COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

[southsider2k5]

4 hours ago, greg775 said:

People think I am scum for being stircrazy and wanting to go to coffee shops that have 2-3 people total in there or bakeries like Panera to work and spend some time. What about these kids partying in Florida? They don't care about corona. It's like there has to be some middle ground. Surprised there's not more outcry with 1/2 of the country's workforce surely to be laid off soon. Businesses are closed, folks ...https://twitter.com/CBSNews/status/1240371160078000128?s=20

I just hope you don't kill anyone else for an overpriced coffee.

[Balta1701]

The “vastly overstressed emergency room” reports are skyrocketing today. This will be a nightmare in the next couple days.

[caulfield12]

Richard Quest on CNN was estimating a $3-4 trillion price tag....for government/taxpayers.

That doesn’t count all those hurt by the roughly 35% fall in equity markets, with a long ways to go now before the absolute bottom.

Imagine the hospitals even 75% where Italy is at now health crisis wise, Boeing and car manufacturers shuttered...2/3rds of American jobs now in service industries.   That’s 10-25% unemployment quite easily.

Eventually, the state unemployment offices will be shuttered, banks closed.  We are approaching our second paycheck (first February 25th, then March 25th) with no salary because the school is claiming they have to physically go into the bank and do it manually.  The credit card company is lenient for now (have to take money out of ATM and physically go into bank to deposit into onto wife’s card.)  All the expenses for two months on there (food deliveries) for four...but we have never failed to pay off full amount but no practical way to pay until banks actually reopen physically and tellers/cashiers are working.  

Edited March 19, 2020 by caulfield12

[greg775]

10 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Dude, a virus doesn't compromise.   This is exactly why Tony said you are uninformed.   ESSENTIAL businesses will continue to function unless something truly catastrophic happens 

sitting in fucking Starbucks because five other people are there isn't essential

I'm just curious though if it's a double-edged sword. I have scoured Lawrence Kansas the past week. Finally Wednesday, every restaurant and coffee shop have been shut down to customers being able to sit inside. Some were slower than others getting the word, but they are all closed except for take out and delivery. Students are gone eight weeks earlier than usual.

Obviously this town as well as all others that have been effectively shut down except for supermarkets and other stores that I guess you can go in and buy stuff then get out will have at least half of its stores close down for good because of lack of customers. Is completely wrecking the economy (will these homeless people need to rob and riot a few weeks from now to get any food at all) worth shutting down so many businesses and wrecking them? The 50 person limit here was fine; it went to 10 after one day. I'm just suggesting economic misery that is about to come (so many people are going to be laid off the next 2 weeks it'll make our heads spin) may not be worth reacting so hardline regarding the virus.

I mean why are the airplanes flying? One flight could sent 50-200 infected people into their towns. I'd bet you that's way more than 10 people in a restaurant or 45 people in a church in Lawrence Kansas.

[caulfield12]

30 minutes ago, greg775 said:

I'm just curious though if it's a double-edged sword. I have scoured Lawrence Kansas the past week. Finally Wednesday, every restaurant and coffee shop have been shut down to customers being able to sit inside. Some were slower than others getting the word, but they are all closed except for take out and delivery. Students are gone eight weeks earlier than usual.

Obviously this town as well as all others that have been effectively shut down except for supermarkets and other stores that I guess you can go in and buy stuff then get out will have at least half of its stores close down for good because of lack of customers. Is completely wrecking the economy (will these homeless people need to rob and riot a few weeks from now to get any food at all) worth shutting down so many businesses and wrecking them? The 50 person limit here was fine; it went to 10 after one day. I'm just suggesting economic misery that is about to come (so many people are going to be laid off the next 2 weeks it'll make our heads spin) may not be worth reacting so hardline regarding the virus.

I mean why are the airplanes flying? One flight could sent 50-200 infected people into their towns. I'd bet you that's way more than 10 people in a restaurant or 45 people in a church in Lawrence Kansas.

