40 Man Rosterbation

[BamaDoc]

Thanks for comments on part one: State of Sox.  Part two begins.  With credit to baseball reference , here is our current 40 man roster.  The basic rules for the Rule 5 draft in December are that Free Agents are removed and you have to add back players currently on the MLB 60 day DL.  Sox have three 60 Day DL they would keep: Rodon, Burr, and Kopech.  Free Agent subtractions of Jay, Santiago, Detwiler, and Nova keep you at 40 as Jay on 60 day DL.  I expect (who doesn't) the Sox to resign Abreu so I will not open a spot.  Castillos option should be bought out so 39.

do DO	Pitcher	*		29	R	R	5' 10"	200	Dec 31, 1989	2007
2	40	Reynaldo Lopez	do DO	Pitcher	*		25	R	R	6' 1"	200	Jan 4, 1994	2012
3	43	Evan Marshall	us US	Pitcher	*		29	R	R	6' 2"	225	Apr 18, 1990	2011
4	51	Carson Fulmer	us US	Pitcher	*		25	R	R	6' 0"	195	Dec 13, 1993	2013
5	57	Jace Fry	us US	Pitcher	*		25	L	L	6' 1"	190	Jul 9, 1993	2013
6	54	Ross Detwiler	us US	Pitcher	*		33	R	L	6' 5"	210	Mar 6, 1986	2007
7	46	Ivan Nova	do DO	Pitcher	*		32	R	R	6' 5"	250	Jan 12, 1987	2006
8	60	Jimmy Cordero	do DO	Pitcher	*		27	R	R	6' 4"	222	Oct 19, 1991	2012
9	64	Josh Osich	us US	Pitcher	*		30	L	L	6' 3"	232	Sep 3, 1988	2012
10	48	Alex Colome	do DO	Pitcher	*		30	R	R	6' 1"	220	Dec 31, 1988	2007
11	84	Dylan Cease	us US	Pitcher	*		23	R	R	6' 2"	190	Dec 28, 1995	2015
12	66	Jose Ruiz	ve VE	Pitcher	*		24	R	R	6' 1"	190	Oct 21, 1994	2012
13	39	Aaron Bummer	us US	Pitcher	*		25	L	L	6' 3"	200	Sep 21, 1993	2013
14	53	Hector Santiago	us US	Pitcher	*		31	R	L	6' 0"	215	Dec 16, 1987	2007
15	58	Manny Banuelos	mx MX	Pitcher	*		28	R	L	5' 10"	215	Mar 13, 1991	2008
16	18	Daniel Palka	us US	Position	*		27	L	L	6' 2"	220	Oct 28, 1991	2013
17	74	Eloy Jimenez	do DO	Position	*		22	R	R	6' 4"	205	Nov 27, 1996	2014
18	32	Matt Skole	us US	Position	*		29	L	R	6' 4"	220	Jul 30, 1989	2011
19	33	James McCann	us US	Position	*		29	R	R	6' 3"	225	Jun 13, 1990	2011
20	5	Yolmer Sanchez	ve VE	Position	*		27	S	R	5' 11"	185	Jun 29, 1992	2009
21	20	Danny Mendick	us US	Position	*		25	R	R	5' 10"	189	Sep 28, 1993	2014
22	10	Yoan Moncada	cu CU	Position	*		24	S	R	6' 2"	205	May 27, 1995	2012
23	79	Jose Abreu	cu CU	Position	*		32	R	R	6' 3"	255	Jan 29, 1987	2003
24	49	Ryan Cordell	us US	Position	*		27	R	R	6' 4"	195	Mar 31, 1992	2013
25	21	Welington Castillo	do DO	Position	*		32	R	R	5' 10"	220	Apr 24, 1987	2006
26	15	Adam Engel	us US	Position	*		27	R	R	6' 2"	210	Dec 9, 1991	2013
27	7	Tim Anderson	us US	Position	*		26	R	R	6' 1"	185	Jun 23, 1993	2013
28	28	Leury Garcia	do DO	Position	*		28	S	R	5' 8"	180	Mar 18, 1991	2008
29	17	Ryan Goins	us US	Position	*		31	L	R	5' 10"	180	Feb 13, 1988	2009
30	38	Zack Collins	us US	Position	*		24	L	R	6' 3"	220	Feb 6, 1995	2014
31	27	Lucas Giolito	us US	Pitcher		10-day	24	R	R	6' 6"	245	Jul 14, 1994	2012
32	68	Dylan Covey	us US	Pitcher		10-day	27	R	R	6' 1"	220	Aug 14, 1991	2013
33	50	Thyago Vieira	br BR	Pitcher			25	R	R	6' 2"	210	Jul 1, 1993	2011
34	52	Ian Hamilton	us US	Pitcher			24	R	R	6' 0"	200	Jun 16, 1995	2014
35	53	Caleb Frare	us US	Pitcher			25	L	L	6' 1"	210	Jul 8, 1993	2012
36	62	Kodi Medeiros	us US	Pitcher			23	L	L	6' 2"	205	May 25, 1996	2014
37	73	Luis Alexander Basabe	ve VE	Position			22	S	R	6' 0"	160	Aug 26, 1996	2013
38	77	Micker Adolfo	do DO	Position			22	R	R	6' 4"	255	Sep 11, 1996	2014
39	22	Charlie Tilson	us US	Position			26	L	L	6' 0"	185	Dec 2, 1992	2011
40	59	Seby Zavala	us US	Position			25	R	R	5' 11"	215	Aug 28, 1993	2014
Rk	Uni	Name

