greg775 Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) On 2/15/2021 at 1:39 PM, Harry Chappas said: I really do not get the whole non-masking thing. What is the issue with wearing a mask it is the height of stupidity. I find it insanely baffling. I wear my mask every day, everywhere and hope it has protected me. I did finally catch a vicious cough/cold two weeks ago just as the daily barrage of temperatures in the single digits hit. That baffled me as to how I caught it with the mask on my face all day all the time. ... As far as issues some have with wearing a mask ... here's my unsolicited speculation. This has been going on a long time (a full year) and no doubt the "science" has been questioned by some. No doubt politics has infiltrated this pandemic all the way (Cuomo, Trump, individual governors etc, caught in the act of dining out while not wearing masks themselves). Some people just are fed up at some of the science they consider nonsense, especially when the word came out that "two masks are better than one. wear two masks." I think some people wanted to punch a wall when they heard that one. Just my speculation. I know as with most issues nowadays there's no tolerance for anybody's opinion if it differs from yours (not you Harry, speaking in generls). I wear my mask. I love my mask. I wash my masks and hand dry them. If I see someone without a mask I head the other way or way way around them. My health update: Since last March, one full year, have caught one severe cough/cold; so far still no COVID has penetrated my mask/system; knock on wood. Edited February 18, 2021 by greg775 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iwritecode Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Texsox said: https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/17/business/kroger-closing-grocery-workers-hazard-pay/index.html Record profits. Share buy back. But can't pay their employees hazard pay. It's really weird how millionaires and billionaires really like their money and if you try to force them to give some of it up and give it to their workers they find ways to not do that. Who'd thunk it? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 minute ago, Iwritecode said: It's really weird how millionaires and billionaires really like their money and if you try to force them to give some of it up and give it to their workers they find ways to not do that. Who'd thunk it? I feel like I'm watching Atlas Shrugged played out in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoUEvenShift Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 https://www.wsj.com/articles/well-have-herd-immunity-by-april-11613669731 April 1 sounds good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 19, 2021 Share Posted February 19, 2021 On 1/27/2020 at 10:34 PM, soxfan49 said: 5x more popular there than the US even? I guess rape-n-pay isn't as frowned upon there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Friday afternoon appointment for the vaccine. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 On 2/19/2021 at 9:16 AM, southsider2k5 said: It's very frustrating right now, because for nearly a year we've heard that a vaccine is our only real way out of this. Now we have two approved and another close, and we truly are on the road to getting out of it. But the media, at least some of the media, is focusing on the bad instead of the good. And we're getting conflicting information every day. I understand not wanting to be all sunshine and rainbows and saying we'll be back to normal in a month. But the headlines we see pick out the cautious points and make them the most prominent. I saw an article yesterday with the headline saying we'll be wearing masks into 2022. But upon reading the article, that's a worst case scenario if the variants end up being resistant to the vaccines. The data, the real data, is showing that the vaccines are very effective against severe infection and will drastically reduce deaths and hospitalizations. And this is what we've wanted, what we've been told we need to start getting back to normal. Being cautious is one thing, but publishing articles and opinions with misleading headlines is irresponsible. No wonder there's mistrust and confusion about the vaccines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 20 minutes ago, hogan873 said: It's very frustrating right now, because for nearly a year we've heard that a vaccine is our only real way out of this. Now we have two approved and another close, and we truly are on the road to getting out of it. But the media, at least some of the media, is focusing on the bad instead of the good. And we're getting conflicting information every day. I understand not wanting to be all sunshine and rainbows and saying we'll be back to normal in a month. But the headlines we see pick out the cautious points and make them the most prominent. I saw an article yesterday with the headline saying we'll be wearing masks into 2022. But upon reading the article, that's a worst case scenario if the variants end up being resistant to the vaccines. The data, the real data, is showing that the vaccines are very effective against severe infection and will drastically reduce deaths and hospitalizations. And this is what we've wanted, what we've been told we need to start getting back to normal. Being cautious is one thing, but publishing articles and opinions with misleading headlines is irresponsible. No wonder there's mistrust and confusion about the vaccines. Some of this may be scientists being overly cautious, I will grant that. But I will note what the risk is right now, the risk is all still on the side of increased spreading - today, we have way more people who are waiting to get the vaccine than have been vaccinated so far. If the handful of people who have gotten their shots are going out maskless, picking up the virus, not showing symptoms, but transmitting it - they could become a major way that the virus could resume spreading in the unvaccinated group. Furthermore, vaccinated people who get weak cases of the virus could be a great way for the virus to evolve resistance to the vaccine response - the virus didn't see any pressure to evolve that ability until there was a vaccinated population where having that trait would improve its fitness. We've got a line that is what, 3-4 months long already? We're also seeing that vaccine acceptance is increasing as more and more people get it. I almost am ok with people being overly cautious right now rather than accidentally evolving a truly resistant variant. When we get to 70% of the population vaccinated and it gets more difficult to get the last 30%, then maybe we worry about how much of a problem we've created. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 hour ago, hogan873 said: It's very frustrating right now, because for nearly a year we've heard that a vaccine is our only real way out of this. Now we have two approved and another close, and we truly are on the road to getting out of it. But the media, at least some of the media, is focusing on the bad instead of the good. And we're getting conflicting information every day. I understand not wanting to be all sunshine and rainbows and saying we'll be back to normal in a month. But the headlines we see pick out the cautious points and make them the most prominent. I saw an article yesterday with the headline saying we'll be wearing masks into 2022. But upon reading the article, that's a worst case scenario if the variants end up being resistant to the vaccines. The data, the real data, is showing that the vaccines are very effective against severe infection and will drastically reduce deaths and hospitalizations. And this is what we've wanted, what we've been told we need to start getting back to normal. Being cautious is one thing, but publishing articles and opinions with misleading headlines is irresponsible. No wonder there's mistrust and confusion about the vaccines. I think as balta said the reality is currently we are still in a moment where a spike could happen. But I also think the tendency to not want to walk back if things get worse is over emphasizing spread scenarios in the future. I think if you were to be super simple and ask if I'm more bullish on this summer being joyful and social and mostly back to normal I am probably way more bullish than what you see. But, yeah, like I wouldn't still go to a conference. I'd be more likely to go to a concert in millenium park than go to the empty bottle again (maybe next fall). And I think that gets simplified to is that back to "normal", and the answer is no that's not normal. But is it back to normal in that I feel 100% confident I will have gotten a vaccine by May and in July I could find a vaccinated babysitter to watch my kids while we go to a restaurant for my birthday with my friends? Hell yes! And I think others would feel weird saying May, but pretty much anyone I know that has been trying hard to get a vaccine in the current risk ranges has gotten one. And I am very good at that stuff man. It is a useless fucking talent for 99% of my life but it will pay off here. And in other news, this week we'll get more J&J news. And the news about resistance post-1 shot continues to be great. And the Israel news on preventing spread was great news. And I mean...what is the novavax schedule? Anyway march is going to be a great month where most of us that have been on pins and needles with some vulnerable family members finally see them all covered with 1 shot, which covers them better than we previously thought. And then we'll be complaining about when the stories of "people choosing not to get shots" goes into overdrive as it moves from supply issues to demand issues. But bring it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 On 2/18/2021 at 2:27 PM, Iwritecode said: It's really weird how millionaires and billionaires really like their money and if you try to force them to give some of it up and give it to their workers they find ways to not do that. Who'd thunk it? I think in context you need to look at the hazard pay as a total benefit package. Are they offering their employees a full benefit package with health coverage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Parents are scheduled for Wednesday in Arizona. I'm scheduled for Thursday in New York. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iwritecode Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said: I think in context you need to look at the hazard pay as a total benefit package. Are they offering their employees a full benefit package with health coverage? I have no idea. I would assume they are to their FT employees? My point was more along the line of it being extremely difficult to get employers to raise the wages of their employees for any reason at all. It's why the fight for 15 has been going on for like 10 years now. Could many of them pay their employees that much? Probably. It might mean they only make $2.5 billion instead of $2.6 billion though. Will they though? Not likely. At least not without being dragged kicking and screaming into it. Edited February 22, 2021 by Iwritecode 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 50 minutes ago, bmags said: I think as balta said the reality is currently we are still in a moment where a spike could happen. But I also think the tendency to not want to walk back if things get worse is over emphasizing spread scenarios in the future. I think if you were to be super simple and ask if I'm more bullish on this summer being joyful and social and mostly back to normal I am probably way more bullish than what you see. But, yeah, like I wouldn't still go to a conference. I'd be more likely to go to a concert in millenium park than go to the empty bottle again (maybe next fall). And I think that gets simplified to is that back to "normal", and the answer is no that's not normal. But is it back to normal in that I feel 100% confident I will have gotten a vaccine by May and in July I could find a vaccinated babysitter to watch my kids while we go to a restaurant for my birthday with my friends? Hell yes! And I think others would feel weird saying May, but pretty much anyone I know that has been trying hard to get a vaccine in the current risk ranges has gotten one. And I am very good at that stuff man. It is a useless fucking talent for 99% of my life but it will pay off here. And in other news, this week we'll get more J&J news. And the news about resistance post-1 shot continues to be great. And the Israel news on preventing spread was great news. And I mean...what is the novavax schedule? Anyway march is going to be a great month where most of us that have been on pins and needles with some vulnerable family members finally see them all covered with 1 shot, which covers them better than we previously thought. And then we'll be complaining