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Joc Pederson - Is it goin down?


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1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’d hold onto Adolfo & Basabe.  I do like Walker, but I think I’d explore his trade value while there is still some hope he can play CF.  That being said, I wouldn’t sell him for pennies on the dollar.

I'm on the same page as you on the OF prospects. 

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29 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

So your plan is to hold onto all of them in hopes that one of them exceeds expectations rather use some of them you don’t really like to fill holes on the major league roster or acquire minor league depth?

Maybe I should ve mentioned Tatis also. I think an extra year for them all is in the Sox best interest. The Dodgers have a lot of good players and can afford to wait for them or help develop them, Coming out of a rebuild is even more reason to develop them especially coming off injured and so so seasons in the 1st taste of AA in a terrible place to hit .

Edited by CaliSoxFanViaSWside
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1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Holding onto all your prospects until they reach the point of no value is far more stupid.

False choice; 1 year rents are not the only trading option...unless you are reactive instead of proactive;  play on the other team's terms and lack creativity.

Plus, what Sox prospects have real trade value, but whom the Sox have no real need as they are surplus? 

Edited by GreenSox
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Just now, GreenSox said:

False choice; 1 year rents are not the only trading option...unless you are reactive instead of proactive;  play on the other team's terms and lack creativity.

Never said one year rents are the only option, but what do you think a guy like Blake Rutherford is going to get you right now?  Also, I strongly disagree with the idea of all one year rentals being bad.  There is nothing wrong with trading fringe prospects for guys that can help you now, even if said player is only control for one more season.

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4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Never said one year rents are the only option, but what do you think a guy like Blake Rutherford is going to get you right now?  Also, I strongly disagree with the idea of all one year rentals being bad.  There is nothing wrong with trading fringe prospects for guys that can help you now, even if said player is only control for one more season.

This. 

The only Sox prospects with real value are the ones you don't want to trade. (Robert, Madrigal, Vaughn, Kopech) Unfortunately, all of the secondary guys that we hoped would supplement the team via trade, haven't panned out to be much of anything. They're all bordering on non-prospect status rather than having any sort of trade value. 

You can count the number of actual prospects in the Sox system on two hands. 

JMO: the Big 4 and Matt Thompson/Dalquist are about as deep as the Sox system goes. 

Edited by Jack Parkman
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2 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Never said one year rents are the only option, but what do you think a guy like Blake Rutherford is going to get you right now?  Also, I strongly disagree with the idea of all one year rentals being bad.  There is nothing wrong with trading fringe prospects for guys that can help you now, even if said player is only control for one more season.

So you don't see value in Rutherford but the Dodgers should ?

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4 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

This. 

The only Sox prospects with real value are the ones you don't want to trade(Robert, Madrigal, Vaughn, Kopech) 

Tell that to Semien and Tatis, Jr. and all those who saw no value in them when those trades went down and were pining for us to resign Samardzija. Same thing will happen if we acquire Joc. What will it take to resign him over and over again until he chooses Free Agency.

Edited by CaliSoxFanViaSWside
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1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

So you don't see value in Rutherford but the Dodgers should ?

Scouts have differing opinions all the time.  The Dodgers wanted Fulmer a year ago when most other organizations probably didn’t value him very highly.  Now he’s out of options and probably close to worthless.  At the end of the day, we shouldn’t be holding prospects simply because we’re afraid of being wrong.  Have faith in your self scouting and try to maximize value.

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1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Tell that to Semien and Tatis, Jr. and all those who saw no value in them when those trades went down and were pining for us to resign Samardzija. Same thing will happen if we acquire Joc. What will it take to resign him over and over again until he chooses Free Agency.

Both were better prospects than anyone outside of the big 4. 

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1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Tell that to Semien and Tatis, Jr. and all those who saw no value in them when those trades went down and were pining for us to resign Samardzija. Same thing will happen if we acquire Joc. What will it take to resign him over and over again until he chooses Free Agency.

How many potential future stars do you think are sitting in our system right now that aren’t named Robert, Madrigal, or Vaughn?  You are going to an extreme because of one in thousand outcomes.  Yes, we were burned twice, but that can happen to anyone.  For fucks sakes, the Dodgers gave up Yordan Alvarez for Josh Fields.  Are they also a shit run organization?

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3 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

They traded The Great Jake Peter to the Dodgers in the Joakim Soria deal.  Boy that one sure bit them in the ass.  

The Jake Peter and the Josh Phegly outrage have been, by far, my two favorite White Sox fan overreaction of the past couple decades 

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8 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Scouts have differing opinions all the time.  The Dodgers wanted Fulmer a year ago when most other organizations probably didn’t value him very highly.  Now he’s out of options and probably close to worthless.  At the end of the day, we shouldn’t be holding prospects simply because we’re afraid of being wrong.  Have faith in your self scouting and try to maximize value.