Okay, that part was easy.  Older draftees from 2016 are eligible to be lost and younger players, often international signings get one more year so 2015.  Roster resource via Fangraphs has some nice depth charts indicating many of these players.  https://www.fangraphs.com/roster-resource/depth-charts/white-sox   Some are easier to project dropping and again it is someones career so I am refraining from "they suck" commentary.  Many who are dropped can still be invited to spring training and we offer a easier way back to MLB as Rodon and I think Burr will go back on the 60 day at the start of the season allowing them a way onto the team without requiring someone being dropped.  So I bolded 8 players who could be dropped/outrighted.  That is 31 spots.  Some are arguable.  I am not totally sure how the upcoming rule of a reliever must finish the inning or pitch to three batters will affect everything but it is why I drop Osich who held lefties to a OBP of .561 but RH torched him to .970.  I expect Yolmer to sign a multi year deal at a cut from this years salary or be non tendered so that may be another.  A few of these guys can be either one or other.  Engel with his annual hot streak, I took over Cordell and Tilson.  You could add a pitcher and drop Vieira, Ruiz, Frare, or Meideros.  

So I look at guys who need to be added.  Dunning, Burdi, Lambert, Flores on the pitching side.  Thompson, Matt Foster, Hansen are relievers who I would hope to protect. Spencer Adams was not protected last year and hurt this year so I don't protect.  Position players: Rutherford needs protection, I wish they had promoted Mercedes, I don't know what they will do with him.  Forbes, Zangari, Nunez on the position side I hope might become something but doubt they protect.  Pitchers like Minaya, Kubat, Turner, Martinez, Paulino, Long are doubtful.  

My sleeper is Lefty Jacob Lindgren, former 2nd round pick who made it to the majors one year after being drafted.  Then got hurt, missed two years and we took a flyer.  Obviously had talent was in A+ with us and had 1.53 ERA.  Actually had 13 ip vs righties with 15/1 k/w ratio and they hit .163  Actually lefties hit him well but would someone take a chance on cheap controllable guy who was a definite prospect?  With a 26 man roster I think with the shortage of pitching I might take that flyer.  If it doesn't work you lose 25 k.  

