bmags Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 On 11/12/2019 at 8:12 PM, Balta1701 said: Yeah but would you trust him for 4 years as opposed to Odo for 1-2 years? Expand What makes you think odorizzi will be 1 year (esp if he turns down qualifying offer), and Bumgarner is only 30 compared to Odorizzi's 29, this isn't like Hamels vs. Odorizzi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 On 11/12/2019 at 8:31 PM, bmags said: What makes you think odorizzi will be 1 year (esp if he turns down qualifying offer), and Bumgarner is only 30 compared to Odorizzi's 29, this isn't like Hamels vs. Odorizzi. Expand Odorizzi is a pretty poor fit to make 15 starts at the Cell. He's also obviously (as you said) going to be looking for a longer term deal if he rejects the QO. But, Odorizzo, Abreu and Smith seem like the guys that could get just hammered in the market with a QO attached this offseason. I ultimately think he takes the 1 year deal and stays with the Twins, or works out a longer term deal to stay with the Twins. There is mutual interest there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Wheeler will have too many bidders it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 (edited) On 11/12/2019 at 9:32 PM, pcq said: Wheeler will have too many bidders it seems. Expand That is a big concern of mine. His market will be at least 5-10 teams deep looking for affordable rotation help. The more I look at it, the more I think he gets at least 5/100 million A good question to pose to fans on this thread, how much would you be willing to offer Wheeler to sign? How many guaranteed years and dollars? Beyond 5/100 I'm not sure he's worth it Edited November 12, 2019 by steveno89 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 On 11/12/2019 at 8:31 PM, bmags said: What makes you think odorizzi will be 1 year (esp if he turns down qualifying offer), and Bumgarner is only 30 compared to Odorizzi's 29, this isn't like Hamels vs. Odorizzi. Expand Bumgarner is a Felix Hernandez 30. He debuted at 20, and has been a horse since 21. Lotta miles on the arm and the decline in stuff reflects it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 On 11/12/2019 at 10:44 PM, Eminor3rd said: Bumgarner is a Felix Hernandez 30. He debuted at 20, and has been a horse since 21. Lotta miles on the arm and the decline in stuff reflects it. Expand I already did this exercise. It’s not the predictor people think. And his spin rate increased along with velo this year. CC Sabathia had a very similar career, and while his 30s weren’t incredible they were productive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 On 11/12/2019 at 10:56 PM, bmags said: I already did this exercise. It’s not the predictor people think. And his spin rate increased along with velo this year. CC Sabathia had a very similar career, and while his 30s weren’t incredible they were productive. Expand CC was wayyy better when he hit FA than MB is now. He was coming off a 7 win season, sub-2 FIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 This years FA market for SP sucks for the white sox. They have no shot at the good ones - Stras + Cole. Bumgarner, Keuchel are NOT who we should be going for (old, not going to be good in AL, waste of money, we will probably sign Keuchel). Wheeler, the one interesting guy, is going to get a massive contract that takes us out and doesn't make sense. We need a SP. We won't get a proper one. That sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 1:29 AM, iWiN4PreP said: This years FA market for SP sucks for the white sox. They have no shot at the good ones - Stras + Cole. Bumgarner, Keuchel are NOT who we should be going for (old, not going to be good in AL, waste of money, we will probably sign Keuchel). Wheeler, the one interesting guy, is going to get a massive contract that takes us out and doesn't make sense. We need a SP. We won't get a proper one. That sucks. Expand Define what “massive contract” you see Wheeler getting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 1:31 AM, Chicago White Sox said: Define what “massive contract” you see Wheeler getting. Expand Massive contract relative to what he's performed, his risk, etc. I think he will be overpaid. I don't know what that means off the top of my head and I don't really want to do that analysis right now. Some team will pay him an amount that makes us go "wow, well, no problem." I'd love Wheeler, I just think he's going to valued highly due to his young age and the flashes of brilliance he's shown, and last years trade market had many teams looking in on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 There really isn’t a year when good starting pitchers are cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 1:44 AM, bmags said: There really isn’t a year when good starting pitchers are cheap. Expand I'd be fine with spending big on Cole/Strasburg, but the W'sox won't do that. Hell, I'd give Cole whatever he wanted. That's fine. Wheeler needs to be a decent price for me to go after, if he was, I'd certainly be on it as I love me some Wheeler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackDoorBreach Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Probably a little North of 5/100 since there are a lot of teams in on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 2:36 AM, Tony said: Whoa whoa whoa. What’s all this “we” talk? You told us all you were done as a White Sox fan, and jumping to the Padres. Back so soon? Expand Nice of you to remember :). I wouldn't call myself a W'sox fan, but this board is the best board for offseason talk. Padres didn't do it for me, I ended up more of a Rays fan, but honestly, I don't really follow any personal team right now. Just enjoying MLB the Show. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 1:29 AM, iWiN4PreP said: This years FA market for SP sucks for the white sox. They have no shot at the good ones - Stras + Cole. Bumgarner, Keuchel are NOT who we should be going for (old, not going to be good in AL, waste of money, we will probably sign Keuchel). Wheeler, the one interesting guy, is going to get a massive contract that takes us out and doesn't make sense. We need a SP. We won't get a proper one. That sucks. Expand Nothing is guaranteed but I hope you are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Jimmy0 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 I wrote about Zack Wheeler today if anyone is interested: https://southsidehitpen.com/2019/11/12/picks-to-click-free-agent-starters/ 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 3:24 AM, Y2Jimmy0 said: I wrote about Zack Wheeler today if anyone is interested: https://southsidehitpen.com/2019/11/12/picks-to-click-free-agent-starters/ Expand Awesome write-up Jimmy! If the big two are off the market, Wheeler is without question the next best option and I hope they prioritize him over the bigger name in Bumgarner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 3:32 AM, Chicago White Sox said: Awesome write-up Jimmy! If the big two are off the market, Wheeler is without question the next best option and I hope they prioritize him over the bigger name in Bumgarner. Expand Any fans here willing to go beyond 5/100 to sign Wheeler? It's a valid question to ask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackDoorBreach Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 2:44 PM, steveno89 said: Any fans here willing to go beyond 5/100 to sign Wheeler? It's a valid question to ask Expand Yeah I would. I would not do anything close to 5/150 but if you have to get up to 5/115 or so yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighurt574 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 1:44 AM, bmags said: There really isn’t a year when good starting pitchers are cheap. Expand Yep. This year's crop is about as good an opportunity as you're going to get with an ace or two on the market and a bunch of other interesting options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 2:44 PM, steveno89 said: Any fans here willing to go beyond 5/100 to sign Wheeler? It's a valid question to ask Expand I'd do around 5/$110M if need be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 6:44 PM, Chicago White Sox said: I'd do around 5/$110M if need be. Expand I would assume the Astros will put on a big push for him to replace Cole. So Sox will have to overbid them since they will be an attractive destination unless Wheeler wants the spotlight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) On 11/13/2019 at 6:59 PM, SCCWS said: I would assume the Astros will put on a big push for him to replace Cole. So Sox will have to overbid them since they will be an attractive destination unless Wheeler wants the spotlight. Expand Could be mistaken, but aren't the Astros pressed right up against the lux tax? https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/houston-astros/payroll/ Sure they could continue to go over, but few teams have been willing to strap themselves like that. Sox should not greatly overpay to land targeted free agents, and should have plenty of money to spread around in free agency. Edited November 13, 2019 by steveno89 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 7:49 PM, steveno89 said: Could be mistaken, but aren't the Astros pressed right up against the lux tax? https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/houston-astros/payroll/ Sure they could continue to go over, but few teams have been willing to strap themselves like that. Sox should not greatly overpay to land targeted free agents, and should have plenty of money to spread around in free agency. Expand They are but they would only sign a Wheeler type if Cole goes. So they start $13 Mil less and Reddick's $13 MIl comes off next year. They do get a break in that Greinke is paid by AZ. I think Wheeler can get 5/$100 even though he has had an up/down career w injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 11/13/2019 at 6:44 PM, Chicago White Sox said: I'd do around 5/$110M if need be. Expand That’s about what has been in my head, too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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