Yes they do have differing opinions all the time .If the Dodgers had interest in Fulmer why didn't they acquire him ? You aren't getting Pederson for fringe prospects like you mentioned. You honestly think our  fringe prospects ( loosely translated as your opinion of our fringe prospects) will top all other offers for him ?

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1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Yes they do have differing opinions all the time .If the Dodgers had interest in Fulmer why didn't they acquire him ? You aren't getting Pederson for fringe prospects like you mentioned. You honestly think our  fringe prospects ( loosely translated as your opinion of our fringe prospects) will top all other offers for him ?

Then somebody else can have him?  We have just money to spend on a RF.  Joc is just a nice fit.  

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2 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Yes they do have differing opinions all the time .If the Dodgers had interest in Fulmer why didn't they acquire him ? You aren't getting Pederson for fringe prospects like you mentioned. You honestly think our  fringe prospects ( loosely translated as your opinion of our fringe prospects) will top all other offers for him ?

We literally almost got him for Fulmer and an interesting relief prospect last year.

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8 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

How many potential future stars do you think are sitting in our system right now that aren’t named Robert, Madrigal, or Vaughn?  You are going to an extreme because of one in thousand outcomes.  Yes, we were burned twice, but that can happen to anyone.  For fucks sakes, the Dodgers gave up Yordan Alvarez for Josh Fields.  Are they also a shit run organization?

2 in a thousand apparently but Sox haven't made a thousand prospect trades since the Semien trade so I guess its not even close to one in a thousand unless the Sox are really really bad at self scouting so I'm supposed to trust your evaluation over the FO. The Dodger are a very good team and not in a rebuild so losing a potential superstar is not nearly the same as it is for the Sox. The Dodger have unlimited payroll , the Sox do not.

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1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

2 in a thousand apparently but Sox haven't made a thousand prospect trades since the Semien trade so I guess its not even close to one in a thousand unless the Sox are really really bad at self scouting so I'm supposed to trust your evaluation over the FO. The Dodger are a very good team and not in a rebuild so losing a potential superstar is not nearly the same as it is for the Sox. The Dodger have unlimited payroll , the Sox do not.

No one in the world thought Marcus Semien was a potential superstar at the time of that trade.  Not one person and I say that as one of his biggest fans on this board.  As for Tatis, he got a $700k signing bonus and was generally viewed in the 25th to 30th range in that signing class.  If other teams thought he had superstar upside, he would have gotten a lot more money.  Point is, there will always be uncertainty with prospects and it sounds like your strategy is trade none of them to prevent the low chance of accidentally trading a future star.

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1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

No one in the world thought Marcus Semien was a potential superstar at the time of that trade.  Not one person and I say that as one of his biggest fans on this board.  As for Tatis, he got a $700k signing bonus and was generally viewed in the 25th to 30th range in that signing class.  If other teams thought he had superstar upside, he would have gotten a lot more money.  Point is, there will always be uncertainty with prospects and it sounds like your strategy is trade none of them to prevent the low chance of accidentally trading a future star.

Thank you ! My point exactly. No one knows who will reach full potential and trading Rutherford or whoever for 1 year of Joc in a season where Joc is useless if we don't make the playoffs is just a poor choice rather than giving your so called fringe OF prospects another year.

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1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Thank you ! My point exactly. No one knows who will reach full potential and trading Rutherford or whoever for 1 year of Joc in a season where Joc is useless if we don't make the playoffs is just a poor choice rather than giving your so called fringe OF prospects another year.

I mean if the price is a guy like Sheets or Gonzalez..who cares? 

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1 minute ago, fathom said:

All this talk about Joc, and no one is focusing on Castellanos, a player many in the media have mentioned today in connection with the Sox 

I'm firmly on the Castellanos train as well and have wanted him as a FA for several months.  I would be happy with either.

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57 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’d hold onto Adolfo & Basabe.  I do like Walker, but I think I’d explore his trade value while there is still some hope he can play CF.  That being said, I wouldn’t sell him for pennies on the dollar.

Well, if they can't get anything they want in return...pretty much have no choice but to hold.

And it's not like they have a bunch of high-rising outfielders at the A-level that are pushing them from below...in fact, one could argue that piling up massive numbers at Charlotte could be the best thing for some of them, confidence-wise and trade-value wise.

The Dodgers used to do this all the time with their top prospects putting up huge Albuquerque numbers, only to disappoint in the big leagues...but that was more of an 80's and 90's trend.

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