Cole to the Yankees: 9 years, $324 million.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

11 minutes ago, Sox80 said:

Do you work for the white sox?

Yes, if the Yankees were involved (breaking news, they were involved) for some reason Machado would have gotten more than 300 million and signed earlier.

It's amazing, the Dodgers are interested in Rendon, so the argument that they had a 3rd baseman (Turner) so they didn't want to retain Machado was erroneous nonsense. Machado played for the Dodgers and they had zero interest in retaining his services last year. Yet, this year they are interested in Rendon. Hmmmmm, almost seems like the Dodgers had no interest in Machado at that price point.

Yankees were supposedly already interested and in the bidding for Machado last year, but they dropped out because it got too expensive for them... but somehow, posters here have made it out to be that if the Yankees were involved, the White Sox never would have been the front runner.

I've said this quite a bit recently - as have others - but there's plenty of things to give the White Sox hell about. They have made a lot of mistakes and things have been really frustrating... but to constantly discredit their good moves (Robert, Abreu, Grandal and etc) by making up reasons for why they happened "the Yankees weren't iNvOlVeD! while critiquing them for every failure is just overkill and annoying and over the top.

Fact is, the White Sox didn't get Machado, and it had nothing to do with who was involved. The scenario wouldn't have changed if other teams were involved. 

It's just nauseating reading all these absurd takes about how everything is awful, and the Sox have no chance here and there despite evidence to the contrary. Focus on ridiculing them for things they actually have failed at; don't make excuses to even discredit their successes.

Edited December 10, 2019 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

6 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

$300 M was at the low end of the early-season projections. 

It’s exactly what was predicted at the start of last offseason.

[Moan4Yoan]

4 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Fact is, the White Sox didn't get Machado, and it had nothing to do with who was involved. The scenario wouldn't have changed if other teams were involved. 

Yes, it did.  The White Sox were involved, and they didn’t want to pay market value in guaranteed money, instead opting to offer incentive-based money...  $50 million guaranteed short.

Edited December 10, 2019 by Moan4Yoan

[Balta1701]

1 minute ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

It’s exactly what was predicted at the start of last offseason.

At the low end. The Machado Range was $300-$350, the Harper range was $350-$400. 

This year, top players are blowing through the upper end of their projected range. Last year, they came in at the bottom end. That's a big difference in value.  

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

6 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yes, if the Yankees were involved (breaking news, they were involved) for some reason Machado would have gotten 300 million.

It's amazing, the Dodgers are interested in Rendon, so the argument that they had a 3rd baseman (Turner) so they didn't want to retain Machado was erroneous nonsense. Machado played for the Dodgers and they had zero interest in retaining his services last year. Yet, this year they are interested in Rendon. Hmmmmm, almost seems like the Dodgers had no interest in Machado at that price point.

Yankees were supposedly already interested and in the bidding for Machado last year, but they dropped out because it got too expensive for them... but somehow, posters here have made it out to be that if the Yankees were involved, the White Sox never would have been the front runner.

I've said this quite a bit recently - as have others - but there's plenty of things to give the White Sox hell about. They have made a lot of mistakes and things have been really frustrating... but to constantly discredit their good moves (Robert, Abreu, Grandal and etc) by making up reasons for why they happened "the Yankees weren't iNvOlVeD! while critiquing them for every failure is just overkill and annoying and over the top.

Fact is, the White Sox didn't get Machado, and it had nothing to do with who was involved. The scenario wouldn't have changed if other teams were involved. 

It's just nauseating reading all these absurd takes about how everything is awful, and the Sox have no chance here and there despite evidence to the contrary. Focus on ridiculing them for things they actually have failed at; don't make excuses to even discredit their successes.

Yep. Supposedly the Yankees and Dodgers didn’t have the money but now they do a year later? If they really wanted Machado they could have found a way to fit him in.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

At the low end. The Machado Range was $300-$350, the Harper range was $350-$400. 

This year, top players are blowing through the upper end of their projected range. Last year, they came in at the bottom end. That's a big difference in value.  

From a “value” perspective, I’d take Rendon at 8/$260M over Machado at 10/$300M. Let’s see if Rendon beats that number.

Harper was always overhyped. Very good player but what has he done to deserve a contract near $400M?

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

5 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Yep. Supposedly the Yankees and Dodgers didn’t have the money but now they do a year later? If they really wanted Machado they could have found a way to fit him in.

Of course they could have; they simply valued other players higher and figured they wouldn't garner such a heavy commitment. Dodgers clearly were willing to move Turner off of 3rd base, they just had no interest in doing it for Machado.

