playing with Cease and Robert. The most important thing right now is that all of the youth on the team is good at the same time.

Bring up Cease after the ASB (or next week if they need a 5th starter), bring up Robert in August, Bring up Madrigal on 4/15/2020 and Vaughn as soon as he shows he's raking at AA. 

This offense and pitching staff needs to be firing on all cylinders by 2021. At that point they only have 3 years of Moncada and Giolito left, so they need to maximize that window and quit dicking around. 

Cmon man, have some patience. I sorta understand wanting Cease up, but Robert 100% should not be in the bigs before late May 2020. Show a sliver of restraint. 

[Jack Parkman]

27 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Cmon man, have some patience. I sorta understand wanting Cease up, but Robert 100% should not be in the bigs before late May 2020. Show a sliver of restraint. 

I'd rather him have the entire offseason to make adjustments to MLB pitching. He's not being challenged in AA, he's probably not going to be challenged in AAA either. Robert isn't going to learn anything else in the minors. He's ready. I'd like them to have as few question marks as possible by 2021. 

Edited June 20, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[ChiSox59]

13 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

I'd rather him have the entire offseason to make adjustments to MLB pitching. He's not being challenged in AA, he's probably not going to be challenged in AAA either. Robert isn't going to learn anything else in the minors. He's ready. I'd like them to have as few question marks as possible by 2021. 

He gets 90% of 2020 to make adjustments, plus an entire offseason. The Sox are trying to spread things out a bit. It’s smart. 

[pcq]

4 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

With Banuelos on the shelf, the Sox pretty much have to call up Cease this weekend.  Literally no other options in the upper minors even remotely worth trying, and they are not going to roll with 4 starters, though they maybe could with 2 more off days in the next 8 days. 

Cease has been tanking and it seems Baduelos is not MLB durable. Might have to start Carson who would do no worse. 

[Donny Lucy's Avocado Farm]

I would imagine the Sox want to stagger the service time thing / callups a bit so that they dont have 14 guys all in their final arb year at the same time.

[ChiSox59]

13 hours ago, Charlie Haeger's Knuckles said:

I would imagine the Sox want to stagger the service time thing / callups a bit so that they dont have 14 guys all in their final arb year at the same time.

Which.....makes a ton of sense!!!

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

16 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

Cmon man, have some patience. I sorta understand wanting Cease up, but Robert 100% should not be in the bigs before late May 2020. Show a sliver of restraint. 

Why shouldn't Robert be up? I really don't understand the Robert logic... Robert is young for his level and has been dominant all year. He's a freak of nature with MLB talent right now, and he needs to learn and adjust at the MLB level. AAA really does Robert no good because the hitting environment is so pro-offense. He'll strike out a lot early in his MLB career, but the guy is ready and would compete at a very high level in the big leagues. 

Robert has less than 600 professional at-bats so I understand wanting to see a bit more but the fact that he ONLY has 500 professional AB's and he's this damn good is more supporting evidence that he should be up and not the other way around. He's already made fast adjustments to pitchers. Robert, right now, would be our best center fielder.

Edited June 20, 2019 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[chitownsportsfan]

24 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Why shouldn't Robert be up? I really don't understand the Robert logic... Robert is young for his level and has been dominant all year. He's a freak of nature with MLB talent right now, and he needs to learn and adjust at the MLB level. AAA really does Robert no good because the hitting environment is so pro-offense. He'll strike out a lot early in his MLB career, but the guy is ready and would compete at a very high level in the big leagues. 

Robert has less than 600 professional at-bats so I understand wanting to see a bit more but the fact that he ONLY has 500 professional AB's and he's this damn good is more supporting evidence that he should be up and not the other way around. He's already made fast adjustments to pitchers. Robert, right now, would be our best center fielder.

Not sure how much faith you can put in a mid season STEAMER projection but they project 263//307/435 wRC+ 97.  His preseason ZIPS was 236/312/341.

I think you're right.  He's ready for MLB.  He's proven it the last couple months.  But I doubt Chicago will call him up before next spring.  Just doesn't seem like the way they are doing things now.  Maybe if he signs an extension things will change.

[joejoedairy]

Is it possible Covey will be able to come back the next time Banuelos would have been scheduled to start?

[SCCWS]

39 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Why shouldn't Robert be up? I really don't understand the Robert logic... Robert is young for his level and has been dominant all year. He's a freak of nature with MLB talent right now, and he needs to learn and adjust at the MLB level. AAA really does Robert no good because the hitting environment is so pro-offense. He'll strike out a lot early in his MLB career, but the guy is ready and would compete at a very high level in the big leagues. 

Robert has less than 600 professional at-bats so I understand wanting to see a bit more but the fact that he ONLY has 500 professional AB's and he's this damn good is more supporting evidence that he should be up and not the other way around. He's already made fast adjustments to pitchers. Robert, right now, would be our best center fielder.