Anyway that is about ten to add so it seems doable until you start adding in free agent signings.  Most of us are thinking, beyond Abreu 3-5 so it does begin to matter.  Had our fringe players actually played decent, you can see where this would have been really tough.  As it is, I expect us to probably have someone drafted this year and if they succeed we will complain "how could that happen".  So take a look and tell me what you would do.  Cut a lot more of the current 40 to protect prospects or hope no one wants the prospects?  Does struggling your first couple times up mean you won't succeed later?  Are you a learning curve or instant success person?  Hopefully, ala Yankees etc, leading up to the draft you can trade your fringe players for guys who don't require protection or do 2:1 deals to help roster management but it is tighter than I expected after diving deeper.

Edited September 26, 2019 by BamaDoc
aded fangraph link

[ron883]

This many guys rosterbating together will result in strong disapproval from that poster with Jack McKeon as his avatar. Keep it under control.

[Chicago White Sox]

1 minute ago, ron883 said:

This many guys rosterbating together will result in strong disapproval from that poster with Jack McKeon as his avatar. Keep it under control.

POTY

[SoxAce]

7 minutes ago, ron883 said:

This many guys rosterbating together will result in strong disapproval from that poster with Jack McKeon as his avatar. Keep it under control.

You're the GOAT Ron. 

[pcq]

Nova will re-sign at some point. Need those innings. 

[TheFutureIsNear]

I have absolutely no problem losing 14 names from that list...and there’s a at least 3-4 more that I could go either way on. 

[Bob Sacamano]

On 9/26/2019 at 5:56 PM, SoxAce said:

You're the GOAT Ron. 

I agree that he is the greatest of all trolls.

[Timmy U]

I predict the Sox lose All the free agents at least for a while, so that’s Detwiler, Nova, Jay, Abreu, Santiago, Castillo.

Then there are a lot of fringe guys who will go, Banuelos, Tilson, Skole, Goins.

Then they should choose between backup outfielders, I think both Palka and Cordell go and they keep Engel, but maybe they keep two of these three.

then there are several relievers on the bubble like Frare, Vieira, Ruiz, and Madeiros. They could risk Hamilton because it is hard for other teams to know the state of his injuries.  I predict the Sox hold on to both Fulmer and Covey at least until Spring Training.

Then they have big arbitration decisions on both Yolmer and Leury.

Then there are their underperforming prospects like Zavala, Basabe and Adolfo.  I bet they keep them all, but Zavala is older and looks like he won’t hit and if Adolfo doesn’t perform in Arizona, they might try to sneak him through.

Point is, they should have no problem protecting any player they like this winter.

[BamaDoc]

If we don't sign Grandal or another catcher, I think Zavala is protected as you need that third catcher if a MLB guy goes down.  If we sign a third, I could see him outright.  With rosters expanding to 26 it will be easier for a team to keep a guy.  Hamilton if not ready is easier to roster cause they could put him on DL so I wouldn't risk him unless medicals thick his career significantly threatened.

[Soxfest]

Half of the 40 man could be let go and nobody would be shocked 

Edited September 29, 2019 by Soxfest

[ChiSox59]

Detwiler, Nova, Osich, Santiago, Banuelos, Palka, Skole, Castillo, Goins, and Tilson are all going to be DFA'd, outrighted or a free agent in the coming weeks.  

Add back Rodon, Kopech and Burr and we're at 33.

Dunning, Burdi, Rutherford, Lambert, Flores, and Hansen all need to be protected.  That gets up you to 39.

5-6 free agents will be added, which means a handful of these guys will also be on the chopping block: Fulmer, Ruiz, Yolmer, Cordell, Engel, Covey, Virira, Frare, Medeiros, Basabe and Zavala.  

[BamaDoc]

1 hour ago, ChiSox59 said:

Detwiler, Nova, Osich, Santiago, Banuelos, Palka, Skole, Castillo, Goins, and Tilson are all going to be DFA'd, outrighted or a free agent in the coming weeks.  

Add back Rodon, Kopech and Burr and we're at 33.

