White Sox listed as interested in Marcel Ozuna by Dominican Reporter

[ChiSox59]

It is truly amazing to me that there are people that think bringing Avi Garcia back would actually be a solution.  

[Hatchetman]

I think my original point was that if you're going to sign someone shitty to play RF you might as well sign Avi because at least he won't cost much. Use the money to sign one of the top 3 starting pitcher FA's.

[ron883]

How quickly people forget. Did you see how far that thing went? BOMB. CLUTCH BOMB at that. 

[Eminor3rd]

35 minutes ago, ron883 said:

How quickly people forget. Did you see how far that thing went? BOMB. CLUTCH BOMB at that. 

Well shit, if all we need is someone who CAN hit it far, we already have Daniel Palka. 

[Jack Parkman]

I'm ok with Ozuna if he and Eloy are sharing DH/LF duties. Ozuna in RF is a big fat NO from me. 

[almagest]

Some of Ozuna's advanced stats are encouraging but I'm still nervous to sign a player who on the surface didn't have a great year in a system known for getting a lot out of players. I have no confidence that our player development and advanced scouting will do anything better than provide no benefit to his performance and honestly will probably end up hurting him overall.

I'd be more in favor of signing JD Martinez to stick him in right field to be terrible on defense because even with that giant handicap I think he'd still out-perform Ozuna because there's no way we could screw up his bat. He could also provide a big benefit as an example of how to approach hitting.

Edited October 22, 2019 by almagest

[oldsox]

Geez, I wish either Rutherford or Adolfo would have progressed far enough by now so that we could just pencil one in at RF.  Timing would have been perfect.

 

Blake has 4 pro seasons, Micker at least that many.  One might be ready for 2021.

[caulfield12]

6 hours ago, oldsox said:

Geez, I wish either Rutherford or Adolfo would have progressed far enough by now so that we could just pencil one in at RF.  Timing would have been perfect.

 

Blake has 4 pro seasons, Micker at least that many.  One might be ready for 2021.

Don't forget Walker, Luis Gonzalez and Basabe...it would be pretty pathetic if we couldn't at least develop ONE 2 fWAR outfielder internally.  Wouldn't be much TOO much to expect of the Chris Getz Regime, would it?

[Capital G]

I'm getting more and more turned off with a signing of Ozuna. He is an OK player. But for the amount and length he will get I'd rather just get a guy we can sign for less $ and years that can actually play some D. I dont want Robert surrounded by 2 players that cannot play OF. I'd rather sign a Dickerson/Puig type player.

Then see what happens with Basabe/Walker/Adolfo/etc. If they dont pan out what's RF FA look like next year/2022?

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, Capital G said:

I'm getting more and more turned off with a signing of Ozuna. He is an OK player. But for the amount and length he will get I'd rather just get a guy we can sign for less $ and years that can actually play some D. I dont want Robert surrounded by 2 players that cannot play OF. I'd rather sign a Dickerson/Puig type player.

Then see what happens with Basabe/Walker/Adolfo/etc. If they dont pan out what's RF FA look like next year/2022?

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/03/2020-21-mlb-free-agents.html
 

Springer, Betts, Pederson, Peralta, Brantley

[SCCWS]

13 hours ago, almagest said:

Some of Ozuna's advanced stats are encouraging but I'm still nervous to sign a player who on the surface didn't have a great year in a system known for getting a lot out of players. I have no confidence that our player development and advanced scouting will do anything better than provide no benefit to his performance and honestly will probably end up hurting him overall.

I'd be more in favor of signing JD Martinez to stick him in right field to be terrible on defense because even with that giant handicap I think he'd still out-perform Ozuna because there's no way we could screw up his bat. He could also provide a big benefit as an example of how to approach hitting.

I think you only want JDM to play RF to satisfy his desire to not be just a DH. Boston played him about 25% of the time. The problem is he has had back issues so limiting his OF appearances may actually keep him healthy.  

[Southwest Sider]

18 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

I'm ok with Ozuna if he and Eloy are sharing DH/LF duties. Ozuna in RF is a big fat NO from me. 

In general, I agree that they should aim higher for RF.

I guess it's possible that Menechino told the FO that he thinks he can get Ozuna back to his 2017 levels. Apparently he gets a lot of credit for Stanton, Yelich and Ozuna. I'd still be wary of a long term deal, but if he's going 2-3 years, wants to work with Menechino because he thinks he can get to his 2017 numbers and keep him there, it might be worth a shot. He is only 28, after all. 

[Bob Sacamano]

1 hour ago, South Sider said:

In general, I agree that they should aim higher for RF.

