mqr Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 3 hours ago, bmags said: this was so encouraging to see: https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-4f4ae2e3bad122d17742be22a2240ae8?utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=SocialFlow Pfizer vaccine phase 3 shows 90% effectiveness, no medical flags. 94 infections in 44,000 people registered. This is an unprecedented streak of good news, what is going on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Derek Lowe's done a good job on following the vaccines and has some initial thoughts: https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/11/09/vaccine-efficacy-data Quote Pfizer/BioNTech say that the protection looks like it should last at least a year – no numbers on that yet, but it can only be based on neutralizing antibody titers and/or T-cell levels and their change over time. The only way to get better numbers on that is to wait and collect better numbers; there is absolutely no way to tell without waiting to see. But if we’re already out to about a year’s protection, that’s very good to hear. Quote What does this mean for the pandemic vaccine effort in general? The first big take-away is that coronavirus vaccines can work. I have already said many times (here and in interviews) that I thought that this would be the case, but now we finally have proof. The worst “oh-God-no-vaccine” case is now disposed of. And since all of the vaccines are targeting the same Spike protein, it is highly likely that they are all going to work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 This vaccine needing to be stored at -94 F is going to cause some problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Dr. Ben Carson has covid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, mqr said: This vaccine needing to be stored at -94 F is going to cause some problems. It will make things more expensive and may mean the logistics are slightly slower, but production is going to be the main bottleneck for a while. They are fridge-stable for a day or two, so they're ok in regular fridges every pharmacy or doctor's office already has. Bad news for less-developed countries, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 1 hour ago, StrangeSox said: So, grimly dark here that we may get a vaccine quicker because of how bad things have gotten. But trying to read through the lines of this press release, and it seems like there's an indication of sterilizing immunity. That would be huge. That means not only that you don't personally get sick, but also that you don't get an infection in the first place and become an asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic spreader. Worth noting - I don't think Pfizer has any ability to test for this based on their study design. They are testing people for the virus when they first get each dose, and then again if they show symptoms. There's no testing being done of people who don't show symptoms - without that, there's no way to rule out the hypothesis that people get the virus, carry it, and pass it on efficiently. It certainly could be the case, but I don't see any way Pfizer could test for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 22 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: Dr. Ben Carson has covid. Why am I not surprised? It is amazing that the Trump denial act goes on and on. Not amazing that he doesn't care for the people who work for him. Meanwhile, how many more are there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 The Trump admin claiming responsibility for the Pfizer news, even though it appears to be a complete fabrication, is unequivocally good imo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 1 minute ago, mqr said: The Trump admin claiming responsibility for the Pfizer news, even though it appears to be a complete fabrication, is unequivocally good imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Just now, southsider2k5 said: right, I know it's a false claim, but I'd rather that than what Jr. is out there spewing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Just now, southsider2k5 said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Mike Pence knew his tweet was a lie yet he threw it out there anyway. For a guy who claims faith is a large part of his life, you think truth would have some importance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 https://buildbackbetter.com/press-releases/biden-harris-transition-announces-covid-19-advisory-board/ Quote CO-CHAIRS Dr. David Kessler David A. Kessler, MD, is Professor of Pediatrics and Epidemiology and Biostatistics at UCSF. Dr. Kessler served as FDA Commissioner from 1990 to 1997, appointed by President George H.W. Bush and reappointed by President Bill Clinton. Dr. Vivek Murthy Vivek Murthy, MD, MBA, served as the 19th Surgeon General of the United States from 2014-2017. As the Vice Admiral of the US Public Health Service Commissioned Corps, he commanded a uniformed service of 6,600 public health officers globally. The officers focused on helping underserved populations, protecting the nation from Ebola and Zika, responding to the Flint water crisis, and natural disasters such as hurricanes. Dr. Marcella Nunez-Smith Marcella Nunez-Smith, MD, MHS, is an Associate Professor of Internal Medicine, Public Health, and Management at Yale University and the Associate Dean for Health Equity Research at the Yale School of Medicine. Dr. Nunez-Smith’s research focuses on promoting health and healthcare equity for structurally marginalized