Free Agency - How confident are you?

[BackDoorBreach]

Just now, Balta1701 said:

I could believe that too. I think the difference between those 2 contracts seems fairly minor. If I was willing to go to 7/$225 I'd probably do the 8/$240 just to make sure I got him. 

This is the main thing right here.

[Balta1701]

Just now, BackDoorBreach said:

8/240 wew.  Don't mind the money but 8 years with no opt outs is a risk.

6/180-200 would be where I'd want him. Either way if that's going to be the asking price they need to pull the trigger.

The only way he gets less than David Prices 7/$217 IMO is if he get hurt before this season ends. I would say that the largest FA contract ever given to a pitcher is a starting point.

[Jack Parkman]

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

The only way he gets less than David Prices 7/$217 IMO is if he get hurt before this season ends. I would say that the largest FA contract ever given to a pitcher is a starting point.

The starting point is 7/220 imo. Someone is going to go to 240, and if it's the Sox they should heavily frontload it. Like 45M the first 3 years and then go from there. 

Edited August 22, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[BackDoorBreach]

At the end of the day its 30 mil a year at those years which is absolutely doable and fair.  I just hope they understand this time that cutesy offers with incentives don't work with elite talent.  Pay that man.

[Balta1701]

16 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

At the end of the day its 30 mil a year at those years which is absolutely doable and fair.  I just hope they understand this time that cutesy offers with incentives don't work with elite talent.  Pay that man.

This is why, frankly, I don't believe the White Sox will even bother this year. With professional teams like the Yankees and Dodgers in the bidding, cutesy stuff won't matter.

[BackDoorBreach]

Dodgers will be in play, they shed a good amount of payroll going into 2020.

Yankees I just don't see doing 30/yr as they have other holes to address and that would put them probably over 200 mil signing Cole alone.  I see them making a trade for a pitcher more likely.   

[Superstar Lamar]

31 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

At the end of the day its 30 mil a year at those years which is absolutely doable and fair.  I just hope they understand this time that cutesy offers with incentives don't work with elite talent.  Pay that man.

They understood it last time.

Last off season was all theater.  Sure they would have taken Machado at their price but they knew they weren't going to compete.

They will offer Cole 8/240 but with a team opt out if he doesn't throw 300 innings in each year.

[Balta1701]

43 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

Dodgers will be in play, they shed a good amount of payroll going into 2020.

Yankees I just don't see doing 30/yr as they have other holes to address and that would put them probably over 200 mil signing Cole alone.  I see them making a trade for a pitcher more likely.   

I would say it probably depends on what happens in the postseason...but I would genuinely be surprised if the Yankees stayed beneath the tax next year again. Since the tax was instituted, the only 2 years when the Yankees didn't pay it are 2018 and 2019. They have the money to absolutely blow past it if they want to.

If they go out in the ALCS and Cole is sitting there...after the way this season has gone and their starting pitching being their likeliest Achilles heel against the Astros, they're going to be up near the top. What their final number is I won't guess, but $200 million is not an issue for that franchise. They could readily go up to the point where they start losing draft picks. 

 

Edit: Also worth thinking about, these 2 teams are playoff rivals. If hypothetically the Dodgers were willing to go to $250, the last thing the Yankees would want is for the Dodgers to get him for only $220. That's an extra high level reliever the Dodgers could afford that could pitch against the Yankees in the playoffs several years in a row, if they both got that far. So strategically they both have reason to put their strongest bid on the table and not mess around, and Boras will happily use that. 

[Chicago White Sox]

5 hours ago, fathom said:

Passan was just on ESPN1000. He said something is seriously wrong if the Sox don’t go after Cole. He did mention the Yanks, Astros and Angels as teams that will be in on him.  He thought he would want to go higher than 8/240.

He’s not wrong, Cole would be a perfect addition for this team.  Just make him the Manny offer (without the options) and he would be ours.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

5 hours ago, fathom said:

Passan was just on ESPN1000. He said something is seriously wrong if the Sox don’t go after Cole. He did mention the Yanks, Astros and Angels as teams that will be in on him.  He thought he would want to go higher than 8/240.