[centerfieldsixers]

5 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Yep. Supposedly the Yankees and Dodgers didn’t have the money but now they do a year later? If they really wanted Machado they could have found a way to fit him in.

they didnt want Machado cause of the personality.  time in the end will show that we were better off not signing him

[Balta1701]

4 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Yep. Supposedly the Yankees and Dodgers didn’t have the money but now they do a year later? If they really wanted Machado they could have found a way to fit him in.

Well yeah, contracts end. The Dodgers had Rich Hill on a $20 million deal and Ryu on a $17.5 million deal - that's enough to pay some of their arb bonuses and still have $30 million under the competitive balance tax. If they have a couple younger pitchers to replace those guys, and they do - that's money they can move elsewhere.

[Sox80]

9 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Yes, if the Yankees were involved (breaking news, they were involved) for some reason Machado would have gotten more than 300 million and signed earlier.

It's amazing, the Dodgers are interested in Rendon, so the argument that they had a 3rd baseman (Turner) so they didn't want to retain Machado was erroneous nonsense. Machado played for the Dodgers and they had zero interest in retaining his services last year. Yet, this year they are interested in Rendon. Hmmmmm, almost seems like the Dodgers had no interest in Machado at that price point.

Yankees were supposedly already interested and in the bidding for Machado last year, but they dropped out because it got too expensive for them... but somehow, posters here have made it out to be that if the Yankees were involved, the White Sox never would have been the front runner.

I've said this quite a bit recently - as have others - but there's plenty of things to give the White Sox hell about. They have made a lot of mistakes and things have been really frustrating... but to constantly discredit their good moves (Robert, Abreu, Grandal and etc) by making up reasons for why they happened "the Yankees weren't iNvOlVeD! while critiquing them for every failure is just overkill and annoying and over the top.

Fact is, the White Sox didn't get Machado, and it had nothing to do with who was involved. The scenario wouldn't have changed if other teams were involved. 

It's just nauseating reading all these absurd takes about how everything is awful, and the Sox have no chance here and there despite evidence to the contrary. Focus on ridiculing them for things they actually have failed at; don't make excuses to even discredit their successes.

 That's a pretty long response for a simple question. I'm not that down on the Sox as much as some on here . With you they can't do any wrong.  Discredit their successes? They have had one winning season since 08 . You wouldn't know reading your posts . There's nothing wrong being a blind homer as long as you can admit it. 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Well yeah, contracts end. The Dodgers had Rich Hill on a $20 million deal and Ryu on a $17.5 million deal - that's enough to pay some of their arb bonuses and still have $30 million under the competitive balance tax. If they have a couple younger pitchers to replace those guys, and they do - that's money they can move elsewhere.

Again, they could have moved money to resign Machado if they REALLY wanted him or just paid the luxury tax for the one year. Bottom line, they didn’t think he was worth $300M. Try to excuse it how ever you want but that’s the truth.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

1 minute ago, Sox80 said:

 That's a pretty long response for a simple question. I'm not that down on the Sox as much as some on here . With you they can't do any wrong.  Discredit their successes? They have had one winning season since 08 . You wouldn't know reading your posts . There's nothing wrong being a blind homer as long as you can admit it. 

I have been critical of the White Sox plenty; I'm simply not critical of things that don't warrant criticism. 

Internationally - they are cheap and have shown a reluctance to actually participate in that market; whether it's for moral or monetary reasons, it sucks.

FA - they haven't really played in this world much lately as they've been so bad. They butchered the Machado negotiations and were lambasted, rightfully so, for it. That said, it ended up being a blessing for the White Sox that their incompetence there likely saved them from a deal that wasn't really warranted.

Trades - they have succeeded here, but they've also had failures (Tatis, Semien even), but every time that trades assets can run into that issue. Overall they've done really well on their big trades, and not as well on their small trades.

Big League Scouting - This is where the organization is really lacking. They used to be able to find pitchers that fit their mold for change, but now I don't really see that happening. The biggest shortcoming of this rebuild is they really haven't found a single diamond in the dumpster while they were diving. 

I can talk reasonably without getting angry and taking this personally. The Sox just had the worst decade of my lifetime, and this was after 2 decades of competitive baseball. The Sox are far from the best organization in baseball, but they're also far from the worst (I think). They could have really butchered the rebuild - look at some of these other elite player trades that were awful (Pirates, and Marlins come to me fastest) - but they have been just good enough to give the team a chance. 

Let's see how they close before we ridicule this off-season in which they've spent money, and attempted to outspend others for assets they enjoy.

