southsider2k5 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 47 minutes ago, Jerksticks said: But Madrigal IS a high ceiling guy. He’s not a floor guy. his floor is a guy with no power who can’t find holes and is completely useless. His ceiling is a guy who can control the strike zone and barrel historically better than almost anybody ever. It’s weird. His defense alone puts him on a major league roster for the next decade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: It's funny because I was actually thinking the same earlier and so I looked. Polanco had many years with an OPS over .750. He won a few GG's too. This is a good comparison and we should all be thrilled if Madrigal ends up with PP's career. Thirded. When I think of Madrigal, Polanco is the first guy that comes to mind......as his ceiling. https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/polanpl01.shtml Edited August 3, 2020 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: His defense alone puts him on a major league roster for the next decade. Jayson Nix comes to mind, one of the better infielders I'd ever seen at the time but mediocre hitter, but he managed to squeak out a career of about 8 years (though I think Madrigal projects a lot higher than Nix as a hitter) Edited August 3, 2020 by lostfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 Just now, lostfan said: Jayson Nix comes to mind, one of the better infielders I'd ever seen at the time but mediocre hitter, but he managed to squeak out a career of about 8 years Even the bust Gordon Beckham is still around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 Madrigal is more valuable to a team that doesn't need power from its second basemen. That's the Sox right now. We are loaded with power up and down the line-up. Mazara is another guy that is going to hit 20+ bombs every year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 (edited) 27 minutes ago, tray said: Madrigal is more valuable to a team that doesn't need power from its second basemen. That's the Sox right now. We are loaded with power up and down the line-up. Mazara is another guy that is going to hit 20+ bombs every year. Robert, Moncada, and Jimenez could conceivably hit 100-120 (in a full season) just between the three of them before you even get to guys like Abreu, Grandal, Anderson, Encarnacion, etc. Edited August 3, 2020 by lostfan I can't count to 4 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 On 8/2/2020 at 2:55 AM, soxfan49 said: Delete your account So basically he's going to be worse than Carlos Sanchez and Avisail Garcia. Amazing prediction based on the first two games of his big league career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, lostfan said: Robert, Moncada, and Jimenez could conceivably hit 100-120 (in a full season) just between the three of them before you even get to guys like Abreu, Grandal, Anderson, Encarnacion, etc. The last time the Sox had this kind of power top to bottom in a line-up was the 2000 team, but 2000, 2002-2005 and 2006. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: The last time the Sox had this kind of power top to bottom in a line-up was the 2000 team, but 2000, 2002-2005 and 2006. 2006 was the year I was thinking of, with Konerko-Thome-Dye-Crede but dare I say Robert-Moncada-Abreu-Jimenez will be better 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUSTgottaBELIEVE Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 5 minutes ago, lostfan said: 2006 was the year I was thinking of, with Konerko-Thome-Dye-Crede but dare I say Robert-Moncada-Abreu-Jimenez will be better This lineup is more balanced top to bottom than the 2006 team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostfan Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 1 minute ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said: This lineup is more balanced top to bottom than the 2006 team. Absolutely, got a legitimate leadoff hitter and 8-9 aren't gaping holes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUSTgottaBELIEVE Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, lostfan said: Absolutely, got a legitimate leadoff hitter and 8-9 aren't gaping holes And the 2006 lineup was excellent. It just didn’t have the same depth. SSS but the Sox currently lead the AL in runs scored, batting average and OPS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chi Town Sox Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 I think people should just be happy that our top pick from 2 years ago is already up contributing to a win with 4 f’n hits. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: His defense alone puts him on a major league roster for the next decade. Tell that to Yolmer, the guy who just won a gold glove. Edited August 3, 2020 by Yearnin' for Yermin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 2 hours ago, Jack Parkman said: Thirded. When I think of Madrigal, Polanco is the first guy that comes to mind......as his ceiling. https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/polanpl01.shtml Polanco has 40 WAR for his career (37 on fangraphs), getting that out of your 4th pick would be a spectacular success. Obviously he is not guaranteed to be that good but 37 career war would make madrigal the second best 4th overall pick of the last 20 years (just behind ryan Zimmerman and way ahead of the next guy). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeaseAndExist Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 23 minutes ago, Yearnin' for Yermin said: Tell that to Yolmer, the guy who just won a gold glove. Madrigal has a lot more offensive potential than Yolmer. He's never going to hit 30 HR but Yolmer is a pretty low bar at the plate. Madrigal's baserunning and SB potential are something Yolmer never had. If Madrigal plays GG defense, gets you 25-30 SB, and puts up .750 OPS, that's a good outcome, especially in the context of our team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeaseAndExist Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 18 minutes ago, Dominikk85 said: Polanco has 40 WAR for his career (37 on fangraphs), getting that out of your 4th pick would be a spectacular success. Obviously he is not guaranteed to be that good but 37 career war would make madrigal the second best 4th overall pick of the last 20 years (just behind ryan Zimmerman and way ahead of the next guy). Seriously, 40 WAR is a spectacular outcome for a #4 overall pick 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 We used to be able to skip the Home half inning to catch a bite or do something when the middle and bottom of our Order was due up. Now, you don't want to miss anything because there is a good a chance to see hits, home runs and scoring in every inning. That must be absolutely dreadful for opposing pitchers. The other thing is that our hitters are being patient at the plate. They aren't just hitting home runs but are covering the plate when there is two strikes on them and getting clutch hits. It's really been a pleasure to watch so far. Not much to not like about our 2020 White Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox1917 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 Glad to see him succeed today. But i will say that he needs to get better pitch recognition. He swings at far too many pitchers’ pitches early in counts. His bat to ball skills are elite, but weak contact on tough pitches early in the count is not going to work in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 The Twins and White Sox line-ups aren't that far apart anymore. If you can run out a Max Kepler or Nomar Mazara at #8, or Madrigal at #9, that's a STOUT line-up. Donaldson <<< Moncada Polanco === Anderson (both need to have repeats to prove success wasn't fluky) Arraez >>> Madrigal (at least for now) Sano === Abreu Garver <<< Grandal/McCann (don't believe he can repeat his monster 2019) Rosario === Jimenez Buxton <<< Robert Kepler >>> whoever we have in RF N. Cruz >>> EE Of course, then you have to factor in Vaughn/Kopech. Eventually, Minnesota will have Lewis, Kiriloff and Fathom's favorite Trevor Larnach. Buxton and Berrios will be gone after 2022 season...then the division shifts completely towards CHW, DET, KCR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tray Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 Very good comparison Cauli. I would just add a few more arrows >>>> for Nelson Cruz over EE, and that has been one of the few disappointments thus far., Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 6 minutes ago, tray said: Very good comparison Cauli. I would just add a few more arrows >>>> for Nelson Cruz over EE, and that has been one of the few disappointments thus far., White Sox fans will definitely argue Jimenez over Rosario, but it's not even close on fWAR. Rosario's a better all-around player, for sure, but Jimenez is going to end up the much more impactful hitter. Donaldson's a HoF 3B, in all probability, and 90% of Twins' fans would pick him over Moncada, but arguably only for 2020 (at most) and not beyond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrathofhahn Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 5 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: Schwarber at #4 was considered an overdraft at the time. He was considered to be a teens level pick. I don't even get the issue if Schwarber was playing in the AL he'd be just fine the issue he has and for the cubs is they can't hide him defensively and 1B is already taken but he'll get paid a decent figure for his bat if/when he hits FA. How is he some sort of cautionary tale? Hell we are paying a 37 year old Edwin 12M and Abreu 50m/3. So if you look at it from the perspective had we drafted someone like Schwarber instead then that would have freed 12m=17 to buy some pitching or spend on a 2B and Schwarber is a massive upgrade over Edwin and Abreu as well at this point in their careers. But enough about getting sidetracked on Schwarber 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 11 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said: I don't even get the issue if Schwarber was playing in the AL he'd be just fine the issue he has and for the cubs is they can't hide him defensively and 1B is already taken but he'll get paid a decent figure for his bat if/when he hits FA. How is he some sort of cautionary tale? Hell we are paying a 37 year old Edwin 12M and Abreu 50m/3. So if you look at it from the perspective had we drafted someone like Schwarber instead then that would have freed 12m=17 to buy some pitching or spend on a 2B and Schwarber is a massive upgrade over Edwin and Abreu as well at this point in their careers. But enough about getting sidetracked on Schwarber He’s just using the example of Schwarber to demonstrate that it’s actually pretty rare to draft contributing talent even in the first round as a sure thing... pointing out that he was ranked to go much later, in the late teens. Past some 1-1 and 1-2 guys in a lot of years... and even including them in others, the MLB draft is an educated crap shoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted August 3, 2020 Share Posted August 3, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, hi8is said: He’s just using the example of Schwarber to demonstrate that it’s actually pretty rare to draft contributing talent even in the first round as a sure thing... pointing out that he was ranked to go much later, in the late teens. Past some 1-1 and 1-2 guys in a lot of years... and even including them in others, the MLB draft is an educated crap shoot. See Brady Aiken, Tyler Kolek and Carlos Rodon...or Gordon Beckham's draft class. Edited August 3, 2020 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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