COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

[Jack Parkman]

3 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

So would you say this administration is full blown fascist?

Trump? Absloutely. 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[ron883]

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

Absloutely. 

The fact that you are able to make that claim without repercussions leads me to disagree.

[Jack Parkman]

1 hour ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

The fact that you are able to make that claim without repercussions leads me to disagree.

You want to take it to PM Ron? 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[turnin' two]

3 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

I spend a lot of time in Wisconsin as well. Most of the population of the state lives in Madison and Milwaukee. Those areas vote heavily democratic. I've been going to rural Sauk county for 20 years. I was actually surprised that I saw a bunch of Biden/Pocan signs out there when I went a few weeks ago. I know of the phenomenon of which you speak. I wouldn't call it 50/50, but maybe 60/40 in favor of Trump. 

BTW I prefer to discuss the right/left political spectrum on a global level. 

On a purely global political level, Bernie Sanders and AOC are centrists, and calling the mainstream/moderate Democrats center-right is generous. The GOP is very clearly radical right. These are facts. The US political system is skewed heavily to the right. 

Also, based on what comes out of GOP lawmakers mouths what that statement is accurate. The GOP is calling Biden a socialist which is beyond ludicrous. By even US standards, Biden is a centrist. However, I agree with the fact that real conversations are impossible, quite frankly because you believe that last statement is hyperbole. Is it a slight exaggeration, sure. But it's nowhere near close to hyperbole. It's very close to accurate honestly. 

GOP: FU you're on your own

DNC: We *might* give you a few table scraps...if we can convince those guys that you can have some. 

 

Those two cities have populations of less than a million.  Wisconsin has about 6 million residents.  It is nothing like Chicago anchoring Illinois politics.  

And I don't see any benefit to thinking about right/left on a global scale while discussing politics in the US.  I don't understand what the political leanings in Belarus or Venezuela have have to do with what is going on here.  I guess I just don't understand the purpose of framing the conversation in that way.  

And I would love to see data on the claim that the US is heavily right.  Are we more to the right than China?  Yeah.  Western Europe?  Yeah.  Canada?  Yeah.  South America?  No.  I wouldn't say so.  Africa?  Probably not.  The Middle East?  I wouldn't say so.  Eastern Europe?  Not so sure.  Probably close.  India?  I doubt it.  Indonesia?  Nope.    

I would guess that in the global scheme of things, the US is pretty much in the center.  Unless of course, you consider democracy itself, which is probably to the left of center on a global political spectrum.

[Jack Parkman]

18 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Those two cities have populations of less than a million.  Wisconsin has about 6 million residents.  It is nothing like Chicago anchoring Illinois politics.  

And I don't see any benefit to thinking about right/left on a global scale while discussing politics in the US.  I don't understand what the political leanings in Belarus or Venezuela have have to do with what is going on here.  I guess I just don't understand the purpose of framing the conversation in that way.  

And I would love to see data on the claim that the US is heavily right.  Are we more to the right than China?  Yeah.  Western Europe?  Yeah.  Canada?  Yeah.  South America?  No.  I wouldn't say so.  Africa?  Probably not.  The Middle East?  I wouldn't say so.  Eastern Europe?  Not so sure.  Probably close.  India?  I doubt it.  Indonesia?  Nope.    

I would guess that in the global scheme of things, the US is pretty much in the center.  Unless of course, you consider democracy itself, which is probably to the left of center on a global political spectrum.

The US is slightly left of Putin's Russia. That's probably the best comparison worldwide. 

There's a lot of evidence that has come out recently that supports that. If I can find it again,  I'll send some links. 

Ways that US politics skews heavily right, just off the top of my head: 

1. There is a strong segment of Christian theocracy that influences legislators

2. Minimal social safety nets

3. the myth of "American Exceptionalism" (this is nationalism at its core) 

4. Systemic oppression of ethnic and other minority groups(lgbt, disabled, etc) 

5. Workers have virtually no rights,  as unions have been rendered virtually powerless

 

Other points: 

 

6. State controlled media(The DNC controls MSNBC, the RNC controls Fox News, idk what the hell CNN is. It seems to play the US center" 

7. Loss of journalistic integrity-The oligarchs have purchased all of the major newspapers and media outlets such that they can control the messaging

8. Lack of accountability of elected officials and CEOs-white collar criminals can get away with nearly everything. He who can afford the best lawyer, wins the case. 

 

Also, I'm going to disagree with you about South America, as there is and always has been a strong left wing movement down there. Henry Kissinger and Richard Nixon literally overthrew Salvador Allende, a socialist, who was democratically elected in 1973 and replaced him with Pinochet. They did similar things in other South American countries. 

