Grandal - Early Off-Season Speculation

[ChiSoxJon]

3 hours ago, BackDoorBreach said:

I don't think theres any chance or reason for Cease to be on a limit next year.

I'd hope not, but I've read multiple times on here that he'll be limited as his arm has never pitched X amount of innings

[ChiSoxJon]

2 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Mired in mediocrity, again.  Might as well add Gio Gonzalez, so we have two Gio’s.

The White Sox way

[ChiSoxJon]

2 hours ago, aeichhor said:

Yes, but sox weren't competing and would have cost a pick on top of that. Go sign him now with no pick attached and more chance to compete 

he's priority #1 for me with JDM returning to BOS, frankly not ready to dump any significant prospects yet at this point in the process for JDM

Grandal, Ozuna, Abreu, Encarnacion, Kendrick would make me happy for offensive pick ups

Ozuna>Puig>Castellanos for me for RF

if I could have negative interest in Calhoun and Dickerson I would

[Chicago White Sox]

3 hours ago, Joshua Strong said:

I really want Grandal but the Sox should’ve signed him last year, now they would get him a year older. 

What?

[MeanJoeCrede]

31 minutes ago, ChiSoxJon said:

he's priority #1 for me with JDM returning to BOS, frankly not ready to dump any significant prospects yet at this point in the process for JDM

Grandal, Ozuna, Abreu, Encarnacion, Kendrick would make me happy for offensive pick ups

Ozuna>Puig>Castellanos for me for RF

if I could have negative interest in Calhoun and Dickerson I would

With Grandal:

Castellanos>Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

Without Grandal: (Hopefully because we spent all the money on Cole or Stras and we just need a one year guy in RF)

Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

If I could have negative interest in Ozuna I would. Ozuna is every White Sox free agent signing of the Kenny William's era. One good year a couple years ago, diminishing value ever since, NOT a RF.

Prefer: Sign Cole or Stras, sign Grandal, trade for Joc Pederson, add a back end starter and a couple of bullpen pieces. Easy Peasy.

[poppysox]

31 minutes ago, MeanJoeCrede said:

With Grandal:

Castellanos>Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

Without Grandal: (Hopefully because we spent all the money on Cole or Stras and we just need a one year guy in RF)

Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

If I could have negative interest in Ozuna I would. Ozuna is every White Sox free agent signing of the Kenny William's era. One good year a couple years ago, diminishing value ever since, NOT a RF.

Prefer: Sign Cole or Stras, sign Grandal, trade for Joc Pederson, add a back end starter and a couple of bullpen pieces. Easy Peasy.

The highlighted should be the FO plan and it is doable.

[ChiSoxJon]

1 hour ago, poppysox said:

The highlighted should be the FO plan and it is doable.

Not sure is Cole/Stras is doable, but would love it...Pederson can be had for not too much...prefer him to Calhoun and Dickerson

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

9 hours ago, Joshua Strong said:

I really want Grandal but the Sox should’ve signed him last year, now they would get him a year older. 

What does that matter? He would be the same age in 2020, whether we signed him in 2020 or back in 2019. Except we now have our 2nd RD pick RHP Matthew Thompson in our system, whom we would have had to forfeit the right to draft in 2019 if we signed Grandal last year. If the Sox sign Grandal this off-season, that would be the best case scenario we could have had with him.

Edited November 5, 2019 by ChiliIrishHammock24

[Boopa1219]

He’s my top target for them now with JDM out. He’s a positive framer and a high OBP guy. He can switch hit and I’d love to see him batting third after Moncada and before Abreu/Eloy. 

Signing him would help maximize McCann as he’ll be pushed to a reserve role as a left handed specialist bat.

3/$55M with an option for a fourth year at $18M is my prediction 

Edited November 5, 2019 by Joshua Strong

[Pal]

Gotta get him now. Probably one of Moose/Castellanos/Ozuna now too.

[steveno89]

14 hours ago, MeanJoeCrede said:

With Grandal:

Castellanos>Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

Without Grandal: (Hopefully because we spent all the money on Cole or Stras and we just need a one year guy in RF)

Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

If I could have negative interest in Ozuna I would. Ozuna is every White Sox free agent signing of the Kenny William's era. One good year a couple years ago, diminishing value ever since, NOT a RF.

Prefer: Sign Cole or Stras, sign Grandal, trade for Joc Pederson, add a back end starter and a couple of bullpen pieces. Easy Peasy.

Money aside, I doubt Cole/Stras would view the White Sox as their desired free agent destination. Strasburg is likely to remain in Washington on a larger deal, and the Angels are rumored to be preparing a huge offer for Cole. I'd love to sign either, but I do not think it's in the cards. 

