Hahn expects aggressive offseason

[Jack Parkman]

14 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

After electing not to participate in a seller's market, there's always next time.

WTF? This deadline was definitely the furthest thing from a seller's market. It was a buyer's market extraordinaire. 

Would you have traded Colome for the return that the Tigers got for Greene? I wouldn't have, and both players have the same amount of control. Hahn did the right thing by telling the contenders to go pound sand. 

[Sarava]

5 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

WTF? This deadline was definitely the furthest thing from a seller's market. It was a buyer's market extraordinaire. 

Would you have traded Colome for the return that the Tigers got for Greene? I wouldn't have, and both players have the same amount of control. Hahn did the right thing by telling the contenders to go pound sand. 

Yeah, and to be clear about things, I have no problem with the Sox not making any moves this deadline. I very clearly stated here that I didn't think they would make any big moves.

How Rick Hahn operates has become very predictable and all signs pointed towards nothing was going to happen. I'm not sure why so many fans misread the situation.

[Jack Parkman]

1 minute ago, Sarava said:

Yeah, and to be clear about things, I have no problem with the Sox not making any moves this deadline. I very clearly stated here that I didn't think they would make any big moves.

How Rick Hahn operates has become very predictable and all signs pointed towards nothing was going to happen. I'm not sure why so many fans misread the situation.

This is very true, but the market didn't set itself until early Wednesday morning. Once it was clear that it was a huge buyers market, it was obvious they weren't doing anything. If the market changed a little bit and real talent became available, that would have been a completely different story. 

[Sarava]

I don't really agree with you on this.

There were a ton of relievers available for trade. We knew that before the morning of the deadline day. This didn't just spring up that day. MLB.com had an article the day before the deadline I believe, and they didn't even have Colome listed in their first tier of relievers available. Now we Sox fans might disagree with how they listed their tiers, but in the end, we knew Hahn would hold Colome to a high value and it would take a lot to pry him away.

With so many other options available to teams in need of a reliever, and the known hesitancy of teams to trade away top 100 prospects these days, it added up to the Sox not doing anything.

Now, I'm not upset that he didn't move him. I actually take it as a positive and hopefully that shows their intentions are to push this thing this winter. And that's good news.

I think big pitcher acquisitions this winter are more likely to come via trade than free agency though.

[Jack Parkman]

18 minutes ago, Sarava said:

I don't really agree with you on this.

There were a ton of relievers available for trade. We knew that before the morning of the deadline day. This didn't just spring up that day. MLB.com had an article the day before the deadline I believe, and they didn't even have Colome listed in their first tier of relievers available. Now we Sox fans might disagree with how they listed their tiers, but in the end, we knew Hahn would hold Colome to a high value and it would take a lot to pry him away.

With so many other options available to teams in need of a reliever, and the known hesitancy of teams to trade away top 100 prospects these days, it added up to the Sox not doing anything.

Now, I'm not upset that he didn't move him. I actually take it as a positive and hopefully that shows their intentions are to push this thing this winter. And that's good news.

I think big pitcher acquisitions this winter are more likely to come via trade than free agency though.

Are you talking about relievers of all kinds or closers only?  Giles and others got hurt, and it ended up being only Colome, Greene and Vazquez with closing experience. 

It is nearly impossible for the Sox to get the type of pitcher they need via trade. They need a TOR arm to take the pressure off of the kids. The Sox don't have much of value to trade from their farm other than guys they can't afford to trade. Any deal for a pitcher, someone is going to ask for at least one of the big 5, and those guys aren't going anywhere. The Sox aren't in the position to trade Kopech, Cease, Madrigal, or Vaughn and Robert better be completely off the damn table. 

 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[GreenSox]

30 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

WTF? This deadline was definitely the furthest thing from a seller's market. It was a buyer's market extraordinaire. 

Would you have traded Colome for the return that the Tigers got for Greene? I wouldn't have, and both players have the same amount of control. Hahn did the right thing by telling the contenders to go pound sand. 