Dunning, Burdi, Rutherford, Lambert, Flores, and Hansen all need to be protected.  That gets up you to 39.

5-6 free agents will be added, which means a handful of these guys will also be on the chopping block: Fulmer, Ruiz, Yolmer, Cordell, Engel, Covey, Virira, Frare, Medeiros, Basabe and Zavala.  

About right which is why I might like to see some dealt if possible or 2:1 , 3:2 deals.  As long as you move some for guys who don't require protection.

[Jack Parkman]

2 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

Detwiler, Nova, Osich, Santiago, Banuelos, Palka, Skole, Castillo, Goins, and Tilson are all going to be DFA'd, outrighted or a free agent in the coming weeks.  

Add back Rodon, Kopech and Burr and we're at 33.

Dunning, Burdi, Rutherford, Lambert, Flores, and Hansen all need to be protected.  That gets up you to 39.

5-6 free agents will be added, which means a handful of these guys will also be on the chopping block: Fulmer, Ruiz, Yolmer, Cordell, Engel, Covey, Vieira, Frare, Medeiros, Basabe and Zavala.  

The two guys in bold are the only ones I'd keep. The guys in italics are players I'd package if someone was interested. I'm really disappointed in the Rutherford/Basabe/Adolfo/Gonzales/Sheets group. I thought we could get a couple MLB players out of those guys but it looks like none will make it. They're a cautionary tale of holding onto guys too long. 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[BamaDoc]

4 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

The two guys in bold are the only ones I'd keep. The guys in italics are players I'd package if someone was interested. I'm really disappointed in the Rutherford/Basabe/Adolfo/Gonzales/Sheets group. I thought we could get a couple MLB players out of those guys but it looks like none will make it. They're a cautionary tale of holding onto guys too long. 

Please go back and look at the second half splits on those guys.  Several were young for league and fine in second half.  Sheets had more homers than previously in career in a tougher park.  At 23 had a .855 ops in the second half and you wish to give up on him?  Basabe has a wrist injury.  We saw how it affected Robert 0 hr to 32, and Madrigal .  Rutherford  22yo .600 ops first half .758 second half.  Adolpho hurt.  Burdi previously 100 mph, sucked but I give one more year, risk/reward.  With 26 man roster you could hide a player a lot easier than 25.  Come on I have seen your posts, you are better than that. 

Edited October 1, 2019 by BamaDoc

[Jack Parkman]

28 minutes ago, BamaDoc said:

Please go back and look at the second half splits on those guys.  Several were young for league and fine in second half.  Sheets had more homers than previously in career in a tougher park.  At 23 had a .855 ops in the second half and you wish to give up on him?  Basabe has a wrist injury.  We saw how it affected Robert 0 hr to 32, and Madrigal .  Rutherford  22yo .600 ops first half .758 second half.  Adolpho hurt.  Burdi previously 100 mph, sucked but I give one more year, risk/reward.  With 26 man roster you could hide a player a lot easier than 25.  Come on I have seen your posts, you are better than that. 

Yeah, and those are the reasons why these guys might still have trade value. If they do I'd bail on them. 

[BamaDoc]

10 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

Yeah, and those are the reasons why these guys might still have trade value. If they do I'd bail on them. 

Okay respect your opinion.  Mine just different and I wish to hold guys for another year and hope some develop into cheap home grown players.  I guess I could see putting a couple together and getting one higher rated player to help with roster issues but doubt other teams are that excited to do that kind of deal.  Sheets doesn't require 40 man and if he improves and goes to Charlotte he could but up much better numbers and really improve value.  If any non Robert outfielder could progress to .750 OPS eventually at MLB level and all have decent gloves that is a 3 WAR player and not without value.  I just don't know which one that might be yet and don't want to miss.