about when the stories of "people choosing not to get shots" goes into overdrive as it moves from supply issues to demand issues. But bring it on. I agree that March should be a big month, especially with the J&J vaccine likely becoming available. Right now, there are 1.75MM people getting a shot each day. That number should increase, and as we go into March we should be seeing over 2 million a day. That, coupled with the positivity rate continuing to drop, should allow us to feel better and better. Hopefully the vaccines continue to perform well against the variants and more people commit to getting the vaccine. I get my second Pfizer shot in two weeks, my wife (who works with students) gets her second shot next week, and my oldest (a nursing student) has had both shots. My in-laws, who we see regularly are getting their shots, and my parents, who live in NC are getting their second shot this week. I know that my story isn't unique. More and more people are getting the vaccines, and we should see even more of this happening as we go into March. I don't plan on ditching the mask, but I feel better every day hearing the success stories. Remember how we felt last summer and fall. For me, at least, there was a huge sense of dread. Now there's a sense of hope. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 minute ago, hogan873 said: I agree that March should be a big month, especially with the J&J vaccine likely becoming available. Right now, there are 1.75MM people getting a shot each day. That number should increase, and as we go into March we should be seeing over 2 million a day. That, coupled with the positivity rate continuing to drop, should allow us to feel better and better. Hopefully the vaccines continue to perform well against the variants and more people commit to getting the vaccine. I get my second Pfizer shot in two weeks, my wife (who works with students) gets her second shot next week, and my oldest (a nursing student) has had both shots. My in-laws, who we see regularly are getting their shots, and my parents, who live in NC are getting their second shot this week. I know that my story isn't unique. More and more people are getting the vaccines, and we should see even more of this happening as we go into March. I don't plan on ditching the mask, but I feel better every day hearing the success stories. Remember how we felt last summer and fall. For me, at least, there was a huge sense of dread. Now there's a sense of hope. Similar boat. In-laws in IL got shots in Jan. Mom/Grandparents in SC got shots in late Jan/early feb for one due to foodborne illness delaying. My dad in NC not getting it until this week, though he thought initially mid-march. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 3 minutes ago, hogan873 said: I don't plan on ditching the mask, but I feel better every day hearing the success stories. Remember how we felt last summer and fall. For me, at least, there was a huge sense of dread. Now there's a sense of hope. Right now I'm in "police officer on TV show 2 days before retirement" mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 1 minute ago, Balta1701 said: Right now I'm in "police officer on TV show 2 days before retirement" mode. My parents have been going out to eat a lot and every now and then let it slip how reckless they've been, such as hanging out with a friend all the time. If they were in a pod, I wouldn't care, but it becomes clearer and clearer that they aren't, because they're around their friend's grandchildren. Who go to school. Or they see another friend. I could go on. On Saturday my dad told me "made it" and was "three days away" from the finish line (their shots are scheduled at 2 A.M. Wednesday, but he was counting it as Tuesday for all intents and purposes). I told him he's forgetting about the second shot and that he sounds like every police office that's two days from retirement. I'm glad they're getting the vaccine, but it's really damaged our relationship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 I have a banquet hall booked for April 1st that holds 250 people. Only vaccinated people will get it. I have a band booked. It should be epic. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/02/20/us/us-herd-immunity-covid.html? Looking at this model of when we may reach herd immunity is the first thing to give me any semblance of hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 The initial reports of blocking infection/transmission out of Israel is probably the best news yet on the vaccine front. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 8 minutes ago, StrangeSox said: The initial reports of blocking infection/transmission out of Israel is probably the best news yet on the vaccine front. By far. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 Illinois actually reported a lot yesterday (nearly 60k) which I don't really know what that means because last week was so crazy but I'm glad this week should be back to business as usual in terms of monitoring and hoping we can get above that 60k/7-day avg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 So when I see efficacy of 99% in terms of preventing death. I want to ask the smart people on here, most notably Balta, to make sure my simple head intreprets it correctly. Note - the below are my own made up #'s for simplicity. But if we had 99% efficacy in terms of preventing death - in my simple head that is comparing death rates with vaccine to normal death rates. So lets just say my sample is 500K or so deaths (roughly the US). Does that essentially mean if we were all vaccinated (and all else being equal that we haven't added another variable that were to change the curve/dynamics) that instead of 500K deaths from COVID - we would essentially be at 5000 deaths (500K x .01%). Or if instead of using raw numbers - I used a death rate of 1.5% for COVID (pre-vaccine) does that mean the 99% would convert my post vaccine death rate to .015% (99%). Again - using simple raw numbers - but wanted to make sure I have the concept applied correctly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 (edited) On 2/18/2021 at 2:30 PM, Texsox said: I feel like I'm watching Atlas Shrugged played out in real life. You're surprised? Atlas Shrugged has been the goal of American society since Reagan. Edited February 22, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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