The homeless issues are 1000x worse in LA, SF, Seattle, NYC, DC, Florida....right now, roughly 70% of domestic airline routes are currently gone, the majority of international and all but Delta United and Southwest  will go bankrupt or be consolidated.

[greg775]

Guess what folks. Spring break goes on til Monday. Kids are packed on the beaches. Read Twitter you'll see. Think they aren't going to return to a lot of states spreading corona????

Meanwhile blast me for wanting to drink a coffee in some shop with 3 people in it.

Judging from this board and others, all those people on the beaches will be responsible for a TON of misery. Anybody care?

[greg775]

1 hour ago, caulfield12 said:

The homeless issues are 1000x worse in LA, SF, Seattle, NYC, DC, Florida....right now, roughly 70% of domestic airline routes are currently gone, the majority of international and all but Delta United and Southwest  will go bankrupt or be consolidated.

You know flights have been busy up until late last week when all the tournaments got canceled. This is about one week old panic in the USA. These airlines really are pretty brittle since they can't survive a week or two of very little business. Man ... perhaps some of these CEOs will stop making gads of money in the future. But as far as the airlines ... it just takes a week or two to blast them out of business?

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, greg775 said:

You know flights have been busy up until late last week when all the tournaments got canceled. This is about one week old panic in the USA. These airlines really are pretty brittle since they can't survive a week or two of very little business. Man ... perhaps some of these CEOs will stop making gads of money in the future. But as far as the airlines ... it just takes a week or two to blast them out of business?

When they primarily invest influxes of cash flow into buying back stock to enrich executives, board members and executives...they got greedy after these last 10-11 years, neglecting to put the money in a rainy day, so to speak.

Starbucks just did the same thing recently, but Trump will most definitely rescue them.

[bmags]

One - I do think the fact that the airlines are 1) important to the nations infrastructure 2) so often needing bailouts due to external events but 3) also needing bailouts...for incompetence but ge tthem due to 1) ...

 

It makes sense to actually force some strict capital requirements that would limit buy-backs. They need to save more and gov't should include the unions in those discussions I would hope and hold my breath for.

On the flip side:

- I don't particularly like the "bailout" lingo being thrown out now. No company planned for this well, and I struggle to say any should. For acts of god, you have insurance. Perhaps in future we have pandemic insurance...but it's likely a waste of money. 

This is an area where it is the government that should have been the key player in prevention and prep, but it also needs to be the key player in the economic fallout. This is essentially a planned recession at this point, so the gov't should just guarantee payrolls to all that will not lay people off. And for those that already have, fix and make UI more generous ...yesterday!

Yeah I don't want money going to boeing, or united or casinos etc etc. But I DO want money to float the restaurants. I don't want anyone to lose their jobs. Just float it all. Get through this. Allow a snap back. Don't try to just go halfway, end up with 20% unemployment, and then when we start operating as normally, slow the recovery down because you have to re-train and re-match millions of people in the workforce along with the demand shortfall that comes with that.

Just mail the f'n checks, guarantee payday, produce the shit out of masks, and move fast. Be willing to waste money on those that don't need it. I guarantee the debt crisis will NOT be as bad as this or as difficult to solve.

[pcq]

I knew there was a hoax before the pandemic even existed lol. My town now has a shelter in place order but I have to go to the office at least some days. I have enough work for ten people with a staff of four. I always love the Yahoo! posters and they are still working on Deep State theories. Thanks to the Internet we no longer have facts. I hope they don't ban wifely duties because I may be in need. 

[caulfield12]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/florida-governor-refuses-shut-down-215237594.html
 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/ron-johnson-questions-federal-guidance-issued-to-fight-coronavirus-as-cases-and-deaths-rise/ar-BB11o9a3

 

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/rachel-maddow-7-states-coronavirus-100615754.html

Maddow, citing the National Governor’s Association, said Texas, Tennessee, Oklahoma, Missouri, Mississippi, Idaho and Wyoming had not yet implemented statewide measures in response to the public health crisis.