July is  always a seller's market. Teams are looking to buy.   Yes I would have.  These are career year players, not elite relievers,  and you take what you can get.
The prices will only fall from here.   But maybe he'll trade  4 prospects for one year of a player like the "elite" Samardzija in December...get ready, because that's the kind of nonsense he's going to do.   He certainly won't outbid the big guns for Cole.

Edited August 4, 2019 by GreenSox

[Jack Parkman]

8 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

July is  always a seller's market. Teams are looking to buy.   Yes I would have.  These are career year players and you take what you can get.
The prices will only fall from here.   But maybe he'll go get us one year of a player like the "elite" Samardzija in December...get ready, because that's the kind of nonsense he's going to do.   He certainly won't outbid the big guns for Cole.

The Sox don't need more Cordell/Medeiros types. That is what the Tigers got for Greene. I'll keep Colome, thank you. 

This year was different because there's no waiver trades. This was a completely new experience for everyone. You can't draw conclusions based on past deadlines, nor can you draw any future inferences. This TDL was its own animal. 

I'm going to say this: 

If teams continue to be stingy with their prospects, fewer deals are going to get done in July. Eventually something has to give. Grienke was the only major player dealt at this deadline, and he didn't even get that much with AZ picking up a decent chunk of money. It's eventually going to turn into a giant game of chicken. 

What ever happened to the old-fashioned July Baseball trade? The Indians pulled one off, and I'd like to see more of that. More veteran or young established players traded for each other based on team needs, please. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[Sarava]

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

Are you talking about relievers of all kinds or closers only?  Giles and others got hurt, and it ended up being only Colome, Greene and Vazquez with closing experience. 

It is nearly impossible for the Sox to get the type of pitcher they need via trade. They need a TOR arm to take the pressure off of the kids. The Sox don't have much of value to trade from their farm other than guys they can't afford to trade. Any deal for a pitcher, someone is going to ask for at least one of the big 5, and those guys aren't going anywhere. The Sox aren't in the position to trade Kopech, Cease, Madrigal, or Vaughn and Robert better be completely off the damn table. 

Relievers of any kind. Teams wont hesitate to throw a good reliever in to the closer role if necessary. The market was flooded with sellers and that was known well before the last day.

And perhaps we need to be realistic. They probably aren't going to get a TOR or #1 starter this off-season. They wont take the financial risk, or as you said, give up the assets needed to trade for one. For instance, if Syndegaard was available, the Mets would surely want 2 of the untouchables you listed. You simply can't make a trade like that, which we both agree on.

As for trading - that's where I go to Andrew Vaughn again. He's the one big piece that doesn't feel necessary for this rebuild to succeed. If you package him with a few medium prospects (Walker, Dunning, etc.), then you might get a really nice young pitcher back for him. He doesn't necessarily have to be a #1 guy. But if the Sox can get a guy they feel has a good chance of being a #2, that helps a ton. You can gamble that one of Cease, Giolito or Kopech might eventually become a #1.  Or if none are #1's, but you have a few in the rotation with are #2's, and it's complimented by an explosive offense, that could be a path to winning the World Series. There's many ways to skin a cat.

 

[Jack Parkman]

4 minutes ago, Sarava said:

Relievers of any kind. Teams wont hesitate to throw a good reliever in to the closer role if necessary. The market was flooded with sellers and that was known well before the last day.

And perhaps we need to be realistic. They probably aren't going to get a TOR or #1 starter this off-season. They wont take the financial risk, or as you said, give up the assets needed to trade for one. For instance, if Syndegaard was available, the Mets would surely want 2 of the untouchables you listed. You simply can't make a trade like that, which we both agree on.

As for trading - that's where I go to Andrew Vaughn again. He's the one big piece that doesn't feel necessary for this rebuild to succeed. If you package him with a few medium prospects (Walker, Dunning, etc.), then you might get a really nice young pitcher back for him. He doesn't necessarily have to be a #1 guy. But if the Sox can get a guy they feel has a good chance of being a #2, that helps a ton. You can gamble that one of Cease, Giolito or Kopech might eventually become a #1.  Or if none are #1's, but you have a few in the rotation with are #2's, and it's complimented by an explosive offense, that could be a path to winning the World Series. There's many ways to skin a cat.

