Sox changing up their amateur scouting department according to Mark Gonzales

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Just now, Jack Parkman said:

Idk what you guys are confused by. 

Drafting is all about comps and projection. When you do things that no one has ever done you are taking a shot and deserve credit. You think madrigal sucks despite a 172 wRC+ and it's because you're doing what everyone does - pigeon holing him because of his size. Yet you're saying they deserve no credit for not doing that. Kind of odd.

[Chicago White Sox]

26 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

It doesn't even have to be their first round pick, and I know that baseball is the biggest crapshoot of them all. At some point, you have to hit on some of these guys. They have virtually nothing to show for their 2016 and 2017 drafts. If they hit on some lower round players instead that would be one thing, but it is mistake after mistake. I don't blame them for Hansen as those are the kind of risks you're supposed to take in the second round, but dammit don't come up empty two years in a row. Is that too much to ask? They have no T100 guys from either draft. They have interesting players(Collins, Sheets, Gonzalez, Lambert) but not much beyond that. 

Collins, Burdi, & Hansen were all top 100 prospects at one point.  Is it Hostetler’s fault they hit developmental roadblocks or that Hahn didn’t trade before their value eroded?  A few years ago Collins and Hansen could have been the #2 & 3 pieces in a possible Yelich deal.

While the book is still out on Hostetler, I still think player development and self scouting are the far bigger issues at the moment.

[mqr]

Hostetler named special assistant to GM. Sounds like a promotion?

[caulfield12]

9 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

What was his average draft position? If you're regularly getting starting big leaguers from 1/2 your drafts and you're a playoff team every year already, so that you're drafting after #25, that's elite performance. Getting good players in 1/2 your drafts during a 10 year playoff run would be exceptional. 

~ THEO EPSTEIN (17 PLAYERS TOTAL ON 40-MAN ROSTER)

THEO EPSTEIN DRAFT PICKS (13)

Dustin Pedroia: 2004, second round, 65th overall
Clay Buchholz: 2005, first round, 42nd overall (compensation pick for Pedro Martinez signing with Mets)
Christian Vazquez: 2008, ninth round, 292nd overall
Bryce Brentz: 2010, first round, 36th overall (compensation pick for Billy Wagner signing with Braves) 
Sean Coyle: 2010, third round, 110th overall
Matt Barnes: 2011, first round, 19th overall
Blake Swihart: 2011, first round, 26th overall (compensation pick for Adrian Beltre signing with Rangers)
Henry Owens: 2011, first round, 36th overall (compensation pick for Victor Martinez signing with Tigers)
Jackie Bradley Jr.: 2011, first round, 40th overall (compensation pick for Adrian Beltre signing with Rangers)
Williams Jerez: 2011, second round, 81st overall
Noe Ramirez: 2011, fourth round, 142nd overall
Mookie Betts: 2011, fifth round, 172nd overall
Travis Shaw: 2011, ninth round, 292nd overall

[Thomas_Ventura_Roberts]

Sox announce that team has promoted Nick Hostetler to special assistant to the general manager, with a particular focus on major league scouting. They say they'll will work quickly to fill his previous role of director of amateur scouting.

 

[Balta1701]

Just now, caulfield12 said:

~ THEO EPSTEIN (17 PLAYERS TOTAL ON 40-MAN ROSTER)

THEO EPSTEIN DRAFT PICKS (13)

Dustin Pedroia: 2004, second round, 65th overall
Clay Buchholz: 2005, first round, 42nd overall (compensation pick for Pedro Martinez signing with Mets)
Christian Vazquez: 2008, ninth round, 292nd overall
Bryce Brentz: 2010, first round, 36th overall (compensation pick for Billy Wagner signing with Braves) 
Sean Coyle: 2010, third round, 110th overall
Matt Barnes: 2011, first round, 19th overall
Blake Swihart: 2011, first round, 26th overall (compensation pick for Adrian Beltre signing with Rangers)
Henry Owens: 2011, first round, 36th overall (compensation pick for Victor Martinez signing with Tigers)
Jackie Bradley Jr.: 2011, first round, 40th overall (compensation pick for Adrian Beltre signing with Rangers)
Williams Jerez: 2011, second round, 81st overall
Noe Ramirez: 2011, fourth round, 142nd overall
Mookie Betts: 2011, fifth round, 172nd overall
Travis Shaw: 2011, ninth round, 292nd overall

Wow that's great.

[Jack Parkman]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Idk what you guys are confused by. 

Drafting is all about comps and projection. When you do things that no one has ever done you are taking a shot and deserve credit. You think madrigal sucks despite a 172 wRC+ and it's because you're doing what everyone does - pigeon holing him because of his size. Yet you're saying they deserve no credit for not doing that. Kind of odd.

We're not though. I don't give two shits if either guy is 6-0 or not. When I'm picking top 5 I want a guy that has a chance to be a middle of the order bat at a premium defensive position. Vaughn and Madrigal aren't that type of player. 

[YoYoIsMyHero]

1 minute ago, mqr said:

Hostetler named special assistant to GM. Sounds like a promotion?

I think this is just the way Jerry fires people

[Jack Parkman]

Just now, YoYoIsMyHero said:

I think this is just the way Jerry fires people

Yes exactly. 

[chitownsportsfan]

Just now, YoYoIsMyHero said:

I think this is just the way Jerry fires people

that was my first thought as well.  he gets a pay raise and a new title and one of those little offices the Japanese have for folks that serve no purpose in the org anymore but everybody needs to save face.

[Jack Parkman]

4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Collins, Burdi, & Hansen were all top 100 prospects at one point.  Is it Hostetler’s fault they hit developmental roadblocks or that Hahn didn’t trade before their value eroded?  A few years ago Collins and Hansen could have been the #2 & 3 pieces in a possible Yelich deal.