[Jack Parkman]

3 minutes ago, BamaDoc said:

Okay respect your opinion.  Mine just different and I wish to hold guys for another year and hope some develop into cheap home grown players.  I guess I could see putting a couple together and getting one higher rated player to help with roster issues but doubt other teams are that excited to do that kind of deal.  Sheets doesn't require 40 man and if he improves and goes to Charlotte he could but up much better numbers and really improve value.  If any non Robert outfielder could progress to .750 OPS eventually at MLB level and all have decent gloves that is a 3 WAR player and not without value.  I just don't know which one that might be yet and don't want to miss.

We don't have to trade all of them, but there's no room for Sheets with Vaughn here, and I'd rather use Basabe/Rutherford/Gonzalez to upgrade the Sox one hole in RF for the foreseeable future. There is a chance that they move one of their young pitchers to do that, and if I'd have to pick it would be Lopez first and then Cease. They'd have to sign Strasburg/Bumgarner and Wheeler/Keuchel to pull that off. 

[Hatchetman]

19 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

 Fulmer, Ruiz, Yolmer, Cordell, Engel, Covey, Virira, Frare, Medeiros, Basabe and Zavala.  

Basabe is the only guy I'd be interested in keeping of that bunch.

[poppysox]

On 10/1/2019 at 10:09 AM, Jack Parkman said:

We don't have to trade all of them, but there's no room for Sheets with Vaughn here, and I'd rather use Basabe/Rutherford/Gonzalez to upgrade the Sox one hole in RF for the foreseeable future. There is a chance that they move one of their young pitchers to do that, and if I'd have to pick it would be Lopez first and then Cease. They'd have to sign Strasburg/Bumgarner and Wheeler/Keuchel to pull that off. 

Right field can be adequately filled without giving up on Cease.

[ChiSox59]

23 hours ago, Hatchetman said:

Basabe is the only guy I'd be interested in keeping of that bunch.

Meh.  Id try to hold onto as many of them as I can until their spots are needed.  Order of first guy I'd DFA to last guy would be as follows:  Covey, Yolmer, Zavala, Vieira, Fulmer, Ruiz, Engel, Cordell, Medeiros, Frare, and Basabe.  I think Engel, Cordell, Frare and Basabe should all be pretty safe this offseason.  I think Sox like Ruiz arm and so I'd be surprised to see him trimmed from the 40 man as well.    

[poppysox]

3 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

Meh.  Id try to hold onto as many of them as I can until their spots are needed.  Order of first guy I'd DFA to last guy would be as follows:  Covey, Yolmer, Zavala, Vieira, Fulmer, Ruiz, Engel, Cordell, Medeiros, Frare, and Basabe.  I think Engel, Cordell, Frare and Basabe should all be pretty safe this offseason.  I think Sox like Ruiz arm and so I'd be surprised to see him trimmed from the 40 man as well.    

Need to find a swap partner for Fulmer along the line of Thornton for Joe Borchard.  Find some other failed first rounder and swap projects.

 

 

[BamaDoc]

I could see Fulmer going in a change os scenery trade as you mentioned.  That trade worked well for one team!

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

On 9/30/2019 at 5:06 PM, Jack Parkman said:

The two guys in bold are the only ones I'd keep. The guys in italics are players I'd package if someone was interested. I'm really disappointed in the Rutherford/Basabe/Adolfo/Gonzales/Sheets group. I thought we could get a couple MLB players out of those guys but it looks like none will make it. They're a cautionary tale of holding onto guys too long. 

Sheets was like the 12th best hitter in his league despite a slow start. Sheesh. You're disappointed in that? Weird stuff.

Basebe had a messed up hand/wrist - what did you expect from him?

Jack, you get way to down on young baseball players.

Edited October 4, 2019 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[poppysox]

2 hours ago, BamaDoc said:

I could see Fulmer going in a change os scenery trade as you mentioned.  That trade worked well for one team!

Better to take a shot rather than release him like some have suggested.

[GreenSox]

Mercedes needs to be protected.  This guy raked across 2 levels, including in dreaded Birmingham.  There' no reason not to to see what you have, especially with all of the players that have done nothing (like Madeiros) as the alternatives.