 

Agreed on Vaughn. I'd include Madrigal in that list. 

I'd consider moving Madrigal or Vaughn, but only in a 1-1 deal for a pitcher with 4+ years of control and also is cheap. If the Cardinals came and offered Flaherty straight up, that is the type of deal I'd consider. (just as an example) 

Madrigal and Vaughn don't seem entirely necessary, I agree. Madrigal is a unicorn though and I'd imagine every FO has him valued differently. 

I think there's a good chance an ace emerges from the Giolito/Kopech/Cease trio. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[GreenSox]

14 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

What ever happened to the old-fashioned July Baseball trade? The Indians pulled one off, and I'd like to see more of that. More veteran or young established players traded for each other based on team needs, please. 

The one-game playoff has depressed the prospect for starter trade - by a lot.  Why trade the future for a 1-game coin-flip playoff game.   The trade that the Indians made were never really done much in July (Tampa pulled off a great one last July) but in December but you don't see those much in December anymore.

The Sox should be doing those trades but with prospects (except the "untouchables") and for pitching prospects.  This lineup will be good; the pitching is a disaster.

The Sox are 10 pitchers short.   Eyeing a top of the rotation pitcher is ridiculous considering the number of holes in the staff.

Edited August 4, 2019 by GreenSox

[Sarava]

2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

I'd consider moving Madrigal or Vaughn, but only in a 1-1 deal for a pitcher with 4+ years of control and also is cheap. If the Cardinals came and offered Flaherty straight up, that is the type of deal I'd consider. (just as an example) 

The Cardinals won't trade him obviously. If you want a young uber talented guy in his range (or somewhat close), it would need to come from a rebuilding type franchise.

[Jack Parkman]

7 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

The one-game playoff has depressed the prospect for starter trade - by a lot.  Why trade the future for a 1-game coin-flip playoff game.   The trade that the Indians made were never really done much in July (Tampa pulled off a great one last July) but in December but you don't see those much in December anymore.

The Sox should be doing those trades but with prospects (except the "untouchables") and for pitching.  This lineup will be good; the pitching is a disaster.

If you squint a bit you can see the makings of a decent bullpen. They have two darn good lefties in Bummer and Fry. Colome is here for now, they need to find some more RH arms out of the pen. 

The SP isn't as dire as you think either. They don't necessarily need a Cole/Strasburg type, but it would be nice if they could land one. I keep coming back to Bumgarner. He shouldn't be nearly as expensive and he's a good bet to be #3 quality for his entire contract. 

They're not 10 pitchers short. 

Lopez still has upside, he can be a #4-5, Giolito and Cease have TOR stuff, how much they'll put it together remains to be seen. Kopech is coming back in March, idk wtf they're doing with Rodon. 

 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[Jack Parkman]

4 minutes ago, Sarava said:

The Cardinals won't trade him obviously. If you want a young uber talented guy in his range (or somewhat close), it would need to come from a rebuilding type franchise.

Of course, that is why I added the disclaimer. I used him as an example of a type of pitcher to trade Vaughn or Madrigal for. I know they're not getting Flaherty, but I think they could get someone like him.  

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[Sarava]

7 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Agreed on Vaughn. I'd include Madrigal in that list. 

I'd consider moving Madrigal or Vaughn, but only in a 1-1 deal for a pitcher with 4+ years of control and also is cheap. If the Cardinals came and offered Flaherty straight up, that is the type of deal I'd consider. (just as an example) 

Madrigal and Vaughn don't seem entirely necessary, I agree. Madrigal is a unicorn though and I'd imagine every FO has him valued differently. 

I think there's a good chance an ace emerges from the Giolito/Kopech/Cease trio. 

Replying again since you edited your post.

To me Madigral is necessary, because we have no 2B of the future without him. Yolmer isn't the answer. My God.

That said, for the absolute right guy, I would consider moving Madigral as well. I just prefer they try not to move him. Something about him makes me feel like he could become a special player. Even though he plays against most of the analytics of today's game, being a high contact, singles hitter.

