COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

[default]

16 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

It's actually not that ridiculous. 

That article that Caufield posted claims that a more realistic timeframe for a vaccine that is safe and effective is 12-18 YEARS, not 12-18 months. 

If that's the case, then what can possibly be done other than to accept mass casualties from this thing?

It is what it is. 

If social distancing measures are the only thing keeping it from running rampant, than it appears we have two choices: 

Either social distance until they figure it out, or......just accept the loss of life. 

Maybe just learn to enjoy TODAY.

[StrangeSox]

Today we learned the more optimistic White House estimates are 100-200 thousand dead Americans in the next couple of months.

 

 

Far cry from it's all under control.

[Quin]

Just want everyone to know 100,000 - 200,00 Americans dead is considered "reasonable" now.

[StrangeSox]

Just now, Quin said:

Just want everyone to know 100,000 - 200,00 Americans dead is considered "reasonable" now.

15 total cases, going to drop to zero soon!

[caulfield12]

38 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Annnnnd none of those things are really comparable to any of the other things.  

Sure, but just trying to put some scope or scale to the overall numbers.

Invariably, someone will then bring up the common flu, automobile accidents, etc.

 

The biggest point that differentiates this is we’re potentially talking about 100,000+ lives a matter of 2-3 months, versus the course of a full year, with overwhelmed health care system and no vaccine or cure.  That’s the reality.

[caulfield12]

6 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Today we learned the more optimistic White House estimates are 100-200 thousand dead Americans in the next couple of months.

 

 

Far cry from it's all under control.

A reporter quickly picked up on this because they seemed afraid to say it aloud.

The chart actually said 200-240,000 on the high end, with a potential or anticipated 10-15 more NY/NJ situations popping up in major metropolitan areas, moving from east to west.  Interestingly, VA and DC were 45 days out for peak.  CA around May 1st.

Even at the epicenter in NYC, the expert projections (five total) range from 7-21 days with 14 being the average for hitting the peak right around Easter Sunday or the first couple of days afterward. 

Edited March 31, 2020 by caulfield12

[Moan4Yoan]

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

The whole idea is absurd.  I mean if China really wanted to sabatoge the West, why wouldn't they plant an illness IN THE WEST!?!?!?! 

The idea that they started an illness in their own country, shutdown their own economy, and then waited for it to go out west so that they could shutdown their economies and in response stop buying from places like China, therefore getting economically slammed, not once, but twice, is so mindboggling shortsighted, it is almost incomprehensible for it to even be considered.

China is overpopulated and their government doesn’t really give a crap about people or human rights in general.  One-child policy?  Most executions among any countries in the world?  Muslim concentration camps?  Human rights activists simply disappearing?

Yes, totally absurd and almost incomprehensible...

I’m not saying this was intentional but some people have far too much faith in reason when it comes to a twisted and corrupt Communist country.  It’s no surprise China and Russia get along just swell.

Edited March 31, 2020 by Moan4Yoan

[southsider2k5]

20 minutes ago, Moan4Yoan said:

China is overpopulated and their government doesn’t really give a crap about people or human rights in general.  One-child policy?  Most executions among any countries in the world?  Muslim concentration camps?  Human rights activists simply disappearing?

Yes, totally absurd and almost incomprehensible...

I’m not saying this was intentional but some people have far too much faith in reason when it comes to a twisted and corrupt Communist country.  It’s no surprise China and Russia get along just swell.

By your logic, this is just as likely to have been planted by America in China, because this country never interfered in other countries affairs and definitely never used biowarefare or genocide against people before. 

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

By your logic, this is just as likely to have been planted by America in China, because this country never interfered in other countries affairs and definitely never used biowarefare or genocide against people before. 

Some would argue that without the one child policy, the population of China would be 2-2.4 billion, on the conservative side.

Which means higher scarcity of resources, more pollution, more world starvation, etc.