While the book is still out on Hostetler, I still think player development and self scouting are the far bigger issues at the moment.

Both are issues. I've already said that. 

[caulfield12]

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Wow that's great.

And, while Schwarber/Russell/Almora/Happ have struggled...they've all at least had significant impacts at the major league level, and even Jorge Soler's not a lost cause, having a nice bounceback season for the Royals while toiling in almost total obscurity.

[Jack Parkman]

1 minute ago, chitownsportsfan said:

that was my first thought as well.  he gets a pay raise and a new title and one of those little offices the Japanese have for folks that serve no purpose in the org anymore but everybody needs to save face.

This is the way firings should be done. You get people to leave a company by treating them like Milton in Office Space. (minus the lack of pay, of course) 

Edited July 24, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[chitownsportsfan]

2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

This is the way firings should be done. You get people to leave a company by treating them like Milton in Office Space. (minus the lack of pay, of course) 

Hopefully KW and Nick are fairly evenly matched in ping pong and FIFA because they are going to have a lot of time to pass in the "special assistant" office complex.

[GermanSoxFan]

5 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

We're not though. I don't give two shits if either guy is 6-0 or not. When I'm picking top 5 I want a guy that has a chance to be a middle of the order bat at a premium defensive position. Vaughn and Madrigal aren't that type of player. 

Complaining about the Madrigal pick, seeing how well he has played, is possibly the worst take I have seen in a long time.

 

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

It used to work that way here, but no more. 

Total Quality Management/Lifetime Tenure.

That said, he can probably take Buddy Bell's old office.

If Hostetler and Hahn are good at anything, it's giving positive/uplifting interviews (Hostetler) that get you charged up or giving interviews that need to be parsed by Constitutional law scholars because they don't really tell you much at all while seeming to be candor-filled.

Except when he said "I'm a jackass" or whatever.

[Sox80]

15 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

But it's wrong.

 You can't prove that it's wrong.  Just like he can't prove that you're wrong it's opinion.  I'm not really that excited about the past drafts.  I'm with you though where it takes time . I am really excited with the approach in this past draft hopefully that continues in the future. 

[chitownsportsfan]

3 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

Complaining about the Madrigal pick, seeing how well he has played, is possibly the worst take I have seen in a long time.

 

I'll give them credit for not overthinking things with  Vaughn and Madrigal.  They didn't get too cute and try and play the "bonus pool" game, they didn't take some HS kid that hit 500 foot bombs at a showcase but is 6 years away; they took the consensus BPA and luckily both guys slot in nicely both position wise in the org and timeline wise in the rebuild.

Hey, sometimes you just need to not trip over own dick.  Good job with those picks but merely not tripping over your dick won't cut it long term.

Edited July 24, 2019 by chitownsportsfan

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

11 minutes ago, Sox80 said:

 You can't prove that it's wrong.  Just like he can't prove that you're wrong it's opinion.  I'm not really that excited about the past drafts.  I'm with you though where it takes time . I am really excited with the approach in this past draft hopefully that continues in the future. 

Its wrong because that's just not how baseball drafts work for the vast majority of MLB teams. Teams dont find 1-2 good players every year. If they did, every team would be good and filled with home grown talent. Youd be able to build an entire team nearly every 5 years from just drafting and youd never have to rebuild.

Edited July 24, 2019 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[caulfield12]

I would love to know exactly what Chris Getz is doing well...in their opinion...since he was hired.

[Dick Allen]

12 minutes ago, mqr said:

Hostetler named special assistant to GM. Sounds like a promotion?

It probably is. Amateur scouting director is a job for a single person with no outside interests. I think Nick has a family. He at least gets to go home more often now.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

1 minute ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'll give them credit for not overthinking things with  Vaughn and Madrigal.  They didn't get too cute and try and play the "bonus pool" game, they didn't take some HS kid that hit 500 foot bombs at a showcase but is 6 years away; they took the consensus BPA and luckily both guys slot in nicely both position wise in the org and timeline wise in the rebuild.

Hey, sometimes you just need to not trip over own dick.  Good job with those picks but merely not tripping over your dick won't cut it long term.

With Madrigal they did something that has never been done in baseball history. With vaughn they did something that hadn't been done in 2 decades and has only been done like 4 times in MLB history.

I just cant agree with you saying these were obvious easy choices.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

It probably is. Amateur scouting director is a job for a single person with no outside interests. I think Nick has a family. He at least gets to go home more often now.

Yes, it is the most draining job In baseball imo. On the road 95% of the year. It can be brutal.

[GenericUserName]

I can't tell if that role sounds like they "fired" him or if it actually is a promotion considering we are coming in to the point of the rebuild where we will start signing and trading for major league talent. I guess we might be able to tell more based on who replaces him. If its internal, then it would seem like they are okay with the scouting department and it is actually a promotion. If they go outside the organization it might signal that they aren't happy with the current group.

[chitownsportsfan]

1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Its wrong because that's just not how baseball drafts work for the vast majority of MLB teams. Teams dont find 1-2 good players every year. If they did, everytime would be good and filled with home grown talent. Youd be able to build an entire timely nearly every 5 years from just drafting and youd never have to rebuild.

Either through LA or the draft is how it works for good teams.  Every team will go through a drought but look how stacked the systems in Minnesota, Atlanta and Houston (among others) are despite calling up a bunch of guys.

The Sox won't have the chance to be drafting this high again hopefully anytime soon.  They have had a massive advantage in pool money and draft position the last few years.  Doing better than average should be expected.