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Should they call Nick Madrigal up?


JuliusO1274

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22 minutes ago, JuliusO1274 said:

He can clearly handle minor league pitching and I don't think he has much to learn down there. Yea, he needs to learn to "slug" a bit more but he can develop that as he plays in the majors.

Madrigal should be joining Robert in Charlotte at the very least. 

I'm torn. The longer the season goes without Robert and Madrigal being at the MLB level, the more I'm willing to let them wait until next Tax Day. 

In an ideal world, both Madrigal and Robert would be joining the team in Oakland Friday. 

8/1 is the absolute latest I'd call them up. If it goes past then, then just wait until 4/15/2020. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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I think AA is a really big challenge so I don't mind that much, but I do think AAA is the better place to work on his BB rates, I don't think his power is much of a thing that is going to change this year.

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I like Madrigal and wasn't down on him for his slow start.  But he needs more ABs.  If he ends the season in AAA because of his continued production I'm fine with that but he shouldn't be on the big club this year.

 

Robert on the other hand I feel like should be up here at some point toward early August if he continues.

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It depends. Do the sox want to do a swing change (jd martinez or donaldson style) with him to get more loft? Or do they hope that a couple more pounds of muscle and the juiced ball will give him enough pop?

If they want to attempt the former which might increase his ceiling but takes more times and creates a risk it completely flops they might keep him in the minors but if they just want to let him hit they can call him up anyway.

 

 

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I didn’t care about the whole Eloy service time debate because it was a rebuild year, but if the Sox think they can contend next year then they should be doing everything possible to win games starting on opening day.  Which means holding someone in the minors for 3 weeks would be counterproductive.  Which then means there’s no service time ramifications regardless of when you’d bring them up this season.  I honestly don’t know what Madrigal is learning in the minors at this point.

If they don’t think they can compete or they honestly don’t think Madrigal or Robert are ready then that changes the equation.

Edited by RTC
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1 minute ago, RTC said:

I didn’t care about the whole Eloy service time debate because it was a rebuild year, but if the Sox think they can contend next year then they should be doing everything possible to win games starting on opening day.  Which means holding someone in the minors for 3 weeks would be counterproductive.  Which then means there’s no service time ramifications regardless of when you’d bring them up this season.

If they don’t think they can compete or they honestly don’t think Madrigal or Robert are ready then that changes the equation.

Like it or not, even the Cubs were willing to keep Kris Bryant in the minors for 2 weeks during a season where they won 96 games and were an ungodly performance from Daniel Murphy away from the world series. 

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1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

Like it or not, even the Cubs were willing to keep Kris Bryant in the minors for 2 weeks during a season where they won 96 games and were an ungodly performance from Daniel Murphy away from the world series. 

They absolutely did.  But that doesn’t mean I’m a fan of that method.  I’m a proponent of how the Pads handled Tatis.  Either you’re trying to win from Day 1 or your not.

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29 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

If it wasn't for service time issues I'd say bring him up by the end of July assuming he continues at a similar pace for the next 3 weeks. 

I'm often inclined to want to ignore service time considerations, but I at least get it when it comes to super duper athletes, corner stone type players. I really don't think Madrigal is that type of guy so I'd really push the 'when he's ready' angle. 

If you can bring Yoan Moncada up at the end of July, you can bring up Madrigal.

That being said I have no idea what to make of his development so I'm probably not going to get to a point where I'm actually calling for him to come up. 

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3 minutes ago, mqr said:

I'm often inclined to want to ignore service time considerations, but I at least get it when it comes to super duper athletes, corner stone type players. I really don't think Madrigal is that type of guy so I'd really push the 'when he's ready' angle. 

If you can bring Yoan Moncada up at the end of July, you can bring up Madrigal.

That being said I have no idea what to make of his development so I'm probably not going to get to a point where I'm actually calling for him to come up. 

Yeah but if you can keep Eloy down in AAA for Service time then you can keep Madrigal there for service time. 

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1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

Yeah but if you can keep Eloy down in AAA for Service time then you can keep Madrigal there for service time. 