The reality is that having six boys for every five girls creates an entirely new set of problems.  Even lifting the restrictions a few years ago, the birth rate is barely moving up due to the skyrocketing costs of raising a child, health care, education, etc.

25-30 years from now, China will look exactly like Japan demographically...heck, the economic peaks of late 80’s/early 90’s (Japan) compared to 2006-2014 might look quite similar years from now. 
 

Japan, South Korea and now China are all looking at birth rates of 0.8-1.2 per family, where the population is dying off faster than children are born to replace them.  Not to mention all three countries tend to be insular and not immigration-friendly, with an influx of talent from other regions of the world the only obvious solution to inexorable shifts in demographic trendlines.

[ron883]

10 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

By your logic, this is just as likely to have been planted by America in China, because this country never interfered in other countries affairs and definitely never used biowarefare or genocide against people before. 

This is absolutely silly. I don't think China purposefully released this virus as an act of biological warfare. Regardless, comparing the US to China is an absolute joke. They literally have Uighur concentration camps where they harvest the organs of the prisoners. 

I get it, "America bad" is the cool mindset to have, but what a reach by you. Comparing China to the US from a humanitarian standpoint is laughable. 

[mqr]

1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said:

Yeah, if that's true, that it took them 13 years in the best conditions to get a safe vaccine for SARS, then well....This might be the new normal for the next decade plus. 

There was no demand for a vaccine after it burnt itself out in a few months. 

[southsider2k5]

9 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

This is absolutely silly. I don't think China purposefully released this virus as an act of biological warfare. Regardless, comparing the US to China is an absolute joke. They literally have Uighur concentration camps where they harvest the organs of the prisoners. 

I get it, "America bad" is the cool mindset to have, but what a reach by you. Comparing China to the US from a humanitarian standpoint is laughable. 

Its cute that you think these things only work one way.  Especially when you watch our response to this when we had advance notice was quite literally to try to protect the economy instead of people.

[caulfield12]

9 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

This is absolutely silly. I don't think China purposefully released this virus as an act of biological warfare. Regardless, comparing the US to China is an absolute joke. They literally have Uighur concentration camps where they harvest the organs of the prisoners. 

I get it, "America bad" is the cool mindset to have, but what a reach by you. Comparing China to the US from a humanitarian standpoint is laughable. 

Relitigating Wounded Knee or Japanese displacement camps or drone strikes and endless wars across the Middle East doesn’t solve the problem TODAY.

Nor does worrying about or blaming China, at the moment.

Plenty of time for the entire world to assess this a year from now.

Argue about it in September or October, before the election.   Right now, saving the most lives, red and blue and purple...are all that matters.

 

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Its cute that you think these things only work one way.  Especially when you watch our response to this when we had advance notice was quite literally to try to protect the economy instead of people.

Such as not wanting to take any responsibility for cruise ships...as, well, “bad numbers.”

If we are the greatest country in the world, we should have additional capacity to deal with this, compared to developing countries all around the world.

[Flash]

Huff Post today..."Having sold himself as a great business and military leader despite bankrupt casinos and bone spurs, President Donald Trump faces his greatest challenge yet: making Americans forget the two months he dismissed concerns about a deadly pandemic as a “hoax.”
 

[bmags]

China does a lot of bad things.

Thise things align with power consolidation and authoritarianism.

They act in self interest of the party and building their wealth when it builds power consolidation.

Killing many if their own and shutting down their economy does none of that.

Just because China does bad things doesn’t mean all bad things are feasible.

[caulfield12]

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/insane-many-scientists-lament-trump-s-embrace-risky-malaria-drugs-coronavirus
 

And many are critical of the small French clinical study of just 42 patients that seems to have touched off most of the excitement.

.....

Others are less diplomatic. Darren Dahly, a co-author of one of several critiques of the initial study and a principal statistician at the University College Cork School of Public Health, said it would be “egregious” to recommend treatments for millions of people based on such a small trial, regardless of its quality. “This is insane!” tweeted Gaetan Burgio, an Australian National University expert on drug resistance, noting what he sees as lapses in the 6-day trial, including inconsistent testing of virus levels in the patients.