[Dick Allen]

If the Sox signed Grandal, he would be 2 years younger than what Carlton Fisk was when the Sox signed him. The game has really changed.

[wegner]

18 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

If the Sox signed Grandal, he would be 2 years younger than what Carlton Fisk was when the Sox signed him. The game has really changed.

I wonder if Hawk was the GM, if they would consider signing Grandal to play RF?

[bmags]

15 hours ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

What does that matter? He would be the same age in 2020, whether we signed him in 2020 or back in 2019. Except we now have our 2nd RD pick RHP Matthew Thompson in our system, whom we would have had to forfeit the right to draft in 2019 if we signed Grandal last year. If the Sox sign Grandal this off-season, that would be the best case scenario we could have had with him.

Yeah, the brewers deal was a blessing. Took the QO hit.

[steveno89]

23 minutes ago, bmags said:

Yeah, the brewers deal was a blessing. Took the QO hit.

Qualifying offers really hurt all except the premium free agents

Competition for all of the top free agents should be fierce this offseason. Buckle up. 

[Whisox05]

 

[ptatc]

On 11/5/2019 at 4:41 PM, steveno89 said:

Qualifying offers really hurt all except the premium free agents

Competition for all of the top free agents should be fierce this offseason. Buckle up. 

Is next year a better year for the free agent pool?

[Balta1701]

4 minutes ago, ptatc said:

Is next year a better year for the free agent pool?

After all the extensions we saw last year in spring training...who knows?

[caulfield12]

Not for catchers.

Realmuto is the main one.   I guess we can wait and see if Sal Perez still can physically handle the demands of catching 130+ games coming off major surgery.

[ptatc]

11 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

After all the extensions we saw last year in spring training...who knows?

That's my dilemma. Not too impressed with this off season hitters and wondering if it would be better to get one next offseason. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 11/4/2019 at 5:26 PM, MeanJoeCrede said:

With Grandal:

Castellanos>Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

Without Grandal: (Hopefully because we spent all the money on Cole or Stras and we just need a one year guy in RF)

Puig>Calhoun>Dickerson

If I could have negative interest in Ozuna I would. Ozuna is every White Sox free agent signing of the Kenny William's era. One good year a couple years ago, diminishing value ever since, NOT a RF.

Prefer: Sign Cole or Stras, sign Grandal, trade for Joc Pederson, add a back end starter and a couple of bullpen pieces. Easy Peasy.

Wondering about your rationale for rating the OF's as you do. With his youth and how he showed he can hit away from Detroit he seems like a good choice except for his defense which is a big concern for some since keeping Robert healthy will be a priority and sticking him between 2 subpar OF's seems like a bad idea. The bat however is the best of the bunch and could be elite now.

Dickerson easily is the best hitter of the remaining 3, Career .832 OPS. Made changes to become more of a contact hitter 2 years ago and it showed that he can still hit for power with that approach . Not Castellanos type power maybe not even Puig or Calhoun power but can't be sure because those guys got a lot more AB's than Dickerson last year because Dickerson was injured. which hurts his FA status but helps a team who can see he's a much better hitter now.  He also won a gold glove in left field in 2018 so even though he never played RF he's shown a good ability to play  the OF. He's probably the best example of balancing hitting , fielding and consistency of the last few years. Being a lefty who can also hit lefty pitching also helps . If he can stay healthy I'd expect a .300+ BA. .850 OPS and .340 OBP. Perhaps 20-25 HR. He also wouldn't need to be a long term commitment like Castellanos will probably be.

I don't like a guy like Calhoun who sucked as a hitter 2 out of the last 3 years. Also don't like Puig who is a loose cannon at best and a potential clubhouse cancer at worst.

[BackDoorBreach]

16 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Wondering about your rationale for rating the OF's as you do. With his youth and how he showed he can hit away from Detroit he seems like a good choice except for his defense which is a big concern for some since keeping Robert healthy will be a priority and sticking him between 2 subpar OF's seems like a bad idea. The bat however is the best of the bunch and could be elite now.

Dickerson easily is the best hitter of the remaining 3, Career .832 OPS. Made changes to become more of a contact hitter 2 years ago and it showed that he can still hit for power with that approach . Not Castellanos type power maybe not even Puig or Calhoun power but can't be sure because those guys got a lot more AB's than Dickerson last year because Dickerson was injured. which hurts his FA status but helps a team who can see he's a much better hitter now.  He also won a gold glove in left field in 2018 so even though he never played RF he's shown a good ability to play  the OF. He's probably the best example of balancing hitting , fielding and consistency of the last few years. Being a lefty who can also hit lefty pitching also helps . If he can stay healthy I'd expect a .300+ BA. .850 OPS and .340 OBP. Perhaps 20-25 HR. He also wouldn't need to be a long term commitment like Castellanos will probably be.

