What should the Sox do with James McCann?

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

55 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

The other part of this is if we bring back McCann for years down the road, we also block Vaughn for a longer period of time, by pushing a lot of McCann ABs into the DH slot.  You still have Jose Abreu on this team for another couple of years, and he will need somewhere to play.  Even if you think Vaughn should play 1B, he isn't going to come in and shove Abreu out if he has no where to play.  Abreu might end up going to DH, but they aren't going to bench Abreu for McCann or Vaughn, which means Vaughn won't have an open slot.

McCann is gone after this season. There’s no sense in even discussing anything different. Regarding this season, they absolutely should hold on to him and not trade him next week. Thankfully, if they had any thoughts of trading him earlier this year, I’m certain those thoughts are now long gone.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

11 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

No offense but this is a small sample size season. If u stick with a cold player too long it might cost you games. Mazara sample size is small and everyone hates him. You accuse JGB of confirmation bias but someone could say the same about you and Marzara. Only difference is you got the whole board on your side with Mazara while JGB has a minority opinion .

Yep. It’s convenient to talk SSS when it doesn’t support one’s position but then ignore it on the flip side. For this season, people need to stop getting hung up on SSS. This is a 60 game sprint. If McCann continues to outplay Grandal over the next 4-5 weeks, you have to start him at catcher in the playoffs. Maybe Grandal can DH if EE is still struggling.

And I should add that there’s not much the Sox can do about the Mazara situation outside of a trade next week. They don’t have an obvious replacement like they do at catcher (Engel is a nice 4th OF and all but he’s not an everyday RF).

Edited August 21, 2020 by JUSTgottaBELIEVE

[southsider2k5]

21 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Trade him for a player who will make the team better and perhaps for longer.

And punt on this season?  Seems like an awful idea when we are in position to make the playoffs for the first time in how many years?

[southsider2k5]

15 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

McCann is gone after this season. There’s no sense in even discussing anything different. Regarding this season, they absolutely should hold on to him and not trade him next week. Thankfully, if they had any thoughts of trading him earlier this year, I’m certain those thoughts are now long gone.

I agree fully, and I don't think there are really questions about it.

McCann will finish this season as a White Sox

McCann will begin next season with a lot of money to be a starting catcher for a team other than the White Sox

[Bob Sacamano]

Unless you get overwhelmed with an offer (don't see it happening), you hold onto him.

[GreenSox]

26 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

And punt on this season?  Seems like an awful idea when we are in position to make the playoffs for the first time in how many years?

Who says it has to punt the season?  What if they got a young starter him? 

[SonofaRoache]

1 minute ago, GreenSox said:

Who says it has to punt the season?  What if they got a young starter him? 

You're not getting anything of note for a 2 month rental catcher that is a backup at the time of trade. 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

5 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Who says it has to punt the season?  What if they got a young starter him? 

So you’re willing to trade McCann and open up the very real possibility of starting Collins at catcher in the playoffs if Grandal’s back issue lingers into next month?

[gusguyman]

1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

No offense but this is a small sample size season. If u stick with a cold player too long it might cost you games. Mazara sample size is small and everyone hates him. You accuse JGB of confirmation bias but someone could say the same about you and Marzara. Only difference is you got the whole board on your side with Mazara while JGB has a minority opinion .

Well, that and the fact that Grandal has a years long track record of excellence to offset his SSS performance while Mazara has a years long track record of being a slightly above average hitter against RHP while being a black hole against LHP and a major defensive liability to complement his SSS. 

[southsider2k5]

44 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Who says it has to punt the season?  What if they got a young starter him? 

5 weeks of James McCann isn't going to get you a "young starter" unless you mean a very low level minor league starter that isn't very highly ranked.

[southsider2k5]

42 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

You're not getting anything of note for a 2 month rental catcher that is a backup at the time of trade. 

Not even 2 months.  We are talking 4-6 weeks depending on when a deal happens.  We are already at 34 games left in this season for the Sox.

[Jack Parkman]

2 hours ago, SonofaRoache said:

Yeah Grandal is considered a top 3 catcher in baseball and we act like he is trash. 

Going  into this season Grandal and Realmuto were in their own tier as catchers. Who, may I ask, is this third catcher that belongs in the same tier?

That being said this is sports and past performance is not an indicator of future performance, unlike other aspects of life. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

25 minutes ago, gusguyman said:

Well, that and the fact that Grandal has a years long track record of excellence to offset his SSS performance while Mazara has a years long track record of being a slightly above average hitter against RHP while being a black hole against LHP and a major defensive liability to complement his SSS. 

And that is a fair stance to take. But it's also fair that you cant keep going with cold hitters when every win this season is important.

I dont agree with JGB that we didnt need Grandal and I supported McCann more than many here did. Grandal just brought way too much to the table to question his acquisition in a season that before we knew about Covid we were looking to greatly improve and beyond this season too.

Keep both this season and see how it plays out.

I don't think Mazara is a lost cause but he needs to be at least as good as he has been in the past against RH to make a solid contribution. How such a young, talented player could show such consistency offensively and completely crater now is beyond me

If you had polled the board on what they would have expected this season from Mazara and McCann I think more people would have thought Mazara would be what he has always been than would thinking McCann would continue to keep hitting well.