Look up Operation Condor. You'll be surprised what you found. All of the blood in the southern cone in the 70s and 80s is on the hands of the CIA. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[turnin' two]

15 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

The US is slightly left of Putin's Russia. That's probably the best comparison worldwide. 

There's a lot of evidence that has come out recently that supports that. If I can find that, I'll send some links. 

 

So it is your opinion that a fully functional republic (at least in practice, whatever else you want to say) , with 3 chambers of government and full checks and balances, is slightly left of what is a complete dictatorship where political dissidents are murdered?  That... doesn't seem credible.

But this also has nothing to do with covid, and is clearly political, if not acidic, but still, I think I'm gonna check out so this doesn't get messy.  Have a good one Jack.    

Edited September 10, 2020 by turnin' two

[Jack Parkman]

9 hours ago, turnin' two said:

So it is your opinion that a fully functional republic (at least in practice, whatever else you want to say) , with 3 chambers of government and full checks and balances, is slightly left of what is a complete dictatorship where political dissidents are murdered?  That... doesn't seem credible.  

If you want to continue, I ask if we could do so over PM. Thanks. 

Edited September 10, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[Jack Parkman]

6 hours ago, Tony said:

Back to COVID talk, please and thank you. 

Yep, I asked everyone to hit me up with PMs if they wanted to continue. 

[StrangeSox]

seems bad, imo

 

 

[caulfield12]

 

[greg775]

Corona numbers seem to be going down in hotspot Kansas a tad. What's everybody's opinions on travel these days? I'm against it. I feel like no matter what people say, getting on a plane is ridiculously dumb (I don't want to get corona and lose my sense of smell and taste and die). Why? Even if they say it's safe, cmon. People move their masks to eat snacks. People move their masks just like they recline their seats. I feel like no matter what they say, a plane is a corona nightmare.

Also, cmon. those overhead bins are dirty. Cmon, the guy in the middle seat is in your face, in your business. Just getting up to deplane you will be next to a zillion people.

Then the hotel? Cmon. Germs abound. And the uber? And the rental? All the people u run into on the road? I deem my odds of getting corona following a 4-day road trip at 85 percent. What do u all think? I haven't got it yet .Those of you who believe, please pray for me and all of us to stay healthy. Corona blows.

Edited September 10, 2020 by greg775

[Jack Parkman]

6 minutes ago, greg775 said:

Corona numbers seem to be going down in hotspot Kansas a tad. What's everybody's opinions on travel these days? I'm against it. I feel like no matter what people say, getting on a plane is ridiculously dumb (I don't want to get corona and lose my sense of smell and taste and die). Why? Even if they say it's safe, cmon. People move their masks to eat snacks. People move their masks just like they recline their seats. I feel like no matter what they say, a plane is a corona nightmare.

Also, cmon. those overhead bins are dirty. Cmon, the guy in the middle seat is in your face, in your business. Just getting up to deplane you will be next to a zillion people.

Then the hotel? Cmon. Germs abound. And the uber? And the rental? All the people u run into on the road? I deem my odds of getting corona following a 4-day road trip at 85 percent. What do u all think? I haven't got it yet .Those of you who believe, please pray for me and all of us to stay healthy. Corona blows.

Camping: Ok

Anything else: No way. 

[he gone.]

my thoughts on it all have changed so many times over so who knows? Covid has joined the holy grail of things not to talk about in my opinion - religion, politics and covid. 

I personally have traveled, but i also very likely had Covid back in early March. (was in and out of Ohare like 10 times in two weeks, in vegas for a conference, etc. and then got sicker than i had for probably a decade, wife then got sick worse than she had ever too and got it officially) So who knows again on the point of if you can get it twice, but my current thoughts are i need to keep my own mental health up. i flew to denver to hike for a week last month. all seemed alright, i understand the risks, etc. a lot more than i did back in April. As more information emerges i just have to calculate the risks of what i am doing, how it effects others, etc. So i traveled and then went home for 10 days and didn't see anybody or do anything. But i'll tell you that week away from home was glorious. Planes probably aren't the best idea, but theyll counter about the air filters. Again, all up to the individual and when you make your choices try to no affect others with your decision. 

[southsider2k5]

 

[greg775]

5 hours ago, BrianAnderson said:

Again, all up to the individual and when you make your choices try to no affect others with your decision. 

Thanks for your take. It's not ALL up to the individual though if work wants u traveling.