And I agree that we have a solid chance of eventually finding a #1 among our big 3 young arms.

[Jack Parkman]

9 minutes ago, Sarava said:

Replying again since you edited your post.

To me Madigral is necessary, because we have no 2B of the future without him. Yolmer isn't the answer. My God.

That said, for the absolute right guy, I would consider moving Madigral as well. I just prefer they try not to move him. Something about him makes me feel like he could become a special player. Even though he plays against most of the analytics of today's game, being a high contact, singles hitter.

And I agree that we have a solid chance of eventually finding a #1 among our big 3 young arms.

They could sign Didi Gregorius to take Madrigal's spot. Not that hard actually. 

The bolded is a huge misconception about Madrigal. He does everything well above average except hit HR. He walks a decent amount, he makes a metric shit ton of contact, he hits for "Dead Ball Power" as I like to call it(2B/3B), he's super fast and plays a GG 2B. I'd like to keep him as well, but if it comes down to it and the other FO values him properly, I'd move him in the right deal. 

He's slugging over .400 so it isn't like he has no power whatsoever, and that has gone up substantially since he moved to AA. He slugged .451 there. 

XBH still matter. 

I used to think about him in the same way you did until I dug deeper into his numbers. 

He's also fast enough and good enough at stealing bases to turn a lot of his singles into doubles and triples. 

Modern baseball needs more Nick Madrigals. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[ChiSox59]

39 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

July is  always a seller's market. Teams are looking to buy.   Yes I would have.  These are career year players, not elite relievers,  and you take what you can get.
The prices will only fall from here.   But maybe he'll trade  4 prospects for one year of a player like the "elite" Samardzija in December...get ready, because that's the kind of nonsense he's going to do.   He certainly won't outbid the big guns for Cole.

You, legitimately, have no idea what you’re talking about. 

It wasn’t about trying to extract more future value in trade for Colome. It was about not acquiring broken prospects or AAAA players for a guy who could really help this pen next season.

This deadline was without a doubt a buyers market. There were a couple deals that seemed to favor the seller, but generally those were moves that had guys with a lot of cheap control moving. Colome is obviously not that. 

Hahn has very little to trade. A tad disappointed we didn’t see Nova/Jay/Castillo jettisoned our of town, but the first 2 actually serve some purpose. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by ChiSox59

[caulfield12]

26 minutes ago, Sarava said:

Relievers of any kind. Teams wont hesitate to throw a good reliever in to the closer role if necessary. The market was flooded with sellers and that was known well before the last day.

And perhaps we need to be realistic. They probably aren't going to get a TOR or #1 starter this off-season. They wont take the financial risk, or as you said, give up the assets needed to trade for one. For instance, if Syndegaard was available, the Mets would surely want 2 of the untouchables you listed. You simply can't make a trade like that, which we both agree on.

As for trading - that's where I go to Andrew Vaughn again. He's the one big piece that doesn't feel necessary for this rebuild to succeed. If you package him with a few medium prospects (Walker, Dunning, etc.), then you might get a really nice young pitcher back for him. He doesn't necessarily have to be a #1 guy. But if the Sox can get a guy they feel has a good chance of being a #2, that helps a ton. You can gamble that one of Cease, Giolito or Kopech might eventually become a #1.  Or if none are #1's, but you have a few in the rotation with are #2's, and it's complimented by an explosive offense, that could be a path to winning the World Series. There's many ways to skin a cat.

 

Trading a top 3 pick in Vaughn at this point for maybe a #2 doesn’t make much sense...when your #1 form of resources is financial flexibility, why create more holes in the everyday lineup when you don’t have to?

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

You, legitimately, have no idea what you’re talking about. 

Epstein said it was a classic seller’s market after the Stroman trade went down...that teams were holding out for extreme packages and most deals weren’t consummated because everything was rushed the last 2-3 hours on deadline day and a lot of teams couldn’t decide what to do so they just held serve.

[Sarava]

9 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

They could sign Didi Gregorius to take Madrigal's spot. Not that hard actually. 