populations. MEMBERS Dr. Luciana Borio Luciana Borio, MD, is VP, Technical Staff at In-Q-Tel. She is also a senior fellow for global health at the Council on Foreign Relations. Dr. Borio specializes in biodefense, emerging infectious diseases, medical product development, and complex public health emergencies. She served in senior leadership positions at the FDA and National Security Council, including as Assistant Commissioner for Counterterrorism Policy and Acting Chief Scientist at the FDA, and Director of FDA’s Office of Counterterrorism and Emerging Threats. Dr. Rick Bright Rick Bright, PhD, is an American immunologist, virologist, and former public health official. Dr. Bright was the director of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA) from 2016 to 2020 and the Deputy Assistant Secretary for Preparedness and Response at the Department of Health and Human Services. He also previously served as an advisor to the World Health Organization and the United States Department of Defense. His career has focused on the development of vaccines, drugs, and diagnostics to address emerging infectious diseases and national security threats. Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel Ezekiel J. Emanuel, MD, PhD, is an oncologist and Vice Provost for Global Initiatives and chair of the Department of Medical Ethics and Health Policy at the University of Pennsylvania. From January 2009 to January 2011, he served as special advisor for health policy to the director of the White House Office of Management and Budget. Since 1997, he has served as chair of the Department of Bioethics at The Clinical Center of the National Institutes of Health (NIH). Dr. Atul Gawande Atul Gawande, MD, MPH, is the Cyndy and John Fish Distinguished Professor of Surgery at Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Samuel O. Thier Professor of Surgery at Harvard Medical School, and Professor of Health Policy and Management at Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health. Dr. Gawande is also the founder and chair of Ariadne Labs, a joint center between Brigham and Women’s Hospital and the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health for health systems innovation, and of Lifebox, a nonprofit organization making surgery safer globally. He previously served as a senior advisor in the Department of Health and Human Services in the Clinton Administration. Dr. Celine Gounder Celine Gounder, MD, ScM, FIDSA is a Clinical Assistant Professor at the NYU Grossman School of Medicine and cares for patients at Bellevue Hospital Center. From 1998 to 2012, Dr. Gounder studied TB and HIV in South Africa, Lesotho, Malawi, Ethiopia and Brazil. While on faculty at Johns Hopkins, Dr. Gounder was the Director for Delivery for the Gates Foundation-funded Consortium to Respond Effectively to the AIDS/TB Epidemic. She later served as Assistant Commissioner and Director of the Bureau of Tuberculosis Control at the NYC Department of Health and Mental Hygiene. Dr. Julie Morita Julie Morita, MD, is Executive Vice President of the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation (RWJF). Morita previously served as the Health Commissioner for the City of Chicago for nearly two decades. She is a member of the American Academy of Pediatrics and has served on many state, local, and national health committees, including the CDC’s Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices, and the National Academy of Sciences’ Committee on Community Based Solutions to Promote Health Equity in the United States. Dr. Michael Osterholm Michael Osterholm, PhD, MPH, is Regents Professor, McKnight Presidential Endowed Chair in Public Health and the director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy (CIDRAP) at the University of Minnesota. Dr. Osterholm previously served as a Science Envoy for Health Security on behalf of the State Department. For 24 years (1975 to 1999), he worked in the Minnesota Department of Health; the last 15 years as state epidemiologist. Ms. Loyce Pace Loyce Pace, MPH, is the Executive Director and President of Global Health Council. Over the course of her career, Loyce has championed policies for access to essential medicines and health services worldwide. Ms. Pace has worked with Physicians for Human Rights and Catholic Relief Services, and previously served in leadership positions at the LIVESTRONG Foundation and the American Cancer Society. Dr. Robert Rodriguez Dr. Robert Rodriguez graduated from Harvard Medical School and currently serves as a Professor of Emergency Medicine at the UCSF School of Medicine, where he works on the frontline in the emergency department and ICU of two major trauma centers. He has authored over 100 scientific publications and has led national research teams examining a range of topics in medicine, including the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on the mental health of frontline providers. In July 2020, Dr. Rodriguez volunteered to help with a critical surge of COVID-19 patients in the ICU in his hometown of Brownsville, Texas. Dr. Eric Goosby Eric Goosby, MD, is an internationally recognized expert on infectious diseases and Professor of Medicine at the UCSF School of Medicine. During the Clinton Administration, Dr. Goosby was the founding director of the Ryan White CARE Act, the largest federally funded HIV/AIDS program. He went on to become the interim Director of the White House’s Office of National AIDS Policy. In the Obama Administration, Dr. Goosby was appointed Ambassador-at-Large and implemented the U.S. President’s Emergency Plan for AIDS Relief (PEPFAR). After serving as the U.S. Global AIDS Coordinator, he was appointed by the UN Secretary General as the Special Envoy for TB. Michael Osterholm was a fan-favorite in this thread many moons ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Just now, Quin said: https://buildbackbetter.com/press-releases/biden-harris-transition-announces-covid-19-advisory-board/ Michael Osterholm was a fan-favorite in this thread many moons ago. Why no Biden kids? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 40 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: They issued a second clarification because they are actually part of Operation Warp Speed since they have a contract with the US government to supply vaccines, but that's on the backend. They did not take any R&D money, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 This is wonderful news, however............... How many times have drugs been FDA approved and pulled 10 years later after multiple deadly side effects have been found? Hold your horses. Get back to me in 2022. Then we can talk. They're two months in. The profit motive can pervert science and create a dangerous situation. The consequences of an adverse side effect that doesn't show itself for 18-36 months or so, could be worse than the Rona itself, especially for something that would need to be distributed to the entirety of humanity. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 16 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: This is wonderful news, however............... How many times have drugs been FDA approved and pulled 10 years later after multiple deadly side effects have been found? Hold your horses. Get back to me in 2022. Then we can talk. They're two months in. The profit motive can pervert science and create a dangerous situation. The consequences of an adverse side effect that doesn't show itself for 18-36 months or so, could be worse than the Rona itself, especially for something that would need to be distributed to the entirety of humanity. Quite frankly, that's a reasonable gamble against this foe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 3 hours ago, StrangeSox said: I dunno. Nobody is studying what happens if you take more than one vaccine. Would you be willing to potentially lock yourself out of the 90%+ effective vaccine forever in order to get the 60% effective one six months earlier? Not an easy call to make, imo. I find this hard to believe, and the assumption should be this is not the case until we find out it is. Not vice versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 41 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: This is wonderful news, however............... How many times have drugs been FDA approved and pulled 10 years later after multiple deadly side effects have been found? Hold your horses. Get back to me in 2022. Then we can talk. They're two months in. The profit motive can pervert science and create a dangerous situation. The consequences of an adverse side effect that doesn't show itself for 18-36 months or so, could be worse than the Rona itself, especially for something that would need to be distributed to the entirety of humanity. Do you know how many phase 3 studies get 40k+ participants? Do you know how often the pulled drugs are maintenance drugs or others that require constant usage? Pfizer had already been guaranteed purchases, and the cost of the vaccine to americans will be free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 not groundbreaking and reads like speculation because Moderna was the other mRNA vaccine. But thought worth sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 David Bossie, the guy leading the Trump campaign legal fight, has the coronavirus. This is like a ridiculous episode of Veep. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, bmags said: Do you know how many phase 3 studies get 40k+ participants? Do you know how often the pulled drugs are maintenance drugs or others that require constant usage? Pfizer had already been guaranteed purchases, and the cost of the vaccine to americans will be free. No matter how many people have participated in the phase three studies, there's absolutely nothing they can do to prove to me it's safe other than give it the proper time. (24-36 months) Long-term side effects are called such because they appear during a longer timescale. I don't trust anything that has been around for less than 2-3 years. Sorry. They have no idea what could happen a year or two down the road, until they actually have people that have had the vaccine for 2-3 years. There's a reason why the record for a safe vaccine is 4 years. I take that as 3 years as the minimum amount of time to prove no adverse long-term reactions. Edited November 9, 2020 by Jack Parkman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Are there previous examples of vaccines having negative impacts that don't show up for 2-3 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, StrangeSox said: Are there previous examples of vaccines having negative impacts that don't show up for 2-3 years? So this vaccine blocks ACE receptors. That means that some drugs to treat other diseases that previously worked through ACE receptors could possibly become ineffective. They have to investigate that stuff before they can give this to everyone. Edited November 9, 2020 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1325805715844259847.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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