ron883 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 (edited) Joe Sheehan gets it. Edited November 23, 2019 by ron883 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 Sheehan is just writing the obvious. You can tell he's not a fan of the Sox' FO and hasn't' been going on two decades online now but the Sox have earned it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thad Bosley Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 11 hours ago, ron883 said: Joe Sheehan gets it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 Is there any good writing on why this contract may have been structured the way it was? I know re-writing the QO is hard, but as people talk about the benefit of the signing bonus I'm confused why it would in particular benefit the sox. And while it would look like what...13.5 or so million on the books next year, do sox consider it 16 mill spent this offseason? Seems so weird they even wanted to do the deferrals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 8 minutes ago, bmags said: Is there any good writing on why this contract may have been structured the way it was? I know re-writing the QO is hard, but as people talk about the benefit of the signing bonus I'm confused why it would in particular benefit the sox. And while it would look like what...13.5 or so million on the books next year, do sox consider it 16 mill spent this offseason? Seems so weird they even wanted to do the deferrals. Accounting wise, signing bonuses are normally amortized over the life of the contract, but budget wise it’s really a 2020 expenditure. In terms of potential benefit, either the Sox are getting some sort of tax benefit in 2019 or they’re just rewarding Jose with more up-front cash. As for the deferrals, it seems like those are typically used to inflate a contract’s gross number, while maintaining a certain net cost to the club. My guess is the Sox offered 3/$48M and Jose wanted 3/$50M and this was the way to bridge that gap from an optics standpoint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Accounting wise, signing bonuses are normally amortized over the life of the contract, but budget wise it’s really a 2020 expenditure. In terms of potential benefit, either the Sox are getting some sort of tax benefit in 2019 or they’re just rewarding Jose with more up-front cash. As for the deferrals, it seems like those are typically used to inflate a contract’s gross number, while maintaining a certain net cost to the club. My guess is the Sox offered 3/$48M and Jose wanted 3/$50M and this was the way to bridge that gap from an optics standpoint. But they do still put money aside for the deferrals in current years in practice don’t they? On it’s face it’s just a lot of weird stuff you’d typically see from a team trying to skirt a cap or lux tax line which theoretically they will not be. OTOH that would be nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 If fans were ok giving Moochado ten years then let's give Jose a chance to play to his mid thirties. If he could learn to lay off those low sliders it would really up his game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 17 minutes ago, pcq said: If fans were ok giving Moochado ten years then let's give Jose a chance to play to his mid thirties. If he could learn to lay off those low sliders it would really up his game. Lmao yeah, he's going to suddenly learn how to do that at this age. I have a better chance of winning the lottery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 25 minutes ago, pcq said: If fans were ok giving Moochado ten years then let's give Jose a chance to play to his mid thirties. If he could learn to lay off those low sliders it would really up his game. Machado is a completely different player than Abreu... Just not at all a fair comparison to what each bring to the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 26 minutes ago, ron883 said: Lmao yeah, he's going to suddenly learn how to do that at this age. I have a better chance of winning the lottery. I mean, he could if he suddenly stops pressing since he doesn't need to be the guy anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 1 minute ago, soxfan2014 said: I mean, he could if he suddenly stops pressing since he doesn't need to be the guy anymore. Abreu is better with RISP though. Pressing isn’t an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 Just now, ron883 said: Lmao yeah, he's going to suddenly learn how to do that at this age. I have a better chance of winning the lottery. Says the master of the same old. When he gets hot he does tend to lay off the bad pitches. I assume they have checked his vision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, pcq said: Says the master of the same old. When he gets hot he does tend to lay off the bad pitches. I assume they have checked his vision. Low and away sliders are difficult for most players. Thinking that he will magically learn to lay off his kryptonite as he gets to his mid 30's is silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napa_soxfan Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 56 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said: I mean, he could if he suddenly stops pressing since he doesn't need to be the guy anymore. To me this is a very important point. I’m ever the optimist, but think he really will benefit from having a better lineup to battle with. Even in 2014 he was “the guy” with no additional consistent threats surrounding him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 The added depth means you can play matchups and go with the hot hand for analytical teams like the Sox. Insert joke here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 9 hours ago, pcq said: If fans were ok giving Moochado ten years then let's give Jose a chance to play to his mid thirties. If he could learn to lay off those low sliders it would really up his game. It kills me how anybody could utter a negative word about Abreu after he knocks in 130 RBI and hits 33 bombs. I mean what do these same people think of players who really reek like the Bears' QB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 I just think people are overreacting about this deal. Yeah it is an overpay, but I'm 99 percent certain this deal won't stop us from making the moves we intend to make. Our front office knew what they'd have to offer Jose and calculated this into their plans. We are still going to acquire some good talent and need to enjoy rooting for Jose having a chance to finally win. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinski Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 (edited) https://fromthe108.com/2019/11/25/jose-abreus-contract-a-deep-look/ whats the view on Beefloafs take. 1) I love the loaf, if he believes this I’m sold! 2) two my view already wasn’t that this was a massive overpay as I believe intangibles have value that could one day be measurable. When that happens this deal will look better. 3) what if this gets a Yoyo exstension done. For those reading this pay particular attention to what the Loaf thInks of the accounting. Edited November 25, 2019 by Colinski 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 My issue with the Abreu deal is that the Sox did not receive any discount for going multi year with him. It’s all risk for the club if he declines, because we pretty easily could have retained Abreu next offseason for 2/32 if he did well in 2020. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 1 minute ago, steveno89 said: My issue with the Abreu deal is that the Sox did not receive any discount for going multi year with him. It’s all risk for the club if he declines, because we pretty easily could have retained Abreu next offseason for 2/32 if he did well in 2020. I'd be real careful about the treatment of Abreu. Our best players look at him like a big brother and I don't want any bad vibes around our team. I'd also like Abreu to convince Moncada to stick around and help attract other free agents. They dollar amount sucks, but may not be worth the downside of pissing the team off and having players think we are disloyal. If you want to see how that stigma hurts you, just look at JR's other team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 1 hour ago, SonofaRoache said: I'd be real careful about the treatment of Abreu. Our best players look at him like a big brother and I don't want any bad vibes around our team. I'd also like Abreu to convince Moncada to stick around and help attract other free agents. They dollar amount sucks, but may not be worth the downside of pissing the team off and having players think we are disloyal. If you want to see how that stigma hurts you, just look at JR's other team. This is a business at the end of the day, do not forget that. I’m not pissed about the Abreu deal, but it’s hard to argue that 3/50 is not an overpayment in terms of dollars and years. No other club would have offered him that deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 1 hour ago, steveno89 said: This is a business at the end of the day, do not forget that. I’m not pissed about the Abreu deal, but it’s hard to argue that 3/50 is not an overpayment in terms of dollars and years. No other club would have offered him that deal. We have no way of knowing what was offered. Another club could have offered 3/45 for all we know. I'm pretty sure JR didn't look at another offer of 2/28 and say, I'm just gonna give him 3/50 for the hell of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 30 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said: We have no way of knowing what was offered. Another club could have offered 3/45 for all we know. I'm pretty sure JR didn't look at another offer of 2/28 and say, I'm just gonna give him 3/50 for the hell of it. If another club offered 3/$45M, Jose would have been nuts to accept the QO. Which is precisely why handing him $50M a week later was super stupid. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 5 hours ago, Colinski said: https://fromthe108.com/2019/11/25/jose-abreus-contract-a-deep-look/ whats the view on Beefloafs take. 1) I love the loaf, if he believes this I’m sold! 2) two my view already wasn’t that this was a massive overpay as I believe intangibles have value that could one day be measurable. When that happens this deal will look better. 3) what if this gets a Yoyo exstension done. For those reading this pay particular attention to what the Loaf thInks of the accounting. Good post and props to finding and posting the link. Everyone should read it just to be more informed on the financial side of it. You got the like from me. Of course those still hating it probably will still hate it no matter what they read but for those of us indifferent it makes sense. For me, who also wrote a post about his difficulties coming from Cuba, it's good to see someone else mention them even though he's not using it at all in his process because he's taking emotion out of it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 If Robert/Moncada WERE to sign extensions (and they would go well beyond the end of Abreu's Sox career, in all likelihood)....or ANOTHER Cuban free agent were to come on board, then it starts to make a lot more sense. We can always imagine that Grandal would have beeen much more comfortable knowing that 3 year deal was almost finalized for Abreu, rather than anticipating his imminent departure as soon as he joined the team...even as early as the trade deadline. That has to be at least one significant aspect of all this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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