The bolded is a huge misconception about Madrigal. He does everything well above average except hit HR. He walks a decent amount, he makes a metric shit ton of contact, he hits for "Dead Ball Power" as I like to call it(2B/3B), he's super fast and plays a GG 2B. I'd like to keep him as well, but if it comes down to it and the other FO values him properly, I'd move him in the right deal. 

He's slugging over .400 so it isn't like he has no power whatsoever, and that has gone up substantially since he moved to AA. He slugged .451 there. 

XBH still matter. 

I used to think about him in the same way you did until I dug deeper into his numbers. 

He's also fast enough and good enough at stealing bases to turn a lot of his singles into doubles and triples. 

Modern baseball needs more Nick Madrigals. 

You're killing me with all these damn edits today lol.

I know you've spoken unkindly about Madigral in the past. When I called him a high contact singles hitter, that absolutely wasn't meant in a negative way. So don't be lumping me in with your former negative feelings on him. I think there's a positive about a player like that being on your team. I think he's potentially the #1 or #2 hitter in our lineup for the next 10+ years. Especially since his walk-rate has gone up quite a bit since he left college.

But in the end, 82 of his 110 hits have been singles. I'm not looking it up, but that seems like a pretty high % of singles to me. And him being a high contact hitter is obviously true. I think it's already been stated that he has the lowest strikeout % in all of professional baseball right now.

For our future lineup, I don't want 7 guys swinging for the fences every at-bat, kinda like the Cubs have right now. They did win a World Series, but they have some serious flaws in their lineup construction right now.

And it wouldn't completely shock me if 3 years from now we consider Nick Madigral the best player on our White Sox.

 

[Sarava]

6 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Trading a top 3 pick in Vaughn at this point for maybe a #2 doesn’t make much sense...when your #1 form of resources is financial flexibility, why create more holes in the everyday lineup when you don’t have to?

The big hole on the team moving forward appears to to be the starting rotation. If the owner is willing to spend the cash in free agency to fill that hole, then obviously that's the best path moving forward.

[Jack Parkman]

16 minutes ago, Sarava said:

You're killing me with all these damn edits today lol.

I know you've spoken unkindly about Madigral in the past. When I called him a high contact singles hitter, that absolutely wasn't meant in a negative way. So don't be lumping me in with your former negative feelings on him. I think there's a positive about a player like that being on your team. I think he's potentially the #1 or #2 hitter in our lineup for the next 10+ years. Especially since his walk-rate has gone up quite a bit since he left college.

But in the end, 82 of his 110 hits have been singles. I'm not looking it up, but that seems like a pretty high % of singles to me. And him being a high contact hitter is obviously true. I think it's already been stated that he has the lowest strikeout % in all of professional baseball right now.

For our future lineup, I don't want 7 guys swinging for the fences every at-bat, kinda like the Cubs have right now. They did win a World Series, but they have some serious flaws in their lineup construction right now.

And it wouldn't completely shock me if 3 years from now we consider Nick Madigral the best player on our White Sox.

 

28 XBH is still a lot though for a player that hits as well as he does. Also, he was dealing with a wrist injury last year and his XBH% has gone up A TON since June. I'd consider his .451 SLG closer to his true talent than under .400. I'd think he's a .420-.440 SLG guy in MLB. Just a lot of those XBH are going to be 2B and 3B. Wrist injuries sap power. Once it was about a year past his injury at OSU, he started hitting for gap power much more consistently. 

I was a fan of the Madrigal pick when it happened, but I had no idea about the wrist injury and was concerned when he slugged .370 or so last year. Then the wrist healed up and the gap power returned. He's the guy we all thought we were getting. He's going to hit .310+ with 30+2B, 5+ 3B, 5 HR and a BB% in the 7-9% range. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[pcq]

13 hours ago, jamesdiego said:

Well, I’m convinced.  Puig sounds like a stand up guy and good teammate.  

 

“He is the worst person I've ever seen in this game," one ex-Dodger who believes Puig is beyond redemption said flatly. "Ever.”