“No state-mandated school closures. No state-mandated limits on large gatherings,” she said. “No state mandates on the operations of businesses like bars and restaurants.”

Maddow noted how, in some places, political leaders had issued “nonbinding recommendations” and “urgings,” which led some local school districts and businesses to take matters into their own hands and shutter of their own accord.

 

[caulfield12]

51 minutes ago, bmags said:

One - I do think the fact that the airlines are 1) important to the nations infrastructure 2) so often needing bailouts due to external events but 3) also needing bailouts...for incompetence but ge tthem due to 1) ...

 

It makes sense to actually force some strict capital requirements that would limit buy-backs. They need to save more and gov't should include the unions in those discussions I would hope and hold my breath for.

On the flip side:

- I don't particularly like the "bailout" lingo being thrown out now. No company planned for this well, and I struggle to say any should. For acts of god, you have insurance. Perhaps in future we have pandemic insurance...but it's likely a waste of money. 

This is an area where it is the government that should have been the key player in prevention and prep, but it also needs to be the key player in the economic fallout. This is essentially a planned recession at this point, so the gov't should just guarantee payrolls to all that will not lay people off. And for those that already have, fix and make UI more generous ...yesterday!

Yeah I don't want money going to boeing, or united or casinos etc etc. But I DO want money to float the restaurants. I don't want anyone to lose their jobs. Just float it all. Get through this. Allow a snap back. Don't try to just go halfway, end up with 20% unemployment, and then when we start operating as normally, slow the recovery down because you have to re-train and re-match millions of people in the workforce along with the demand shortfall that comes with that.

Just mail the f'n checks, guarantee payday, produce the shit out of masks, and move fast. Be willing to waste money on those that don't need it. I guarantee the debt crisis will NOT be as bad as this or as difficult to solve.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/m/d1bc74bc-c2c2-3b76-ae26-257baaa99b61/jim-cramer-praises-mark.html
Cuban, love him or hate him, has a lot of the sane ideas...seemingly.

That’s $114 billion for Boeing and the airline industry bailouts, if we’re keeping score.

Or $877 each for 130 million American families.  It’s a start.  Chop off the richest ones, make it $1000-2000.

The cost of 10-25% unemployment for 6+ months is going to be in the additional trillions in bankrupted companies and 401k/IRA losses.

Edited March 19, 2020 by caulfield12

[bmags]

47 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/m/d1bc74bc-c2c2-3b76-ae26-257baaa99b61/jim-cramer-praises-mark.html
Cuban, love him or hate him, has a lot of the sane ideas...seemingly.

That’s $114 billion for Boeing and the airline industry bailouts, if we’re keeping score.

Or $877 each for 130 million American families.  It’s a start.  Chop off the richest ones, make it $1000-2000.

The cost of 10-25% unemployment for 6+ months is going to be in the additional trillions in bankrupted companies and 401k/IRA losses.

Cutting a check is good, but doing what you can to encourage labor hoarding + extremely generous UI during this downturn + directing underutilized labor to manufacturing shortages is much better

[turnin' two]

On 3/16/2020 at 8:00 PM, SoxAce said:

I went out last night. Pray for me guys.

How about everyone pounding Greg, but just letting this go.

[southsider2k5]

8 hours ago, greg775 said:

Guess what folks. Spring break goes on til Monday. Kids are packed on the beaches. Read Twitter you'll see. Think they aren't going to return to a lot of states spreading corona????

Meanwhile blast me for wanting to drink a coffee in some shop with 3 people in it.

Judging from this board and others, all those people on the beaches will be responsible for a TON of misery. Anybody care?

