COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

[bmags]

4 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

I'll just make it clear - we are in a pandemic - there is zero excuse for this to not be a 7 day a week 24/7 type of thing. Period.  If I could get my vaccine at 3 AM - I would get my vaccine.  

It's mind boggling. Wouldn't be so bad if it was just a REPORTING lag, but unless it's a very smooth lag where Monday-Friday are elevated equally it does not appear that we get a big back log on monday. Also I'm sure it's obvious but the numbers above are from IL.

And what makes me even more crazy is the eligible groups right now are for places (long term care, hospitals) that are 24/7 anyway!

 

[bmags]

1 minute ago, Chisoxfn said:

It shouldn't be political.  I get Affordable Care act and the political aspect of that - but coronavirus should never have been as political as it was made to be.  And the politicans should have all been big boys & girls as it related to that (even if the president was unable to - the rest of them should have been able to).  Period - no excuse.  

It's "political" in that it's the prototypical collective action problem.

[Chisoxfn]

Just now, bmags said:

It's mind boggling. Wouldn't be so bad if it was just a REPORTING lag, but unless it's a very smooth lag where Monday-Friday are elevated equally it does not appear that we get a big back log on monday. Also I'm sure it's obvious but the numbers above are from IL.

And what makes me even more crazy is the eligible groups right now are for places (long term care, hospitals) that are 24/7 anyway!

 

And I know those were just IL numbers - but literally across the country this should be a wartime effort - like literally no excuse.  GET IT DONE.  

[CentralChamps21]

1 minute ago, Chisoxfn said:

It shouldn't be political.  I get Affordable Care act and the political aspect of that - but coronavirus should never have been as political as it was made to be.  And the politicans should have all been big boys & girls as it related to that (even if the president was unable to - the rest of them should have been able to).  Period - no excuse.  

It became political because the scientifically sensible course of action in combating the virus would have a negative impact on the stock market and the President's entire view of his own self worth and his re-election chances were based on the performance of the markets.

[StrangeSox]

8 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said:

It shouldn't be political.  I get Affordable Care act and the political aspect of that - but coronavirus should never have been as political as it was made to be.  And the politicans should have all been big boys & girls as it related to that (even if the president was unable to - the rest of them should have been able to).  Period - no excuse.  

Public health policy is inherently a political decision, though. It's the balancing of a variety of public interests. The determination of what's important and how important it is is political. The decisions are made by politicians or their appointees.

You can say it shouldn't be partisan, and I'd agree with that. But public policy will always include a degree of politics within it.

I know this is a little pedantic but I think it's important to recognize when there's an element of political decision-making to something that can't ever really be removed.\

edit: this is a big part of it, too. You can't address a public health crisis with individual-focused efforts. 

6 minutes ago, bmags said:

It's "political" in that it's the prototypical collective action problem.

Edited January 22, 2021 by StrangeSox

[StrangeSox]

8 minutes ago, bmags said:

It's mind boggling. Wouldn't be so bad if it was just a REPORTING lag, but unless it's a very smooth lag where Monday-Friday are elevated equally it does not appear that we get a big back log on monday. Also I'm sure it's obvious but the numbers above are from IL.

And what makes me even more crazy is the eligible groups right now are for places (long term care, hospitals) that are 24/7 anyway!

 

CVS and Walgreens are sitting on millions of doses across the country and can't be bothered to speed things up, which holds the line up for everyone. My father-in-law runs a level of local government in Illinois and offered up his building to the county health department as a vaccination clinic site in December. Today's the first day they started.

 

West Virginia is the only state that didn't partner with CVS/Walgreens because there aren't many there. Instead, they relied on existing partnerships with local pharmacies, and they're leading the country. They have 0.9 long-term care/nursing homes per every pharmacy that's vaccinating. Walgreens and CVS have 25.

Edited January 22, 2021 by StrangeSox

[bmags]

13 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

CVS and Walgreens are sitting on millions of doses across the country and can't be bothered to speed things up, which holds the line up for everyone. My father-in-law runs a level of local government in Illinois and offered up his building to the county health department as a vaccination clinic site in December. Today's the first day they started.