"I guarantee you they're trying to get rid of him," one source with a rival club said of Puig. "There's no question he's a problem. In my mind, he's a problem anywhere he goes.  "He's Hanley Ramirez: He's a cancer on a ball club."

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2597460-is-there-anybody-left-in-los-angeles-whom-yasiel-puig-hasnt-alienated?utm_source=twitter.comScott Miller

 

 

 

Puig argued with teammates over who should be allowed on a plane ride that typically includes wives and girlfriends. The subject of someone from Puig's entourage joining the traveling crew came up, and sources told Yahoo Sports that Puig argued with pitcher Zack Greinke and nearly came to blows with infielder Justin Turner over the matter.

Passan also reports that a Dodgers player who asked to remain unnamed said trading Puig would be "addition by subtraction."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/new-book-outlines-problems-between-yasiel-puig-teammates/amp/

 

 

 

 

(Game 2 of the 2017 World Series, Puig missed a critical catch)   

Puig wasn’t ready for the pitch and got a late jump. He was out of position, shaded too far toward center field. He often ignored the positioning card distributed to Dodgers defenders before games; according to six people familiar with the situation, he on several occasions ripped up the card in front of outfield coach George Lombard and left the pieces on the ground. In the eyes of Dodgers officials, Puig was unprepared at a time when negligence might mean the difference between a title and heartbreak.  

“There were always things like that,” manager Dave Roberts said one day this spring. “Taking plays off.”  

according to interviews with more than 20 current and former Dodgers, coaches and executives. Tardiness plagued Puig. His attention wavered. His preparation waned. He ran the bases with enough recklessness that teammates joked Puig thought he was invisible. He hassled staffers. He ignored suggestions from coaches. He rejected entreaties from teammates.

The Dodgers utilize advanced metrics and lasers to guide their fielders. Puig believed he could read swings and trust his instincts. FanGraphs has rated him a below-average fielder for five of his six seasons, but Puig considered himself elite. That led to the positioning cards being torn up.  

“The hard part was he’d always have a knee-jerk reaction, and try to point out something that you did, a year ago,” Turner said. “Like, ‘Oh, you did this! It’s OK for you?’”

Corey Seager shrugged his shoulders. He could not conjure a favorite story about Yasiel Puig. “Uh . . . not really,” Seager said. “Not really, without, like, bashing him.”  

For the Dodgers, the grievances had added up. Puig showed up late to meetings. He did not do the necessary work to prevent injury. He was uninterested in instruction.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/la-sp-yasiel-puig-dodgers-legacy-reds-20190414-story.html%3F_amp%3Dtrue

 

He sounds like one of ours. MWSGA

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

1 hour ago, Sarava said:

I used the Reinsdorf age thing in my thinking last off-season. Why wouldn't Reinsdorf just go for it? We're loaded with young talent and a signing like Manny Machado might push this rebuild over the top to the promiseland. Unfortunately - despite the reality that Reinsdorf probably won't even be alive by the end of Machado's contract, he still wouldn't do what everyone knew it would take. Why not?

Can you imagine if they had signed Machado? He's on pace for 40+ HR's this year. Throw him as shortstop, and Tim Anderson in CF or RF. This team would of been stacked at almost every position, once the last few guys made the team.

My only guess is it maybe concerned him that if Machado turned in to a bad contract, that it might bog down the team's value if his family inherits the White Sox (or whatever portion he owns) and tries to sell it. Otherwise I can't come up with anything.

They have so little money committed to the future, yet they're still playing games to save 3 mil on Nate Jones and not spending adequate funds on international prospects in the same breath.

I absolutely agree with you that they have the funds and should be able to sign most of these guys this off-season. I won't even fault them for not signing Cole - because if you give him 200 mil and he pitches like he did in his last 2 seasons in Pittsburgh, that would be ugly.

But others guys - bring them in and cross your fingers. But the strange reality is, any big name pitcher they sign this winter will be a far riskier signing than the Machado signing that they weren't willing to take the risks on for. That's what makes me worried they will balk at the end of the day. You know, settle for 'having a seat at the table'.