[Sox80]

Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I have been critical of the White Sox plenty; I'm simply not critical of things that don't warrant criticism. 

Internationally - they are cheap and have shown a reluctance to actually participate in that market; whether it's for moral or monetary reasons, it sucks.

FA - they haven't really played in this world much lately as they've been so bad. They butchered the Machado negotiations and were lambasted, rightfully so, for it. That said, it ended up being a blessing for the White Sox that their incompetence there likely saved them from a deal that wasn't really warranted.

Trades - they have succeeded here, but they've also had failures (Tatis, Semien even), but every time that trades assets can run into that issue. Overall they've done really well on their big trades, and not as well on their small trades.

Big League Scouting - This is where the organization is really lacking. They used to be able to find pitchers that fit their mold for change, but now I don't really see that happening. The biggest shortcoming of this rebuild is they really haven't found a single diamond in the dumpster while they were diving. 

I can talk reasonably without getting angry and taking this personally. The Sox just had the worst decade of my lifetime, and this was after 2 decades of competitive baseball. The Sox are far from the best organization in baseball, but they're also far from the worst (I think). They could have really butchered the rebuild - look at some of these other elite player trades that were awful (Pirates, and Marlins come to me fastest) - but they have been just good enough to give the team a chance. 

Let's see how they close before we ridicule this off-season in which they've spent money, and attempted to outspend others for assets they enjoy.

Alright.  That's a fair and well response.  My mistake I apologize.  I'm also not giving up on this offseason to much time left .  I want to believe this is when we see them finally start to turn the corner.  

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

Looks like Cole will likely sign before the Winter Meetings conclude if we trust the implication from Scott Boras.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

?

I'll give Scott this, he never stops trying.

[Orlando]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 10, 2019 by Orlando

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

6 minutes ago, Orlando said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I get the speculation, and I still really found that piece from Ken Rosenthal about the Sox being willing to spend at that level but not wanting to get in negotiations to fail at that level, but it seems so unlikely. I will say there are two legit smoke pieces between Rosenthal and Boras implication regarding his discussions with the Sox.

It would be batshit crazy if the Sox closed this out. I'm raising my percentage from 0% chance to a .0000000001% chance.

Speaking as a White Sox fan who clearly loves abuse and to be disappointed, maybe the Sox told Boras if their interest leaks they're out.

Edited December 10, 2019 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[steveno89]

4 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I get the speculation, and I still really found that piece from Ken Rosenthal about the Sox being willing to spend at that level but not wanting to get in negotiations to fail at that level, but it seems so unlikely. I will say there are two legit smoke pieces between Rosenthal and Boras implication regarding his discussions with the Sox.

It would be batshit crazy if the Sox closed this out. I'm raising my percentage from 0% chance to a .0000000001% chance.

Speaking as a White Sox fan who clearly loves abuse and to be disappointed, maybe the Sox told Boras if their interest leaks they're out.

Sox are not in on Cole, mark my words. 

This is the Chicago White Sox we are talking about

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

2 minutes ago, steveno89 said:

Sox are not in on Cole, mark my words. 

This is the Chicago White Sox we are talking about

I think this is true, but if there really are 2 mystery teams (doubtful) the Sox really make some of the most sense. 

[Dick Allen]

I wonder if the players association  told Boras to get his ass in gear this year. His waiting and waiting seems to hurt the lesser players more than it ultimately hurts or helps his guys.

[SonofaRoache]

2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I think this is true, but if there really are 2 mystery teams (doubtful) the Sox really make some of the most sense. 

No we don't. No way we get into the 300m convo for a pitcher. 

[raBBit]

Sox will get neither, but they will be the "mystery team" for Rendon, not Cole.

[Southwest Sider]

Sox are throwing everyone off the scent with all the trade talk if it is truly the case that they are a mystery team. 

UPDATE: Source is telling me that the White Sox are BOTH of the mystery teams. TFWIW.

 

?

Edited December 10, 2019 by South Sider

[steveno89]

Just now, Dick Allen said:

I wonder if the players association  told Boras to get his ass in gear this year. His waiting and waiting seems to hurt the lesser players more than it ultimately hurts or helps his guys.

Boras does not work for them, he works for his clients though

[steveno89]

1 minute ago, raBBit said:

Sox will get neither, but they will be the "mystery team" for Rendon, not Cole.

Been pounding the table that the Sox should dive in on Rendon all offseason. Legit top ten player in the game, should age well and can guide us to the promised land in the middle of our batting order. 

Being realistic, we aren't sniffing Cole or Rendon

 

Edited December 10, 2019 by steveno89