 

West Virginia is the only state that didn't partner with CVS/Walgreens because there aren't many there. Instead, they relied on existing partnerships with local pharmacies, and they're leading the country. They have 0.9 long-term care/nursing homes per every pharmacy that's vaccinating. Walgreens and CVS have 25.

Illinois separates the LTC doses and the state is only at 40% of their allocation. The LTC is worse, but look at this line from the oak park lead on vaccinations:

 “As the pool of those eligible to be vaccinated grows, individuals will have to be patient as we methodically work through the state phases and the intricate guidelines within them. 

this town is 1 mile wide!

They are lucky half this town works at a hospital and getting vaccinated through there. They wouldn't be able to vaccinate that many with 4 years time otherwise.

[shipps]

Sooooooooooo is the South African variant going to be our "we might be totally f'd" moment?

[StrangeSox]

20 minutes ago, shipps said:

Sooooooooooo is the South African variant going to be our "we might be totally f'd" moment?

Concerning signs of antibody evasion in lab conditions, but it remains to be seen what the impact is in actual bodies with t-cells and other immune system components.

[shipps]

3 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Concerning signs of antibody evasion in lab conditions, but it remains to be seen what the impact is in actual bodies with t-cells and other immune system components.

Yeah I am just hoping what I am reading about it right now is just fear mongering and not actually going to be proven as true.

I mean, if its going to be more contagious, more deadly AND cut the vaccine efficacy 50% we are totally f'd.

 

[bmags]

23 minutes ago, shipps said:

Sooooooooooo is the South African variant going to be our "we might be totally f'd" moment?

I think unless we see that severe cases occur post vaccination I'm not too worried. If all that happens is we solve 99% of all covid cases sending people to the hospital, that seems like a win, and then hopefully we crush the virus in next update.

[CentralChamps21]

53 minutes ago, shipps said:

Sooooooooooo is the South African variant going to be our "we might be totally f'd" moment?

Why did we ever start allowing international travel after it was initially shut down?

[StrangeSox]

31 minutes ago, bmags said:

I think unless we see that severe cases occur post vaccination I'm not too worried. If all that happens is we solve 99% of all covid cases sending people to the hospital, that seems like a win, and then hopefully we crush the virus in next update.

Problem is we have an action-movie like race to see how many people we can get vaccinated before the superspreading variant(s) take hold by March. The situation in LA county right now is pretty dire. If the UK, SA, and Brazil/Japan variants really do kick up R0 by .4-.7, we're all going to be in bad shape again well before we make a significant dent with vaccinations.

 

Indoor dining and drinking reopened in Region 7 today, though.

[Texsox]

So my school district is partnering with a large medical company here and trying to begin a vaccination plan. The plan is to systematically vaccinate everyone. Ok,  sounds like a good goal. The challenge is they really don't have all the information. 

Age?  Check. 100%

Contact with students? Mostly but not 100%. 

Underlying medical conditions?  0% and unless people volunteer the information the district can't know. 

So who do you vaccinate first? A 66 year old high school teacher who has almost zero contact with students or a 35 year old elementary school teacher who sees 15 kids every day? Where does a 60 year old high school teacher who sees about 2 students a week in the classroom, but 50 a week on the golf course fits. Who btw has cancer?  Remember it's the school district's input based on the number of vaccines they are obtaining each week. 

I'm glad I'm not making the decision. I'm also glad my admin is pushing for me. 

 

 

[CentralChamps21]

Well, Biden only has six weeks to get anything done, because according to QAnon, he is getting deposed and Trump re-inaugurated on March 4.

I wish I was kidding.

[shipps]

29 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Problem is we have an action-movie like race to see how many people we can get vaccinated before the superspreading variant(s) take hold by March. The situation in LA county right now is pretty dire. If the UK, SA, and Brazil/Japan variants really do kick up R0 by .4-.7, we're all going to be in bad shape again well before we make a significant dent with vaccinations.

 

Indoor dining and drinking reopened in Region 7 today, though.