You make very good points about how confusing it is to get a read on what exactly the Sox are doing or going to do.

Do they contend in 2020 ? Some say yes they will sign FA's and go for it. However , then why hold Robert and Madrigal down? Why not get them up and acclimated for next year ? If held down how many combined games do they miss next year ? 40 ? 50 ? and then brought up to then get acclimated ? Does that sound like a team that wants to win next year ?

[Thad Bosley]

1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

You make very good points about how confusing it is to get a read on what exactly the Sox are doing or going to do.

Do they contend in 2020 ? Some say yes they will sign FA's and go for it. However , then why hold Robert and Madrigal down? Why not get them up and acclimated for next year ? If held down how many combined games do they miss next year ? 40 ? 50 ? and then brought up to then get acclimated ? Does that sound like a team that wants to win next year ?

Next year will be the 15th year since the team won the WS, and they’ve only returned to the postseason ONCE since then, playing in all of just four games, and with only ONE WIN to show for it.  That last and only post ‘05 playoff occurrence happened way back when George W. Bush was wrapping up his second term in office. 

2008.  The team we know, love, and follow hasn’t been to the playoffs in 11 freaking years (and counting).  11 years, and this in a set-up that has not one but two wild card opportunities!  4th longest playoff drought in all of baseball (and counting).

How much more “rebuilding” does this team need to do?  They’ve gotten all of the blue chip prospects they’re going to get via trade.  They’ll get another shot at adding a valuable piece in the draft next year.  

But it would seem now is the time to shift gears and get out of this revolting “tank” mode that inflicts hideously played baseball on our fan base and onto a strategy that genuinely and purposefully tries to bring sustainable winning baseball to the South Side.  This means acquiring some “premium talent” on the open market, like other successful franchises do.  

Premium F*cking Talent.  No excuses.  They have all of the financial flexibility and wherewithal to do so.  So do it!  2020 should be a year focused on competing for the postseason once again, particularly for this team that plays in the weakest division in all of baseball.  

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, Thad Bosley said:

Next year will be the 15th year since the team won the WS, and they’ve only returned to the postseason ONCE since then, playing in all of just four games, and with only ONE WIN to show for it.  That last and only post ‘05 playoff occurrence happened way back when George W. Bush was wrapping up his second term in office. 

2008.  The team we know, love, and follow hasn’t been to the playoffs in 11 freaking years (and counting).  11 years, and this in a set-up that has not one but two wild card opportunities!  4th longest playoff drought in all of baseball (and counting).

How much more “rebuilding” does this team need to do?  They’ve gotten all of the blue chip prospects they’re going to get via trade.  They’ll get another shot at adding a valuable piece in the draft next year.  

But it would seem now is the time to shift gears and get out of this revolting “tank” mode that inflicts hideously played baseball on our fan base and onto a strategy that genuinely and purposefully tries to bring sustainable winning baseball to the South Side.  This means acquiring some “premium talent” on the open market, like other successful franchises do.  

Premium F*cking Talent.  No excuses.  They have all of the financial flexibility and wherewithal to do so.  So do it!  2020 should be a year focused on competing for the postseason once again, particularly for this team that plays in the weakest division in all of baseball.  

Well ,really the time to shift gears was at the start of the rebuild which would have meant overhauling the front office and getting modern in player development. Did you see what I wrote in the other thread about how the Astros signed Gerrit Cole or the number of high speed camera the Astros use throughout their system ? Can you honestly say the Sox could use that kind of approach with a FA pitcher ? They are woefully unprepared to sign anyone of consequence and even if Reinsdorf loosens the purse strings can he do it without imposing the constraints like the Machado contract offer ?

It not even about acquiring premium talent. It's about using your resources and spending money to improve your chances to acquire that talent. It's not about how Chicago is a great town but how White Sox will do what it takes to modernize their thinking to develop talent from 15 year old intl talent to all talent throughout the system. I can't be confident they even know how to get premium talent or what to do with it even if the money offered is enough to acquire it.

Edited August 4, 2019 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside