Free Agency - How confident are you?

[spiderman]

11 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

Last winter, Buster Olney laughed when people thought the White Sox would sign a premier guy. He isn't a shock guy. He isn't a moron. Until Buster can't laugh anymore, having confidence the White Sox will actually convert on any player of this ilk has to be very low.

They are probably not going to be outbid the high spending teams on an elite free agents. That's what it's tough to imagine them landing an ace in free agency (if there is one available). I can see them landing offensive talent, again not the best on the market, but the next level down. With offense though, it's a bit easier if you have a need at a position, in theory, there is less of a market vs. a starting pitcher where most teams who want to spend.....

[Flash]

13 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

Moving Anderson to RF is crazy talk. Either he is the SS for this team or you trade him.  What makes Tim valuable is his bat at SS and the potential to be a good defender. Having him relearn a completely different position is just bonkers. 

I like his bat but he is 26 years old in his 4th year as starting SS w/500 games under his belt. He ain't turning into Ozzie Smith or even Ozzie Guillan. If you can keep his bat and upgrade the most important position AND add LH balance to lineup without significant payroll burden, why wouldn't you try him in RF ?  

[GermanSoxFan]

1 minute ago, Flash said:

I like his bat but he is 26 years old in his 4th year as starting SS w/500 games under his belt. He ain't turning into Ozzie Smith or even Ozzie Guillan. If you can keep his bat and upgrade the most important position AND add LH balance to lineup without significant payroll burden, why wouldn't you try him in RF ?  

Because his bat wouldn‘t play at RF nearly as well. So you would turn him into a average at best RF offensively who would need to adjust to a new position where he would probably struggle.

Congrats on turning him into a replacement level player.

[ChiSox59]

39 minutes ago, Flash said:

Gregorious won't be 30 until next Feb. Been injured for most of this year but had 4.6 WAR in 2018 and 4.0 in 2017. Obviously the very definition of stop gap.

Lol you’re signing Gregorious to be you SS for the next 4-5 seasons over Tim Anderson? Alrighty then.

Didi is a good ball player. Not saying he isn’t. But guys we have a SS - they aren’t moving Anderson to the OF. They aren’t signing a 30 year old SS just to move Anderson to a position he’s never played. 

[caulfield12]

It's much more logical to put Anderson in CF over Robert, because Luis is comfortable on both corners and that would seem to reduce the risk of injury (somewhat) as well.

Anderson's bat would play much better there than at a corner.

 

Undoubtedly won't happen anyway.

 

[SoxBlanco]

6 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

Do they re-sign Abreu or not? 

In my hypothetical, yes. 

[poppysox]

14 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

Do they re-sign Abreu or not? 

When the all star first basemen says he only wants to play for the White Sox...when the Sox don't have a replacement as of yet...and all indications are he will sign at a discount...THEY WILL RE-SIGN ABREU IMO.

[caulfield12]

14 minutes ago, poppysox said:

When the all star first basemen says he only wants to play for the White Sox...when the Sox don't have a replacement as of yet...and all indications are he will sign at a discount...THEY WILL RE-SIGN ABREU IMO.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/chicago-white-sox/jose-abreu-13653/cash-earnings/

Seems he’s made an extra $6 million or so compared to that original deal.  How much of a cut will he accept from his one year deal for $16 million with his current statistical line in 2019?  

For example, $12.8 million would be a 20% pay cut.

 

[poppysox]

4 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/chicago-white-sox/jose-abreu-13653/cash-earnings/

Seems he’s made an extra $6 million or so compared to that original deal.  How much of a cut will he accept from his one year deal for $16 million with his current statistical line in 2019?  

For example, $12.8 million would be a 20% pay cut.

 

Obviously none of us know.  My guess (desire) would be the 12-14 range.  It won't surprise me if the Sox pay him 16-18 because they are very loyal to those they consider loyal to them.  It's Jerrys money so I'm fine with whatever they do.

[Superstar Lamar]

2 years and 26 million puts him at a nice, even 100 million earned from the Sox. 

[ChiSox59]

35 minutes ago, Superstar Lamar said:

2 years and 26 million puts him at a nice, even 100 million earned from the Sox. 

Would be an overpay, IMO. 

[mqr]

30 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Would be an overpay, IMO. 

I'd be cool with it if there's an option there

[Jose Abreu]

Quote

Teams that want Cole understand that he's getting more than $200 million this offseason. How much more is the question. The record deal for a starter is David Price's $217 million. The record per year for a pitcher is Zack Greinke's $34.4 million (or, for the pedants who factor in the price of deferred money in Greinke's deal, Justin Verlander's $33 million). Cole seeking Price's seven years at Greinke's average annual value is not out of the realm of possibility, not with the Astros, New York Yankees, Philadelphia Phillies, Los Angeles Angels, Chicago White Sox, St. Louis Cardinals, Chicago Cubs, San Francisco Giantsand Atlanta Braves all positioned and motivated to explore adding Cole.

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/27483166/passan-playing-20-questions-2019-20-mlb-hot-stove-season

[he gone.]

Gimme a buncha shares of Scooter Gennett @ a discounted price this winter. I'd take him on a bounce back contract or a 2-3 year deal if he's willing. Give him maybe 1yr, $7mm. Or maybe something like 3 years and $15mm. If that can get the deal done let's do it. I'd actually love to bring him in for the rest of the year. Who cares if it costs $2mm. Let him learn the coaches, team, city, etc. and see if there's a mutual fit. 

He's played the OF before, played a few games at 3B, obviously plays 2B. Don't see why he wouldn't be able to play 1B in a pinch and also DH. Make him our Ben Zobrist. Let him play 2b for April/May until Madrigal is called up & then you shift him to playing 4-6 games a week. Get him a start at 1B, 2B, 3B, OF, and DH each week. That's 5 games a week on average. 

You're basically getting a nice super utility guy at a reasonable price who should hit .290, 20HR, and hit some double with maybe a .800 OPS. Maybe he doesn't do that well, but I'd take that over Yolmer. 

 

Outside of that my targets are Justin Smoak on a 1 year deal. Again that's around a $3-7mm commitment. Let him be your DH/1B with Abreu. Smoak has amazing Statcast numbers. Give him a shot for a year, can't go worse than Alonso. 

OF I'd want to sign Marcell Ozuna or Puig. Not a fan of their low OBP, however they both play hard, good D, and bring pop. 

 

You now have an OF of Eloy, Robert, Ozuna. An IF of Moncada, Anderson, Gennett, Abreu/Smoak. Catcher is Collins and Mercedes. Madrigal by May. Gennett to super UTIL role. 

 

Pitching I'm okay with a Nova resigning for cheap. I'd go out and sign a few other wild cards. Maybe Rich Hill if Dodgers let him go. Give him like 2 years and $25mm. He's the type of guy that will be hurt, but that's fine. If you truly are going to make the playoffs as long as he's healthy then he can be a real asset. Plus you'd have Rodon coming back halfway through the season too. I just want like 7sp, you have stack extras like the Dodgers knowing you'll have injuries. Then why not throw a few bucks at Alex Wood too. Also always injured. Give him a Sonny Gray type contract. Now you have a buncha guys and don't have to care about Kopechs innings limit as much. Can give him rest. Wait on Rodon, etc. 

Giolito, Lopez, Cease, Wood, Nova to start the year. Hill out bullpen in a multi inning late reliever role. Kopech by mid-April/May. Maybe move to a 6 man rotation. 

By Summer you probably have Nova as a middle reliever guy. You have time to ease Rodon into a SP role again. Wood and/or Hill are hurt. Rotation is Gio, Lopez, Cease, Kopech + healthy body. 

 

Total spend: $7mm on Gennett 1 year. $5mm Smoak, 1 year. $25mm on Hill over 2 years. Wood $50mm over 4 years. Nova $4mm, 1 year. All affordable and shorter term guys. Not bad. 

 

Ozuna would be your prize. And you'd have to pay him maybe 4 years and $80? Have no idea if that's low or high. 

[South Side Fireworks Man]

14 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

Gimme a buncha shares of Scooter Gennett @ a discounted price this winter. I'd take him on a bounce back contract or a 2-3 year deal if he's willing. Give him maybe 1yr, $7mm. Or maybe something like 3 years and $15mm. If that can get the deal done let's do it. I'd actually love to bring him in for the rest of the year. Who cares if it costs $2mm. Let him learn the coaches, team, city, etc. and see if there's a mutual fit. 

He's played the OF before, played a few games at 3B, obviously plays 2B. Don't see why he wouldn't be able to play 1B in a pinch and also DH. Make him our Ben Zobrist. Let him play 2b for April/May until Madrigal is called up & then you shift him to playing 4-6 games a week. Get him a start at 1B, 2B, 3B, OF, and DH each week. That's 5 games a week on average. 

You're basically getting a nice super utility guy at a reasonable price who should hit .290, 20HR, and hit some double with maybe a .800 OPS. Maybe he doesn't do that well, but I'd take that over Yolmer. 

I'd love to see the Sox sign him.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

I'd like them to find the next Scooter Gennett.

[spiderman]

As much as I am excited about 2020, it could be another transition year. It boils down primarily to the starting rotation. I am confident that they will address the offense, but as long as the rotation is in question, so will the team's success.

Next year, Giolito is likely to be the #1 in the rotation. There isn't a #2 or #3 on the current team.

Lopez, Cease, Rodon (at some point), Kopech (probably right away), perhaps a backend starter option for insurance (Nova??) fill it out, but, even with upside, should be your #4 and #5 options until they grow into higher roles. 

I don't think they will sign Cole, but they will add some veteran to this mix..

[RTC]

If “discounted price”, “bounce back”, “resigning for cheap”, “low OBP” or “always injured” are used by Hahn relative to any FA targets this winter he should be fired.  The time for that crap has passed.

[he gone.]

1 hour ago, RTC said:

If “discounted price”, “bounce back”, “resigning for cheap”, “low OBP” or “always injured” are used by Hahn relative to any FA targets this winter he should be fired.  The time for that crap has passed.

Maybe so. But my suggestions are more or less "realistic". The Sox are never going to go out and sign a big name. So take Cole and Rendon off the list right away. They are most likely to go after short contract guys. Has been proven over & over. 

[Sarava]

4 hours ago, BrianAnderson said:

Gimme a buncha shares of Scooter Gennett @ a discounted price this winter. I'd take him on a bounce back contract or a 2-3 year deal if he's willing. Give him maybe 1yr, $7mm. Or maybe something like 3 years and $15mm. If that can get the deal done let's do it. I'd actually love to bring him in for the rest of the year. Who cares if it costs $2mm. Let him learn the coaches, team, city, etc. and see if there's a mutual fit. 

He's played the OF before, played a few games at 3B, obviously plays 2B. Don't see why he wouldn't be able to play 1B in a pinch and also DH. Make him our Ben Zobrist. Let him play 2b for April/May until Madrigal is called up & then you shift him to playing 4-6 games a week. Get him a start at 1B, 2B, 3B, OF, and DH each week. That's 5 games a week on average. 

You're basically getting a nice super utility guy at a reasonable price who should hit .290, 20HR, and hit some double with maybe a .800 OPS. Maybe he doesn't do that well, but I'd take that over Yolmer. 

 

Outside of that my targets are Justin Smoak on a 1 year deal. Again that's around a $3-7mm commitment. Let him be your DH/1B with Abreu. Smoak has amazing Statcast numbers. Give him a shot for a year, can't go worse than Alonso. 

OF I'd want to sign Marcell Ozuna or Puig. Not a fan of their low OBP, however they both play hard, good D, and bring pop. 

 

You now have an OF of Eloy, Robert, Ozuna. An IF of Moncada, Anderson, Gennett, Abreu/Smoak. Catcher is Collins and Mercedes. Madrigal by May. Gennett to super UTIL role. 

 

Pitching I'm okay with a Nova resigning for cheap. I'd go out and sign a few other wild cards. Maybe Rich Hill if Dodgers let him go. Give him like 2 years and $25mm. He's the type of guy that will be hurt, but that's fine. If you truly are going to make the playoffs as long as he's healthy then he can be a real asset. Plus you'd have Rodon coming back halfway through the season too. I just want like 7sp, you have stack extras like the Dodgers knowing you'll have injuries. Then why not throw a few bucks at Alex Wood too. Also always injured. Give him a Sonny Gray type contract. Now you have a buncha guys and don't have to care about Kopechs innings limit as much. Can give him rest. Wait on Rodon, etc. 

Giolito, Lopez, Cease, Wood, Nova to start the year. Hill out bullpen in a multi inning late reliever role. Kopech by mid-April/May. Maybe move to a 6 man rotation. 