[tray]

1 hour ago, SonofaRoache said:

You're not getting anything of note for a 2 month rental catcher that is a backup at the time of trade. 

Agreed, and that is a  reason to consider trading  Collins , perhaps in a package with another prospect , for something of value, and re-sign McCann.

You can't just give McCann away. That sounds like a foolish idea that will make our catching tandem worse instead of better.

Collins will probably NEVER be as good as McCann or have an All Star season, or handle pitchers and call a game like he does.

Collins is not a good catcher and he hasn't proven he can hit for average n the majors after 102 ABs.  Maybe he can but I'd rather have McCann.

[southsider2k5]

Actually on this topic, I do have to say, that the Sox took a guy who had been pretty awful in his career.  He had been a pretty medicore to bad player for his Tigers career.  He came to the Sox and got turned into an all-star, and seems to be repeating those successes this year.  This is a pretty nice success for Sox in terms of major league scouting and player development.

[joejoesox]

3 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

The other part of this is if we bring back McCann for years down the road, we also block Vaughn for a longer period of time, by pushing a lot of McCann ABs into the DH slot.  You still have Jose Abreu on this team for another couple of years, and he will need somewhere to play.  Even if you think Vaughn should play 1B, he isn't going to come in and shove Abreu out if he has no where to play.  Abreu might end up going to DH, but they aren't going to bench Abreu for McCann or Vaughn, which means Vaughn won't have an open slot.

That's why you extend James to a multi year deal which allows you to trade him for something of value.  Letting him walk would be such a Sox/Rick Hahn brainless move.

[gusguyman]

46 minutes ago, tray said:

Agreed, and that is a  reason to consider trading  Collins , perhaps in a package with another prospect , for something of value, and re-sign McCann.

You can't just give McCann away. That sounds like a foolish idea that will make our catching tandem worse instead of better.

Collins will probably NEVER be as good as McCann or have an All Star season, or handle pitchers and call a game like he does.

Collins is not a good catcher and he hasn't proven he can hit for average n the majors after 102 ABs.  Maybe he can but I'd rather have McCann.

 

1 minute ago, joesaiditstrue said:

That's why you extend James to a multi year deal which allows you to trade him for something of value.  Letting him walk would be such a Sox/Rick Hahn brainless move.

Its not like the team has a unilateral decision here. James (from what we've seen) wants to be the starter on a team. If that is the case, there is really nothing the White Sox can do, even if they wanted to bring him back, except make him a competitive offer and hope he changes his mind. 

[Balta1701]

3 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

To be fair, it’s only a handful of posters that clearly don’t understand SSS or pay attention to much around the game that doesn’t involve the white Sox. 

Just curious...now that we have a catcher who has rated extremely highly on framing in previous years, has anyone noticed any results from this?

[Balta1701]

6 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

That's why you extend James to a multi year deal which allows you to trade him for something of value.  Letting him walk would be such a Sox/Rick Hahn brainless move.

If a guy is signed to a fair value contract, he doesn't hold much surplus value, and trading him doesn't bring much back. 

[supernuke]

4 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

That's why you extend James to a multi year deal which allows you to trade him for something of value.  Letting him walk would be such a Sox/Rick Hahn brainless move.

Why in the world would James McCann sign a deal to be the White Sox back up when he will be very likely to get a job as the starter somewhere else? Losing him for nothing was assured when he wasn't traded shortly after the Grandal signing.

[southsider2k5]

12 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

That's why you extend James to a multi year deal which allows you to trade him for something of value.  Letting him walk would be such a Sox/Rick Hahn brainless move.

I still don't see why the Sox would offer him top dollar to be a part time player when they have other holes to fill and no starting position to use McCann at, especially when they could well be looking at filling RF and SP at a minimum this off season.

Also why would McCann sign a deal here, when he could pick his own team in the off season?

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

2 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Your opinion. Doesn’t make it a fact

Well everything he said was a fact except being the best free agent. Now if he meant best free agent position player that the Sox got he is right because he's the only one they got this off season. But even among all free agent position players the Sox could ve signed ,Grandal was pretty high up there .

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

9 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Just curious...now that we have a catcher who has rated extremely highly on framing in previous years, has anyone noticed any results from this?

Ive been wondering the same thing. Not for one moment this season have I felt like damn Grandal is stealing strikes for these pitchers and helping them out a ton in comparison to McCann. 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

1 minute ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Well everything he said was a fact except being the best free agent. Now if he meant best free agent position player that the Sox got he is right because he's the only one they got this off season. But even among all free agent position players the Sox could ve signed ,Grandal was pretty high up there .

The part I disagreed with was the first sentence of his post. That was his opinion.

[ChiSox59]

5 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

The part I disagreed with was the first sentence of his post. That was his opinion.

Who was the better fit? We needed OBP. We needed power. We needed a left handed batter. Who was the better fit? Grandal is and was literally a perfect piece for this roster. Again, a punchless 15 game stint in which he is still bordering on elite at getting on base doesn’t change that, no matter how much you try to speak it into existence. 
McCann mostly regressed back to the guy he had always been after the ASB last year. I like James. Dude is a great ball player. But he’s no where close to as good or valuable a player as Grandal. 

Edited August 21, 2020 by ChiSox59