Eloy would fall under the cornerstone prospect. He's a guy that may one day be looking for a mega-contract (now unlikely after his extension). 

I don't foresee Madrigal being a 100 million dollar FA so I'm more inclined to maximize his present value than want to control future value, if that makes any sense. 

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8 minutes ago, mqr said:

If you can bring Yoan Moncada up at the end of July, you can bring up Madrigal.

Since he already had a cup of coffee with Boston, wasn't the timing of that promotion largely irrelevant as long as it occurred after the first month or so of the season? 

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2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Yeah but if you can keep Eloy down in AAA for Service time then you can keep Madrigal there for service time. 

The only difference there is they knew going into 2019 the team wasn't competing for a playoff spot. If they feel 2020 is gettable, maybe getting Robert and Madrigal some major league time this year will help the cause. I'm on the side of just keeping both of them down all season, but if they did call them up in August, it would be very exciting for the fans.

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2 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

Since he already had a cup of coffee with Boston, wasn't the timing of that promotion largely irrelevant as long as it occurred after the first month or so of the season? 

What I'm saying is if they were extremely concerned with his service time, they would have waited until May of last year to call him up. I would say my cut off for willing to call a guy up vs wait til next year is right around the end of July/ beginning of August

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1 minute ago, Jose Abreu said:

Since he already had a cup of coffee with Boston, wasn't the timing of that promotion largely irrelevant as long as it occurred after the first month or so of the season? 

With his performance in AAA there was no reason why they couldn't wait until May of the following year, his numbers in AAA were average, he struggled with an injury (wrist?) and hi game had some obvious flaws (hitting from the right side was bad, too many Ks) that he still has been working on to this point.

If you went strictly on a basis of "calling guys up when their numbers say they have earned their callup", Moncada would not have been called up in 2017 and Eloy would have been called up in 2018, and we did the opposite.

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It's funny how just a few players, Tatis, Vlad are changing the perception on the lower end of the age argument. Now we can consider rushing guys. Of course Madrigal is ready. He played college ball and is 22.

I'm surprised Nelson Cruz isn't turning around the age argument the other way. Can u imagine if Jose is still raking like this at 39? But I didn't realize some are saying he's a steroid guy and that's why. 

I'm patiently waiting. There will be outliers on both ends of the age spectrum. For the record ... I am all for bringing up 21 year olds if they are deemed amazing and letting guys play to Julio Franco like ages if they can hit and run.

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11 minutes ago, flavum said:

The only difference there is they knew going into 2019 the team wasn't competing for a playoff spot. If they feel 2020 is gettable, maybe getting Robert and Madrigal some major league time this year will help the cause. I'm on the side of just keeping both of them down all season, but if they did call them up in August, it would be very exciting for the fans.

This is absolutely spot on why you can't say "if you kept Eloy down you can keep Madrigal/Robert down".  Middle of a rebuild vs. supposedly turning the corner - there's a difference in approach.  

I look at the trade deadline the same way.  2 years ago it didn't matter who they traded because you knew the next year was not penciled in as being competitive.  This year it's a bit different.  Colome has some value in the following year that he might not have had 2 years ago.  What the next year projects to be changes the value calculation on whether you accept any trade offers.

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If Robert rakes these next 3 weeks in Charlotte, which I think he likely will, I would call him up after TDL. Madrigal on the other hand could use another month in Bham and spend rest of year in Charlotte, then the first few weeks next season.

Difference is I think Robert is someone who needs more seasoning at MLB level to make adjustments. If he called up the last 2 months and struggles but comes back next year and sets up himself up for a solid rookie year, that's a win for us. Madrigal, with how fundamentally sound he is, shouldn't need much time to get adjusted at the highest level, I'd rather play the service clock game with him. 

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3 minutes ago, OneDog847 said:

He only has 125 plate appearances in AA. I think the Sox let him finish the year there and start next year in Charlotte. 

What's the rush? 

Given how he's shown at BHam I think he gets a taste of Charlotte this year for sure. 

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