By Summer you probably have Nova as a middle reliever guy. You have time to ease Rodon into a SP role again. Wood and/or Hill are hurt. Rotation is Gio, Lopez, Cease, Kopech + healthy body. 

 

 Total spend: $7mm on Gennett 1 year. $5mm Smoak, 1 year. $25mm on Hill over 2 years. Wood $50mm over 4 years. Nova $4mm, 1 year. All affordable and shorter term guys. Not bad. 

 

Ozuna would be your prize. And you'd have to pay him maybe 4 years and $80? Have no idea if that's low or high. 

If the Sox off-season goes anything like this, then that would be depressing. The free agent class in 2021 is terrible. They need to load up this winter, not go bargain basement hunting. There's no excuse to not bring in a big name pitcher, whether it's via free agency or trade.

[poppysox]

6 hours ago, BrianAnderson said:

Gimme a buncha shares of Scooter Gennett @ a discounted price this winter. I'd take him on a bounce back contract or a 2-3 year deal if he's willing. Give him maybe 1yr, $7mm. Or maybe something like 3 years and $15mm. If that can get the deal done let's do it. I'd actually love to bring him in for the rest of the year. Who cares if it costs $2mm. Let him learn the coaches, team, city, etc. and see if there's a mutual fit. 

He's played the OF before, played a few games at 3B, obviously plays 2B. Don't see why he wouldn't be able to play 1B in a pinch and also DH. Make him our Ben Zobrist. Let him play 2b for April/May until Madrigal is called up & then you shift him to playing 4-6 games a week. Get him a start at 1B, 2B, 3B, OF, and DH each week. That's 5 games a week on average. 

You're basically getting a nice super utility guy at a reasonable price who should hit .290, 20HR, and hit some double with maybe a .800 OPS. Maybe he doesn't do that well, but I'd take that over Yolmer. 

 

Outside of that my targets are Justin Smoak on a 1 year deal. Again that's around a $3-7mm commitment. Let him be your DH/1B with Abreu. Smoak has amazing Statcast numbers. Give him a shot for a year, can't go worse than Alonso. 

OF I'd want to sign Marcell Ozuna or Puig. Not a fan of their low OBP, however they both play hard, good D, and bring pop. 

 

You now have an OF of Eloy, Robert, Ozuna. An IF of Moncada, Anderson, Gennett, Abreu/Smoak. Catcher is Collins and Mercedes. Madrigal by May. Gennett to super UTIL role. 

 

Pitching I'm okay with a Nova resigning for cheap. I'd go out and sign a few other wild cards. Maybe Rich Hill if Dodgers let him go. Give him like 2 years and $25mm. He's the type of guy that will be hurt, but that's fine. If you truly are going to make the playoffs as long as he's healthy then he can be a real asset. Plus you'd have Rodon coming back halfway through the season too. I just want like 7sp, you have stack extras like the Dodgers knowing you'll have injuries. Then why not throw a few bucks at Alex Wood too. Also always injured. Give him a Sonny Gray type contract. Now you have a buncha guys and don't have to care about Kopechs innings limit as much. Can give him rest. Wait on Rodon, etc. 

Giolito, Lopez, Cease, Wood, Nova to start the year. Hill out bullpen in a multi inning late reliever role. Kopech by mid-April/May. Maybe move to a 6 man rotation. 

By Summer you probably have Nova as a middle reliever guy. You have time to ease Rodon into a SP role again. Wood and/or Hill are hurt. Rotation is Gio, Lopez, Cease, Kopech + healthy body. 

 

Total spend: $7mm on Gennett 1 year. $5mm Smoak, 1 year. $25mm on Hill over 2 years. Wood $50mm over 4 years. Nova $4mm, 1 year. All affordable and shorter term guys. Not bad. 

 

Ozuna would be your prize. And you'd have to pay him maybe 4 years and $80? Have no idea if that's low or high. 

Like your Gennett guy...good name to consider.  Nova would work OK for me as well...more for starter depth and long relief.  Smoak, Puig an Wood don't do much for me.

[caulfield12]

Gennett is fine to replace Yolmer and at least offers some upside...but these last few pages read like 2014~16 mode.

We had four core players...traded away young talent and got exactly nowhere with the likes of Robertson and Frazier.

It even feels like Shark back then was a bigger move than anyone but Cole Strasburg Wheeler and Bumgarner this time around.

And that bullpen still is shaky as long as they can't rely at all on Herrera.