This is not news. It could be  media guy schilling for Boras. We all know what the problem is if they try but do not land him. They would be outbid in years and money or all things being equal a more desirable place to play, We all know that $68M is still the top money Reinsdorf has ever allowed the team to spend on one contract. Throw in that he hates doing it long term for pitchers and the odds of the Sox signing him or anyone else requiring long years and top money without idiotic owner protection clauses is practically nil.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

8 years for a 30 year old pitcher lol

[Hatchetman]

5 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

8 years for a 30 year old pitcher lol

One that averages 6 innings per start. That’s the world we live in.

[Chicago White Sox]

15 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

8 years for a 30 year old pitcher lol

If there are enough suitors, that’s what he’ll get.  He’s a top three pitcher in baseball and has shown to be pretty durable.  Also, he’ll be 29 next year for the vast majority of the season, not that makes a huge difference.

[NWINFan]

If the figures thrown around on this board are realistic view of what can happen, I don't have much confidence the Sox will do anything.

[Bob Sacamano]

1 hour ago, NWINFan said:

If the figures thrown around on this board are realistic view of what can happen, I don't have much confidence the Sox will do anything.

After lost offseason, it's a fair take.

[beautox]

I have 0 confidence the sox will be players in this off season's elite free agents with the exception of Will Smith. They're more likely to make a trade or two and sign players like Matt Moore looking for a bounce back with Kopech and Rodon on their way back.

 

I envision something like this and i'm not endorssing bringing back Abreu for more than anything but a year + opition but here it is.

 

Re-Sign Abreu for 2 years 28 Mil with an option for 12M and 4M buy out

Sign RP Will Smith* 3 years 29 Mil

Sign SP Matt Moore* 1 year 3 Mil

Trade SP Dunning/Stiever + OF Rutherford*/Walker* + 1B Sheets* to the Mariners for SP Marco Gonzales*

 

DH - Mercedes
C - Collins*
1B - Abreu
2B - Madrigal
SS - Anderson
3B - Moncada#
LF - Jimenez
CF - Robert
RF - Garcia#

Robert
Anderson
Moncada#
Jimenez
Abreu
Mercedes
Collins*
Garcia#
Madrigal

C - McCann
IF - Sanchez#
UT - Goins*
UT - Mendick

SP - Giolito
SP - Lopez
SP - Gonzales* <- Trade from SEA
SP - Cease
SP - Moore* / Kopech / Rodon*

CL - Colome
SU - Bummer*
SU - Smith*
MR - Fry*
MR - Cordero
LO - Frare*
LR - Hererra

[SonofaRoache]

We need to acquire two solid pitchers this offseason with all of the money we have. This should be our rotation in early June with no restrictions. 

Vet FA

Gio

Vet FA

Cease

Kopech

Lopez and Rodon should be sent to the pen for next season. 

A productive bullpen arm, RF and DH is all that is left to round out the 2020 starters. Collins and McCann should be able to handle the catching. 

My concern is that Vaugn is the only trade chip we have to bolster our roster if things go well next season. I like our guys, but who could really frontline a big deal? Our top guys who'd be available either are hurt all the time or trying to find their way. The only solution us to find good players who are vastly overpaid and pay the salary to offer lesser talent. 

 

Edited August 23, 2019 by SonofaRoache

[Jack Parkman]

2 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

We need to acquire two solid pitchers this offseason with all of the money we have. This should be our rotation in early June with no restrictions. 

Vet FA

Gio

Vet FA

Cease

Kopech

Lopez and Rodon should be sent to the pen for next season. 

A productive bullpen arm, RF and DH is all that is left to round out the 2020 starters. Collins and McCann should be able to handle the catching. 

My concern is that Vaugn is the only trade chip we have to bolster our roster if things go well next season. I like our guys, but who could really frontline a big deal? Our top guys who'd be available either are hurt all the time or trying to find their way. The only solution us to find good players who are vastly overpaid and pay the salary to offer lesser talent. 