Your ignorance does not excuse the ignorance of others, or vice versa.  If you want to live life with your head firmly planted where the sun doesn't shine, that is your prerogative, but don't come here expecting sympathy or praise for that ignorance.  I feel like I am talking to my 12 year old, but take responsibility for your own actions and quit looking to justify them by the stupidity of others, unless you want to live life as a lowest common denominator.

[StrangeSox]

11 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

We will be at 10% instantly. 

Have no idea how JP Morgan is predicted only 6.5% unemployment later this year with 8% recovery starting in Q3

[southsider2k5]

Just now, StrangeSox said:

Have no idea how JP Morgan is predicted only 6.5% unemployment later this year with 8% recovery starting in Q3

Just yesterday the restaurant industry predicted losses of $225 billion and the loss of 5 to 7 million jobs in the next 3 months.  The Hotel lobby is predicting 4 million job losses.  We haven't even gotten to retail, travel, or entertainment, or any of the job losses that will result from initial job losses.  The initial filing numbers have exploded already.  I said 10%, but I might even be a bit light.  We are looking at a 10 to 15% contraction in GDP when all is said and done.  With the deflationary cycle we are seeing, on top of the job losses and market crash, the initial stages of this look more like 1929 than 2008.

[Jack Parkman]

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/19/health/coronavirus-age-victims/index.html

20% of hospitalizations and 12% of ICU visits are between the ages of 20-44. 

It seems nobody is safe from this except kids. 

Edited March 19, 2020 by Jack Parkman

[bmags]

I am hopeful that the success of the US in reducing smoking helps in the mortality rates here. In south korea, more women were getting infected then men, but women had a smoking rate of only 5% in south korea, which hopefully is a contributing factor to their low mortality rates (aside from not getting overrun in hospitals).

US has a higher female percentage that smokes, but overall is about 10% lower than italy or south korea. Let's hope.

[Iwritecode]

9 hours ago, greg775 said:

Guess what folks. Spring break goes on til Monday. Kids are packed on the beaches. Read Twitter you'll see. Think they aren't going to return to a lot of states spreading corona????

Meanwhile blast me for wanting to drink a coffee in some shop with 3 people in it.

Judging from this board and others, all those people on the beaches will be responsible for a TON of misery. Anybody care?

Obviously the 2 that responded directly to your post do.

17 hours ago, mqr said:

Those kids....are dipshits

 

17 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

 

They will literally get people killed and they will be the reason that the government will have no choice in a few days but to enforce much more harsh mandatory quarantines.

 

[Balta1701]

57 minutes ago, bmags said:

I am hopeful that the success of the US in reducing smoking helps in the mortality rates here. In south korea, more women were getting infected then men, but women had a smoking rate of only 5% in south korea, which hopefully is a contributing factor to their low mortality rates (aside from not getting overrun in hospitals).

US has a higher female percentage that smokes, but overall is about 10% lower than italy or south korea. Let's hope.

How good is data connecting this to smoking? One of the other things I've seen is statistics suggesting that in this country, men also, um, are worse at washing their hands. 

[bmags]

40 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

How good is data connecting this to smoking? One of the other things I've seen is statistics suggesting that in this country, men also, um, are worse at washing their hands. 

I don't think we'll have good data for a while. All correlations now.

[Steve9347]

Fuck this shit.

That is all.

[turnin' two]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

How good is data connecting this to smoking? One of the other things I've seen is statistics suggesting that in this country, men also, um, are worse at washing their hands. 

It makes a lot of sense though right?  It is attacking the lungs, anyone with reduced lung capacity would likely be a higher risk or worse outcomes.   Those dots seem to easily to connect.

[Balta1701]

6 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

It makes a lot of sense though right?  It is attacking the lungs, anyone with reduced lung capacity would likely be a higher risk or worse outcomes.   Those dots seem to easily to connect.

While that part is true, you also have women with higher rates of and more severe cases of asthma, so you've got multiple factors stacking on top of one another (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4572514/).