I guess it's possible that Menechino told the FO that he thinks he can get Ozuna back to his 2017 levels. Apparently he gets a lot of credit for Stanton, Yelich and Ozuna. I'd still be wary of a long term deal, but if he's going 2-3 years, wants to work with Menechino because he thinks he can get to his 2017 numbers and keep him there, it might be worth a shot. He is only 28, after all. 

Hes probably not getting 2-3 years though.

[ChiSox59]

2 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Hes probably not getting 2-3 years though.

Yah, I could see three years.  I've said it before, but if Ozuna's market dips into the 3 years $45-$50M range, the Sox should definitely kick the tires.  He's not a good fit, but you can DH him some, DH Eloy some, etc., but you're still going to need to find a LH corner OF that is at worst an average defender.  There is value there.  7 years and $150+M or whatever is laughable though, and he'd be lucky to get half that.  

I think he goes for 4/$75-80M type deal in the end.  

[Capital G]

22 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/03/2020-21-mlb-free-agents.html
 

Springer, Betts, Pederson, Peralta, Brantley

Thanks!

Springer would be ideal IMO although I had no idea he was already  in his 30s.

Edited October 24, 2019 by Capital G

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 10/22/2019 at 6:29 AM, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Avi lol.

Sox fans have lost their minds.

 

On 10/22/2019 at 10:19 AM, turnin' two said:

I get that people don't like Avi, but the simple fact is that he is a major upgrade over what the Sox trotted out this season, and he is far from the worst option available.  He also just played a pretty significant role on a playoff team.  While he isn't a perfect player, he hit 25 2B and 20 HR last year with an OPS just about .800.  If you are dismissing that guy because of a previous bias, that is foolish.  By both bWAR and fWAR, Avi was about a 2 WAR player last season.  Are you trying to tell me the Sox don't have room for that?  I'd love to hear the explanation.  

 

On 10/22/2019 at 11:24 AM, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I'm dismissing him because hes not good. The Ray's platooned him, playing him strictly when he was most likely to succeed - and he still didnt touch 2 WAR in over 500 AB's.

In 5 big league seasons he has a 6.2 WAR. 

 

On 10/22/2019 at 11:45 AM, turnin' two said:

So 500 PAs in platooning him?  Seems pretty regular.  I mean, granted I didn't watch a ton of Rays games, but that seems like everyday ABs.  Onlly 3 guys on the Rays had more.  And he had exactly 2 bWAR... but that is splitting hairs.  Is this also conceding that the Sox aren't smart enough to platoon him? 

And yeah, 6.2 WAR for his career, but 6.1 of it over his last 3 seasons.  

He isn't perfect, and not the best player, but he is certainly an upgrade.  That said, I don't think there is any chance it happens.  

Sorry, I guess I just wish I could be as smart as you are.

 

On 10/22/2019 at 11:51 AM, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The Sox arent in a position to be signing a platoon based RF'er. 

6.1 over 3 seasons isn't good. No need for your snarky last sentence.

1st of all lets not pretend you aren't snarky or condescending (see the 1st comment I quoted) so sometimes you get it back.

Turnin' Two contradicted your statement about "playing him strictly when he was most likely to succeed " rather well citing his amount of plate appearances and your 6.2 career WAR also very well  by citing his last few seasons which means a lot more than career numbers.

He also could've told you he played 125 games and only because of injury didn't play more. 90 of the 125 were in Rf. 24 at DH and even 11 in CF.

Basically you are laughing at how one of the smartest organization in baseball found value in Avi yet somehow the Sox won't be able to . And again it's not like anyone is championing his return. Turnin Two made it clear he's not the best option but he is also not a laughable or out of our minds option.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 10/22/2019 at 12:26 PM, ChiSox59 said:

It is truly amazing to me that there are people that think bringing Avi Garcia back would actually be a solution.  

It's more like it wouldn't be a problem as opposed to a solution when you consider cost effectiveness . How is it the amazing Rays Front Office could see his value yet even smart ( and I mean that it's not sarcastic) Sox fans like you can't ?

Edited October 24, 2019 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[mqr]

10 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

It's more like it wouldn't be a problem as opposed to a solution when you consider cost effectiveness . How is it the amazing Rays Front Office Rays could see his value yet even smart ( and I mean that it's not sarcastic) Sox fans like you can't ?

If bringing Avi back = higher quality pitching acquired than bring him on

[ChiSox59]

18 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

It's more like it wouldn't be a problem as opposed to a solution when you consider cost effectiveness . How is it the amazing Rays Front Office Rays could see his value yet even smart ( and I mean that it's not sarcastic) Sox fans like you can't ?

Because they paid him a pittance, let him spend about 20% of his time at DH, and didn't overexpose him to RHP.  Avi had a nice season.  He's a major league baseball player.  But we've seen that movie many times, and he isn't even remotely close to a good fit for what this club needs.  The Sox could afford to role the dice on some kids in 2019 (Palka, Cordell, etc.)  - they did and it didn't work.  Letting Avi go was the correct thing to do.     