 

They can't afford to do this any other way than to pay up in FA. Unless someone breaks out next year they aren't going to be able to acquire anyone via trade. 

[SonofaRoache]

19 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

They can't afford to do this any other way than to pay up in FA. Unless someone breaks out next year they aren't going to be able to acquire anyone via trade. 

I agree with this and it isn't a good feeling. I would like the media to ask Hahn how high our payroll can go next year and beyond. We may be better off signing players to 4 year deals or less to have their money off the books in after 2023. 

[Chicago White Sox]

On 8/22/2019 at 1:31 PM, Jack Parkman said:

The starting point is 7/220 imo. Someone is going to go to 240, and if it's the Sox they should heavily frontload it. Like 45M the first 3 years and then go from there. 

For the millionth time, front loading contracts does not create value, especially when we’ll never be a luxury tax team.

[Chicago White Sox]

20 hours ago, beautox said:

I have 0 confidence the sox will be players in this off season's elite free agents with the exception of Will Smith. They're more likely to make a trade or two and sign players like Matt Moore looking for a bounce back with Kopech and Rodon on their way back.

 

I envision something like this and i'm not endorssing bringing back Abreu for more than anything but a year + opition but here it is.

 

Re-Sign Abreu for 2 years 28 Mil with an option for 12M and 4M buy out

Sign RP Will Smith* 3 years 29 Mil

Sign SP Matt Moore* 1 year 3 Mil

Trade SP Dunning/Stiever + OF Rutherford*/Walker* + 1B Sheets* to the Mariners for SP Marco Gonzales*

 

DH - Mercedes
C - Collins*
1B - Abreu
2B - Madrigal
SS - Anderson
3B - Moncada#
LF - Jimenez
CF - Robert
RF - Garcia#

Robert
Anderson
Moncada#
Jimenez
Abreu
Mercedes
Collins*
Garcia#
Madrigal

C - McCann
IF - Sanchez#
UT - Goins*
UT - Mendick

SP - Giolito
SP - Lopez
SP - Gonzales* <- Trade from SEA
SP - Cease
SP - Moore* / Kopech / Rodon*

CL - Colome
SU - Bummer*
SU - Smith*
MR - Fry*
MR - Cordero
LO - Frare*
LR - Hererra

I’d question my White Sox fandom if that was our offseason.  That being said, there is zero chance something so pathetic like what you mapped out here happens.  The Sox will not be rocking a $75M payroll next year, which is exactly what you’re suggesting.

[zisk]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’d question my White Sox fandom if that was our offseason.  That being said, there is zero chance something so pathetic like what you mapped out here happens.  The Sox will not be rocking a $75M payroll next year, which is exactly what you’re suggesting.

Marco G. has pitched solidly for 2 years now, but in a smaller pack his home rum rate might double. If that were the case, he would have trouble just staying in

the rotation. Remember he gives up more hits than innings pitched. Add a few taters to that and it could spell disaster.

[beautox]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’d question my White Sox fandom if that was our offseason.  That being said, there is zero chance something so pathetic like what you mapped out here happens.  The Sox will not be rocking a $75M payroll next year, which is exactly what you’re suggesting.

Where then will they spend the money? on Cole, Rendon or Ozuna? please anyone who has followed this org knows that isn't happening especially after they shit the bed last off-season and got minimal blow back from it.

[SoxBlanco]

52 minutes ago, beautox said:

Where then will they spend the money? on Cole, Rendon or Ozuna? please anyone who has followed this org knows that isn't happening especially after they shit the bed last off-season and got minimal blow back from it.

What do you think the chances are that we sign at least one of the following players?...

Cole, Rendon, Ozuna, Grandal, Bumgarner, Wheeler, JDM, Castellanos, Strasburg, Betances

[Jack Parkman]

10 minutes ago, SoxBlanco said:

What do you think the chances are that we sign at least one of the following players?...

Cole, Rendon, Ozuna, Grandal, Bumgarner, Wheeler, JDM, Castellanos, Strasburg, Betances

I'm assuming he thinks it's zero, or non zero(meaning less than 0.01% but greater than zero)