Robert is hitting .158 this month so I think he needs more time in AA. But if he takes off again I agree he can skip AAA

[Capital G]

Why does everyone want Cease up right now? He has not been that good recently. Remember Kopech last year? He went through a rough patch. After he got back on track we brought him up and he did well in his few opportunities prior to the injury. Why treat Cease any different?

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

31 minutes ago, SCCWS said:

Robert is hitting .158 this month so I think he needs more time in AA. But if he takes off again I agree he can skip AAA

You're talking like a 12 game sample.

[yesterday333]

24 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

You're talking like a 12 game sample.

From the sounds of it, he has been chasing a lot of garbage low and away. it seems he cant lay off the breaking ball down there. I think time in AAA would actually benefit him.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

1 hour ago, yesterday333 said:

From the sounds of it, he has been chasing a lot of garbage low and away. it seems he cant lay off the breaking ball down there. I think time in AAA would actually benefit him.

So he's every young batter alive?

[SCCWS]

18 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

You're talking like a 12 game sample.

I was responding to you stating "Robert is young for his level and has been dominant all year". He was dominant for 30 games and then stumbled the next 12.  So at this point the Sox might be better seeing how fast he bounces back before they consider calling him up.  

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

12 minutes ago, SCCWS said:

I was responding to you stating "Robert is young for his level and has been dominant all year". He was dominant for 30 games and then stumbled the next 12.  So at this point the Sox might be better seeing how fast he bounces back before they consider calling him up.  

Well if we're going to start citing 12 game samples that are capped off with ASG MVP's then we should probably stop assessing a prospect. The bulk of his work is certainly more important than the 12 game sample you are pointing too.

[yesterday333]

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Well if we're going to start citing 12 game samples that are capped off with ASG MVP's then we should probably stop assessing a prospect. The bulk of his work is certainly more important than the 12 game sample you are pointing too.

Actually, seeing how a prospect responds to adversity is an important part of assessing a player. I would let him figure this out than move him to AAA. Nobody is saying he isn't a top prospect or that he wont succeed but part of his assessment has to be adjusting to how he is being attacked at the plate.

[TaylorStSox]

22 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Why shouldn't Robert be up? I really don't understand the Robert logic... Robert is young for his level and has been dominant all year. He's a freak of nature with MLB talent right now, and he needs to learn and adjust at the MLB level. AAA really does Robert no good because the hitting environment is so pro-offense. He'll strike out a lot early in his MLB career, but the guy is ready and would compete at a very high level in the big leagues. 

Robert has less than 600 professional at-bats so I understand wanting to see a bit more but the fact that he ONLY has 500 professional AB's and he's this damn good is more supporting evidence that he should be up and not the other way around. He's already made fast adjustments to pitchers. Robert, right now, would be our best center fielder.

AAA is full of AAAA pitchers that can throw off speed pitches for strikes. I'm curious to see how Robert reacts to that. 

[SCCWS]

11 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Well if we're going to start citing 12 game samples that are capped off with ASG MVP's then we should probably stop assessing a prospect. The bulk of his work is certainly more important than the 12 game sample you are pointing too.

I agree. But I also remember Yoan Moncada.  He also was having a very good minor league career but not w the numbers Roberts had.  He was having a very good year in AA then hit a rough patch similar to the stretch Roberts has had. But the Red Sox needed a player and they called him up regardless and he bombed.  He was back to the minors after 20 AB. 

[chitownsportsfan]

6 minutes ago, SCCWS said:

I agree. But I also remember Yoan Moncada.  He also was having a very good minor league career but not w the numbers Roberts had.  He was having a very good year in AA then hit a rough patch similar to the stretch Roberts has had. But the Red Sox needed a player and they called him up regardless and he bombed.  He was back to the minors after 20 AB. 

Moncada was thrown into a pennant race at age 20.  Robert is 22 and will be entering a relatively pressure free environment if he comes up this fall and the Sox are like 60-65 and too far back to realistically make a run at the Wild Card.

I think he's ready but I really don't see much problem keeping him down until next spring.  At worst you delay his development at the MLB level a couple months.  At best you allow him to continue to build confidence, take a cautious approach to injuries  (if any occur), and get ready for a big offseason with hopes to make the club out of Camelback next March.

[SCCWS]

5 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Moncada was thrown into a pennant race at age 20.  Robert is 22 and will be entering a relatively pressure free environment if he comes up this fall and the Sox are like 60-65 and too far back to realistically make a run at the Wild Card.

I think he's ready but I really don't see much problem keeping him down until next spring.  At worst you delay his development at the MLB level a couple months.  At best you allow him to continue to build confidence, take a cautious approach to injuries  (if any occur), and get ready for a big offseason with hopes to make the club out of Camelback next March.

I agree if he comes up this fall. But Ray Ray wants him to come up right now. I think he needs more time in AA. 

[ptatc]

On 6/20/2019 at 12:17 PM, Capital G said:

Why does everyone want Cease up right now? He has not been that good recently. Remember Kopech last year? He went through a rough patch. After he got back on track we brought him up and he did well in his few opportunities prior to the injury. Why treat Cease any different?

This is why he will be up sometime not too long after the ASB. Probably that next homestand.