I don't like a guy like Calhoun who sucked as a hitter 2 out of the last 3 years. Also don't like Puig who is a loose cannon at best and a potential clubhouse cancer at worst.

I'd be good with Dickerson if we also sign Castellanos.  With his injury history it makes me concerned Leury Garcia would be our RF for half the year.  I don't know if that is at all even realistic but I don't think Dickerson is going to be expensive, and I'd rather have him than Calhoun.

[MeanJoeCrede]

8 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Wondering about your rationale for rating the OF's as you do. With his youth and how he showed he can hit away from Detroit he seems like a good choice except for his defense which is a big concern for some since keeping Robert healthy will be a priority and sticking him between 2 subpar OF's seems like a bad idea. The bat however is the best of the bunch and could be elite now.

Dickerson easily is the best hitter of the remaining 3, Career .832 OPS. Made changes to become more of a contact hitter 2 years ago and it showed that he can still hit for power with that approach . Not Castellanos type power maybe not even Puig or Calhoun power but can't be sure because those guys got a lot more AB's than Dickerson last year because Dickerson was injured. which hurts his FA status but helps a team who can see he's a much better hitter now.  He also won a gold glove in left field in 2018 so even though he never played RF he's shown a good ability to play  the OF. He's probably the best example of balancing hitting , fielding and consistency of the last few years. Being a lefty who can also hit lefty pitching also helps . If he can stay healthy I'd expect a .300+ BA. .850 OPS and .340 OBP. Perhaps 20-25 HR. He also wouldn't need to be a long term commitment like Castellanos will probably be.

I don't like a guy like Calhoun who sucked as a hitter 2 out of the last 3 years. Also don't like Puig who is a loose cannon at best and a potential clubhouse cancer at worst.

I am very high on Castellanos bat, and somewhat less concerned with his defense than most. My biggest concern with him is signing him forces the Sox to make a long term commitment to being defensively challenged in the outfield corners, which potentially hurts development of the young pitchers. I wouldnt hate taking a flyer on Puig, who actually plays RF, and will be cheap, but it wouldnt excite me. I agree with you on Dickerson, but coming off an injury, numbers usually regress and we potentially end up with Jon Jay 2.0. Calhoun is the player most likely to turn into Alonso or any of about 15 or so other free agent busts on the South Side, where you can see all the reasons on paper where it could work, but some combination of age, diminishing skill set, possible changes to the ball next year, etc. leads to a .213/.288/ .402 line. Ozuna just makes absolutely no sense to me. Trading for Joc gives us a 3 WAR player and leaves us options for next year.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

15 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

I'd be good with Dickerson if we also sign Castellanos.  With his injury history it makes me concerned Leury Garcia would be our RF for half the year.  I don't know if that is at all even realistic but I don't think Dickerson is going to be expensive, and I'd rather have him than Calhoun.

I don't think he'll be expensive or require anything longer than 2 years or even one year with incentives plus an option which is very appealing for a guy with a lot to prove and or the signing team who could get a really good hitter for a bargain.

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

6 minutes ago, MeanJoeCrede said:

I am very high on Castellanos bat, and somewhat less concerned with his defense than most. My biggest concern with him is signing him forces the Sox to make a long term commitment to being defensively challenged in the outfield corners, which potentially hurts development of the young pitchers. I wouldnt hate taking a flyer on Puig, who actually plays RF, and will be cheap, but it wouldnt excite me. I agree with you on Dickerson, but coming off an injury, numbers usually regress and we potentially end up with Jon Jay 2.0. Calhoun is the player most likely to turn into Alonso or any of about 15 or so other free agent busts on the South Side, where you can see all the reasons on paper where it could work, but some combination of age, diminishing skill set, possible changes to the ball next year, etc. leads to a .213/.288/ .402 line. Ozuna just makes absolutely no sense to me. Trading for Joc gives us a 3 WAR player and leaves us options for next year.

No chance Dickerson  becomes Jay unless you just mean injuries preventing him from playing  Jay was older and never was the hitter Dickerson is and now he's even better. Injuries just prevented him from showing it but when he was playing he had a very very good .905 OPS. If he had as many AB's as Castellanos, Puig and Calhoun and maintained that . 905 OPS he might be looking at a 3yr/$50M contract instead of perhaps 1/$10M plus incentives.

The longer term commitment is a problem as we both mentioned since Betts and Springer both become available next year. If you can get Dickerson for a year then you can go after those guys in 2021.