I swear this nightmare just never ends. Just when you think that we are turning a corner then we get some doomsday news.

[StrangeSox]

12 minutes ago, Texsox said:

So my school district is partnering with a large medical company here and trying to begin a vaccination plan. The plan is to systematically vaccinate everyone. Ok,  sounds like a good goal. The challenge is they really don't have all the information. 

Age?  Check. 100%

Contact with students? Mostly but not 100%. 

Underlying medical conditions?  0% and unless people volunteer the information the district can't know. 

So who do you vaccinate first? A 66 year old high school teacher who has almost zero contact with students or a 35 year old elementary school teacher who sees 15 kids every day? Where does a 60 year old high school teacher who sees about 2 students a week in the classroom, but 50 a week on the golf course fits. Who btw has cancer?  Remember it's the school district's input based on the number of vaccines they are obtaining each week. 

I'm glad I'm not making the decision. I'm also glad my admin is pushing for me. 

 

 

My wife's district started this week with the custodial staff.

 

Otherwise, hell, random lottery if it means the line moves fast rather than slow/not at all.

[Texsox]

9 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

My wife's district started this week with the custodial staff.

 

Otherwise, hell, random lottery if it means the line moves fast rather than slow/not at all.

They made it clear that when you are called, if you accept, you better be there for the vaccine.

My assistant coach's mom went to one of the big vaccination locations here at the end of each day. They would line everyone up by age who did not have an appointment and gave out shots until all were gone. Her mom is 72 and never made it to the front of the line. Her dad at 80 received it on on the second or third day they went. Mom finally received one through her doctor today. 

We literally had months to be ready for this moment. I understand we've never really experienced anything like this before and if we need to ever do this again, we'll do better. But this is a prime example of where private medical care just fails. This is a giant public health issue and required a giant public (government) response. I don't believe a new administration can fix this in a week or a month, but I really hope by May we have a coordinated response. I have a lot more faith in Biden's approach than anything the denier in chief could come up with. 

It seems that despite a few widely publicized cases almost all of the vaccine is getting into arms but for patients hours on the phone, standing in line, or hitting refresh isn't efficient. 

[StrangeSox]

We have done this before, though:

https://magazine.uc.edu/issues/0408/on_campus.html

But unfortunately most of our public institutions have been increasingly hollowed out since at least the 80's.

 

A slight majority of vaccines are still sitting on shelves in freezers right now. Check the "% supply used" map. Things do seem to be picking up slowly, though.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribution/

 

 

[caulfield12]

4 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

CVS and Walgreens are sitting on millions of doses across the country and can't be bothered to speed things up, which holds the line up for everyone. My father-in-law runs a level of local government in Illinois and offered up his building to the county health department as a vaccination clinic site in December. Today's the first day they started.

 

West Virginia is the only state that didn't partner with CVS/Walgreens because there aren't many there. Instead, they relied on existing partnerships with local pharmacies, and they're leading the country. They have 0.9 long-term care/nursing homes per every pharmacy that's vaccinating. Walgreens and CVS have 25.

If only we could run the government like a business and create more competition...!!!

Well, we created a monopoly, or, at the very least, an oligopoly.  War-time footing requires government intervention, and aspirational leadership, not bean counters from accounting who don’t want to be troubled to work on weekends. 
 

It’s ironic, because those community health pharmacies in WV adopted localized solutions, since they already had or maintain longterm relationships with their nursing homes and don’t want to jeopardize them...and they actually know and care about those residents, they’re not just numbers on a spreadsheet.

In the end, the supposed “trust” in the vaccine those brand-names companies were supposed to create is destabilizing the system, because their performance has been so inept.

If they hadn’t guaranteed those contracts...well, you only have to go back to the Theranos case to see how greed/profit is the primary driver for corporate pharmacies.

Edited January 23, 2021 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

I’ll play along with Tex.

Thank god we can borrow what looks like $7 trillion ($30 trillion plus, overall) and still maintain the dollar’s status as the world’s reserve currency...at a very low inflation/interest rate for refinancing such debt.