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 minutes ago, mqr said:

If bringing Avi back = higher quality pitching acquired than bring him on

I really think that's what most of us bringing him up are hoping for. Sox are going to cut corners we know this. RF i can handle cutting a corner on , DH i can handle not going after JD Martinez . Even the injury concerns over Avi shouldn't matter that much. Eloy and Moncada get injured, anyone can get injured. Our pitching is a mess because of injuries. Nimmo was injured last year You can still upgrade pitching , power , Lefthandedness, and OBP by getting Grandal and Moose. We aren't getting everyone we want at all positions. We are going to have to settle for just being better or average in RF until a later date. If that's Avi or someone else cheap but an improvement I'm all for it.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

9 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Because they paid him a pittance, let him spend about 20% of his time at DH, and didn't overexpose him to RHP.  Avi had a nice season.  He's a major league baseball player.  But we've seen that movie many times, and he isn't even remotely close to a good fit for what this club needs.  The Sox could afford to role the dice on some kids in 2019 (Palka, Cordell, etc.)  - they did and it didn't work.  Letting Avi go was the correct thing to do.     

You think he won't get a pittance in 2020 ? No one is arguing that letting him go wasn't the right thing to do.

Didn't over expose him to RHP ? Have you seen his splits against RHP for 2019 ? They were pretty good. How can you argue that he isn't  remotely close to a fit when you readily accept other cheap stop gaps.

[ChiSox59]

10 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

You think he won't get a pittance in 2020 ? No one is arguing that letting him go wasn't the right thing to do.

Didn't over expose him to RHP ? Have you seen his splits against RHP for 2019 ? They were pretty good. How can you argue that he isn't  remotely close to a fit when you readily accept other cheap stop gaps.

Yes, I am aware of Avi's splits against RHP in 2019.  He had a good season.  He was often platooned against high end righties (ie: not overexposed).  

Beyond the fact that we've had Avi on this team for 5 season and then non-tendered him because he isn't very good, Avi literally checks none of the boxes for RF in 2020.  He bats right handed and is a below average defender = not an option.  Its really that simple.  Whoever the Sox acquire to play RF, they're going to be switch hitter or bat lefty.  The only way I see something else occurring is if Abreu somehow signs elsewhere, and/or someone like Ozuna completely overplays their market and ends up in our lap on 3/$45M type deal. 

Based on the projected roster construction, if the Sox sign a 1 year stop gap RF, they're going to be lefty.  If we trade for RF, they're going to bat left handed.  The Sox are not going to go into next year Moncada as the only left handed hitter in the everyday lineup.  

[turnin' two]

He started 74 games against RH starters.  To say he was being platooned is disingenuous.  And to Cali's point, his numbers were better across his entire slash line against RHP than LHP.

Edited October 24, 2019 by turnin' two

[zisk]

On ‎10‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 2:26 PM, ChiSox59 said:

It is truly amazing to me that there are people that think bringing Avi Garcia back would actually be a solution.  

He would be a big improvement over what we have now. With Eloy and Robert handling the other 2 spots, we wouldn't have

any more black holes in the outfield. The fact that he'll be relatively cheap compared to other OF's leaves more $ to spend on Pitching.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

26 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Yes, I am aware of Avi's splits against RHP in 2019.  He had a good season.  He was often platooned against high end righties (ie: not overexposed).  

Beyond the fact that we've had Avi on this team for 5 season and then non-tendered him because he isn't very good, Avi literally checks none of the boxes for RF in 2020.  He bats right handed and is a below average defender = not an option.  Its really that simple.  Whoever the Sox acquire to play RF, they're going to be switch hitter or bat lefty.  The only way I see something else occurring is if Abreu somehow signs elsewhere, and/or someone like Ozuna completely overplays their market and ends up in our lap on 3/$45M type deal. 

Based on the projected roster construction, if the Sox sign a 1 year stop gap RF, they're going to be lefty.  If we trade for RF, they're going to bat left handed.  The Sox are not going to go into next year Moncada as the only left handed hitter in the everyday lineup.  

So you completely ignore the idea of Moose and Grandal being the other LH options while thinking a 1 year stop gap in RF has to be LH ? Avi might be no worse defender in RF than Ozuna or Dickerson or even Gardner if you take his arm into consideration and familiarity with our park. Hell TB even played him in CF for 11 games . You need to get over the non tendering because he wasn't very good thing. 2 of the last 3 years he's been good. That means a lot more than anything earlier in his career. He is hitting more fly balls than ever and is also a better fielding now than before.