[StrangeSox]

16 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

 

 

"willing to dine indoors during a pandemic" is going to correlate strongly with other high-risk behaviors, but still, this has been painfully obvious since before Illinois rushed to Phase 4 to get bars and restaurants opened up (and then yelling at everyone in their 20's for going out)

 

 

[Chicago White Sox]

18 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

 

I have no idea how anyone could eat indoors at a restaurant right now.  It’s absolutely bonkers.

[southsider2k5]

18 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I have no idea how anyone could eat indoors at a restaurant right now.  It’s absolutely bonkers.

I haven't in six months, and have no plans to anytime soon.  In fact, i don't even do carryout if a place has a curbside option.

[bigruss]

35 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I have no idea how anyone could eat indoors at a restaurant right now.  It’s absolutely bonkers.

I've gone to a few places, honestly they are more spread out than a grocery store and way more diligent in sanitizing.  Not every place is like that though, if I feel uncomfortable with the setup I won't stay.  It's definitely a risk, but the little bit of normalcy is really nice.  

 

One thing that irks me to no end though, people are still just oblivious as ever when in a store, standing in the middle of the aisle or letting kids run around touching everything and everyone (wish that was a joke), whole families blocking access, etc.  I really do try to keep 6 ft apart as much as possible and these jokers are coming right up on you or don't pick up on any clues to move.

[whitesoxfan99]

2 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

 

"willing to dine indoors during a pandemic" is going to correlate strongly with other high-risk behaviors, but still, this has been painfully obvious since before Illinois rushed to Phase 4 to get bars and restaurants opened up (and then yelling at everyone in their 20's for going out)

 

 

Yep, but to be fair, and as noted in the tweet, you need a national plan here.  Restaurants need to all be bailed out so that they don't need to be open for indoor dining without people losing their businesses and livelihoods.  It shouldn't be up to the states here.

[StrangeSox]

Surface sanitization doesn't seem to be the primary risk factor, though. It's been in an indoor space for longer periods of time, especially if people aren't wearing masks and if they're talking. That is what makes restaurants and bars so bad. Long periods in the same indoor space with your mask off and probably lots of talking.

 

1 minute ago, whitesoxfan99 said:

Yep, but to be fair, and as noted in the tweet, you need a national plan here.  Restaurants need to all be bailed out so that they don't need to be open for indoor dining without people losing their businesses and livelihoods.  It shouldn't be up to the states here.

For sure. The states can't just print money like the federal government can. I get why a lot of state and local governments are caving on these measures; they need the tax revenues and the businesses need the cash. Ultimately the failure lies at the feet of the federal government, which seems content to let everything collapse ever since the DOW went back up.

Edited September 11, 2020 by StrangeSox

[greg775]

2 hours ago, bigruss said:

I've gone to a few places, honestly they are more spread out than a grocery store and way more diligent in sanitizing.  Not every place is like that though, if I feel uncomfortable with the setup I won't stay.  It's definitely a risk, but the little bit of normalcy is really nice.  

 

One thing that irks me to no end though, people are still just oblivious as ever when in a store, standing in the middle of the aisle or letting kids run around touching everything and everyone (wish that was a joke), whole families blocking access, etc.  I really do try to keep 6 ft apart as much as possible and these jokers are coming right up on you or don't pick up on any clues to move.

We are taking about restaurants and stores. I've been in restaurants eating and there's nobody near me There are waitresses though and the people I'm eating with, never a full cramped table of 4 or anything. This is what confuses me. We're expressing problems with dining and shopping and having 3 in a pew at church, but I haven't sensed any angst about flying. Cmon. You are packed like sardines on planes. How can planes not be a HUGE problem. I still think this is all political and all screwed up about where is 'safe' and where 'isn't.'

Edited September 11, 2020 by greg775

[greg775]

2 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

Surface sanitization doesn't seem to be the primary risk factor, though. It's been in an indoor space for longer periods of time, especially if people aren't wearing masks and if they're talking. That is what makes restaurants and bars so bad. Long periods in the same indoor space with your mask off and probably lots of talking.

 

For sure. The states can't just print money like the federal government can. I get why a lot of state and local governments are caving on these measures; they need the tax revenues and the businesses need the cash. Ultimately the failure lies at the feet of the federal government, which seems content to let everything collapse ever since the DOW went back up.

You wait and see how we are going to be printing money in the near future. I won't cause a controversy here by explaining where. If you want to chat about it PM me.

[pcq]

My amazement around the city downtown is how many people and esp. younger people prefer to wear a mask around their neck. Perhaps they want to be seen? 

[StrangeSox]

 

UIUC had a bad opening, but their testing and contain seems to have quickly improved things?