Many countries either can’t afford or are refusing (China) to subsidize individuals and small businesses with cash payments for philosophical reasons.

 

Mr Taweep Mee Phan who took to Facebook out of desperation offering to sell one of his eyes. Photo: Chalong Municipality

PHUKET:-- A man who has been severely affected by the COVID-19 fallout took to social media in desperation last week offering to sell one of his eyes.

Mr Taweep Mee Phan, 57, from Chalong posted on his Facebook account last Friday (Jan 15) that he was willing to sell his left eye to raise much needed funds to support his family.

Mr Taweep was a bus driver for a Chinese tour company for 15 years before losing his job last February when tourists numbers visiting the island dried up.

Full Story: https://www.thephuketnews.com/struck-poor-by-covid-phuket-man-tries-to-sell-eye-on-facebook-78693.php

 

 

[Texsox]

7 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

I’ll play along with Tex.

Thank god we can borrow what looks like $7 trillion ($30 trillion plus, overall) and still maintain the dollar’s status as the world’s reserve currency...at a very low inflation/interest rate for refinancing such debt.

Many countries either can’t afford or are refusing (China) to subsidize individuals and small businesses with cash payments for philosophical reasons.

 

Mr Taweep Mee Phan who took to Facebook out of desperation offering to sell one of his eyes. Photo: Chalong Municipality

PHUKET:-- A man who has been severely affected by the COVID-19 fallout took to social media in desperation last week offering to sell one of his eyes.

Mr Taweep Mee Phan, 57, from Chalong posted on his Facebook account last Friday (Jan 15) that he was willing to sell his left eye to raise much needed funds to support his family.

Mr Taweep was a bus driver for a Chinese tour company for 15 years before losing his job last February when tourists numbers visiting the island dried up.

Full Story: https://www.thephuketnews.com/struck-poor-by-covid-phuket-man-tries-to-sell-eye-on-facebook-78693.php

 

 

What was this in reply to? I'm a bit lost. 

[Texsox]

2 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

We have done this before, though:

https://magazine.uc.edu/issues/0408/on_campus.html

But unfortunately most of our public institutions have been increasingly hollowed out since at least the 80's.

 

A slight majority of vaccines are still sitting on shelves in freezers right now. Check the "% supply used" map. Things do seem to be picking up slowly, though.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribution/

 

 

Hmm. Seems like they need to open more distribution sites then. All of them here seem to be injecting as fast as they can with the available space. I haven't heard of any being left out to be destroyed in a while. 

I was thinking polio and I do remember receiving the vaccine at school. Thank you for the historical account. I was using my own experience where only kids needed to be vaccinated. I didn't pause to realize at one point adults needed it also. I wonder why we aren't using churches today?

[caulfield12]

12 minutes ago, Texsox said:

What was this in reply to? I'm a bit lost. 

General liberal thankfulness for something about America, that we’re helping our people directly during the pandemic.

That said, we reserve the right to complain in the future when/if inflation rates finally rise to 5% or more and we have to make huge cutbacks at every level of government due to increased interest payments on bonds soaking up more and more budget outlay on those pie charts.

Edited January 23, 2021 by caulfield12

[caulfield12]

16 minutes ago, Texsox said:

Hmm. Seems like they need to open more distribution sites then. All of them here seem to be injecting as fast as they can with the available space. I haven't heard of any being left out to be destroyed in a while. 

I was thinking polio and I do remember receiving the vaccine at school. Thank you for the historical account. I was using my own experience where only kids needed to be vaccinated. I didn't pause to realize at one point adults needed it also. I wonder why we aren't using churches today?

Isn’t there a certain degree of fear in the religious right about vaccine efficacy?   At one point, roughly 2-3 months ago, only 55-60% of Americans were willing to be injected.  I don’t know where the anti-vaxxers line starts and crosses over into religious belief, but there’s probably some cross pollination.

All things considered, schools, convention centers, basketball stadiums, community centers would seem better suited.   
 

LA County just announced they expect it to take all of 2021 to get everyone vaccinated.  Ouch!

Edited January 23, 2021 by caulfield12