Edited August 29, 2019 by caulfield12

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

8 hours ago, BrianAnderson said:

Gimme a buncha shares of Scooter Gennett @ a discounted price this winter. I'd take him on a bounce back contract or a 2-3 year deal if he's willing. Give him maybe 1yr, $7mm. Or maybe something like 3 years and $15mm. If that can get the deal done let's do it. I'd actually love to bring him in for the rest of the year. Who cares if it costs $2mm. Let him learn the coaches, team, city, etc. and see if there's a mutual fit. 

He's played the OF before, played a few games at 3B, obviously plays 2B. Don't see why he wouldn't be able to play 1B in a pinch and also DH. Make him our Ben Zobrist. Let him play 2b for April/May until Madrigal is called up & then you shift him to playing 4-6 games a week. Get him a start at 1B, 2B, 3B, OF, and DH each week. That's 5 games a week on average. 

You're basically getting a nice super utility guy at a reasonable price who should hit .290, 20HR, and hit some double with maybe a .800 OPS. Maybe he doesn't do that well, but I'd take that over Yolmer. 

 

Outside of that my targets are Justin Smoak on a 1 year deal. Again that's around a $3-7mm commitment. Let him be your DH/1B with Abreu. Smoak has amazing Statcast numbers. Give him a shot for a year, can't go worse than Alonso. 

OF I'd want to sign Marcell Ozuna or Puig. Not a fan of their low OBP, however they both play hard, good D, and bring pop. 

 

You now have an OF of Eloy, Robert, Ozuna. An IF of Moncada, Anderson, Gennett, Abreu/Smoak. Catcher is Collins and Mercedes. Madrigal by May. Gennett to super UTIL role. 

 

Pitching I'm okay with a Nova resigning for cheap. I'd go out and sign a few other wild cards. Maybe Rich Hill if Dodgers let him go. Give him like 2 years and $25mm. He's the type of guy that will be hurt, but that's fine. If you truly are going to make the playoffs as long as he's healthy then he can be a real asset. Plus you'd have Rodon coming back halfway through the season too. I just want like 7sp, you have stack extras like the Dodgers knowing you'll have injuries. Then why not throw a few bucks at Alex Wood too. Also always injured. Give him a Sonny Gray type contract. Now you have a buncha guys and don't have to care about Kopechs innings limit as much. Can give him rest. Wait on Rodon, etc. 

Giolito, Lopez, Cease, Wood, Nova to start the year. Hill out bullpen in a multi inning late reliever role. Kopech by mid-April/May. Maybe move to a 6 man rotation. 

By Summer you probably have Nova as a middle reliever guy. You have time to ease Rodon into a SP role again. Wood and/or Hill are hurt. Rotation is Gio, Lopez, Cease, Kopech + healthy body. 

 

Total spend: $7mm on Gennett 1 year. $5mm Smoak, 1 year. $25mm on Hill over 2 years. Wood $50mm over 4 years. Nova $4mm, 1 year. All affordable and shorter term guys. Not bad. 

 

Ozuna would be your prize. And you'd have to pay him maybe 4 years and $80? Have no idea if that's low or high. 

Sounds like what I've been saying about Gennett for about a month ,OF and/or supersub , and often repeating myself. Welcome aboard.

[ChiSox59]

7 minutes ago, Moan4Yoan said:

Watch out for Look at Ray Ray Run and ChiSox59 saying stuff like this.  ?

The difference is - he hasn't repeated himself 3,707 times like you have. 

Having the opinion that the White Sox aren't going to sign Rendon and/or Cole (a very fair take, mind you) is not the same thing as stating that since Manny Machado signed elsewhere, the White Sox will never again sign a free agent of note and will be relegated to signing the likes of Jon Jay, Ivan Nova and Welington Castillo for the rest of time.  While also completely ignoring the context of when said signings were made.  You consistently lack the ability to comprehend that the White Sox have not been trying to fill gaps with top tier players since they began this rebuild.  Things change next season - and this is abundantly obvious.  They took a shot at boosting things by getting a premier talent in Machado before they were really ready for him.  He signed elsewhere.  That doesn't mean the plan changes.  

There, I explained it to you yet again.  

[Moan4Yoan]

We can reconvene in the offseason.  I am still hoping for the best.  The Sox need to add a couple starters for sure.  I think we can agree on that.