.....

In that trial, the Mediterranean Infection University Hospital Institute (IHU) treated 26 COVID-19 patients with hydroxychloroquine alone, or combined with the antibiotic azithromycin. The authors reported “clearance”—no virus present in samples taken by nasopharyngeal swabs—in most of them, but continued infection in most of a 16-person control group of COVID-19 patients.

...

“Efforts to widely distribute unproven treatments are misguided at best and dangerous at worst.”

 

https://www.drugs.com/availability/generic-plaquenil.html

Would love to see if any members of Congress or the administration purchased stock in any of these companies before the public hyping announcements started.... 

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by caulfield12

[pcq]

Courts are staying closed until May 18. They don't mess around. Thought we had this sucker licked back on Ground Hog Day. 

Edited April 1, 2020 by pcq

[southsider2k5]

23 minutes ago, bmags said:

China does a lot of bad things.

Thise things align with power consolidation and authoritarianism.

They act in self interest of the party and building their wealth when it builds power consolidation.

Killing many if their own and shutting down their economy does none of that.

Just because China does bad things doesn’t mean all bad things are feasible.

This sound vaguely familiar.  Like a leader who would refuse to take the calls from governors who don't grovel enough...

[ron883]

Looks like Trump was right about chloroquine. Might have to start calling him Dr. Trump.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/an-fda-breakthrough-on-treatment-11585609832

Edited April 1, 2020 by Yearnin' for Yermin

[Soxbadger]

24 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

Looks like Trump was right about chloroquine. Might have to start calling him Dr. Trump.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/an-fda-breakthrough-on-treatment-11585609832

I see you proscribe to the throw so much shit against the wall maybe one piece will stick doctorate program.

Im pretty sure you dont pass the boards if you miss every question and guess one right.

Had he taken it serious right away, not been golfing, not holding pep rallies, maybe our world is different. But well never know because he cares more about his golf score than any of us.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Soxbadger

[Quin]

59 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said:

Looks like Trump was right about chloroquine. Might have to start calling him Dr. Trump.

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/an-fda-breakthrough-on-treatment-11585609832

You do realize they were exploring it, he heard about it, and shouted it from the rooftops, right?

Now, more research has been done and the FDA is going to allow emergency use. But it's still not overwhelming and not surefire guarantee, and an editorial board post courtesy of Murdoch doesn't change Trump's reckless behavior.

[Reddy]

8 hours ago, Heads22 said:

Can we not with the politics

In what world can you thread a needle so perfectly as to avoid talking politics while talking about the epidemic? Lord.

[The Beast]

9 hours ago, Heads22 said:

Can we not with the politics

Questions needed to be answered though!

[caulfield12]

4 hours ago, Reddy said:

In what world can you thread a needle so perfectly as to avoid talking politics while talking about the epidemic? Lord.

Well, I’m making a conscious effort to discuss it more ‘tactics-wise’ as opposed to entrenched policy standpoints or positions that are highly unlikely to change, but even C-Span gets bombarded with calls saying one side or the other is receiving more time or not getting cut off by moderators, etc.   I guess if everyone accuses you of unfairness...you must be doing something right.

But it is surreal when Cuomo is at 87% approval, that’s GW Bush after 9/11 numbers...or his father after the first Gulf War.

 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

This is the fastest way to track by countries...we’ve passed China and France for third, but running a much lower mortality rate (so far, knock on wood) compared to Italy and Spain who are off the charts or simply overwhelmed/under-testing at this point. 

 

https://kvia.com/health/2020/03/31/umc-reinstates-doctor-who-had-job-threatened-for-wearing-mask-in-hospital-hallways/

I can pretty much guarantee most of the rest of the world is not FIRING doctors and nurses for wearing masks WALKING down the HALLWAYS of a HOSPITAL in order to protect themselves/patients/family at home.

Edited April 1, 2020 by caulfield12