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18 minutes ago, bmags said:

All this "mortgaging our future" talk...has there been a single piece mentioned that doesn't have at least another year of control?

One year is a pretty narrow future if their giving up 6 years of control for multiple players such as Kopech, Dunning or Stiever. In essence if they trade 2 of them they are giving 12 years of combined control for 1 1/2 years if they have only 1 more year. 

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1 minute ago, ptatc said:

One year is a pretty narrow future if their giving up 6 years of control for multiple players such as Kopech, Dunning or Stiever. In essence if they trade 2 of them they are giving 12 years of combined control for 1 1/2 years if they have only 1 more year. 

It wouldn't be 6 years of Kopech.

And god, the "12 years combined" stuff. is maybe the worst new measure sox fans have. Again, what if Kopech is still working on command next year and stiever is a dud? Does the 6 years mean anything at that point? I swear the new banner for this board should just be sox fans fondling a 2024 calendar.

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5 minutes ago, bmags said:

It wouldn't be 6 years of Kopech.

And god, the "12 years combined" stuff. is maybe the worst new measure sox fans have. Again, what if Kopech is still working on command next year and stiever is a dud? Does the 6 years mean anything at that point? I swear the new banner for this board should just be sox fans fondling a 2024 calendar.

Everyone knows how the sox got into the rebuild in the first place and there is rightfully fear about chasing ghosts again.  Prospects are valuable in aggregate and not to be just given away to immediately improve the MLB roster.

Regardless of where the club is at in their contention window.

Edited by chitownsportsfan
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I expect a trade to happen today, and I think the Sox will land a starting pitcher.  There seems to be some noise around more than one player being acquired, and I would't mind seeing an outfielder or bullpen piece joining the team.  Purely my speculation, but Morrow might be the most likely and Clevinger the least likely.  However, I won't be shocked if it's a pitcher we haven't really discussed.

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Just now, chitownsportsfan said:

Everyone knows how the sox got into the rebuild in the first place and there is rightfully fear about chasing ghosts again.  Prospects are valuable in aggregate and not to be just given away to always immediately improve the MLB roster.

Regardless of where the club is at in their contention window.

However, we can't just throw out every prospect as if they are equal value, and poo poo away 3 years of control for some of these players and cry that it's not 5 years. The difference between Kopech and Dunning and Stiever varies. And for the next 3 years we need a lot more guaranteed production. 

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I think we end up with someone like Cobb. A SP that will make us better without giving up much. 

I dont think Cleve would trade us Clev and I dont want him for what he would cost. I think Lynn, while great, will get too much. I would be fine with Kopech to be traded only if itis for Woodruff.

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1 minute ago, bmags said:

However, we can't just throw out every prospect as if they are equal value, and poo poo away 3 years of control for some of these players and cry that it's not 5 years. The difference between Kopech and Dunning and Stiever varies. And for the next 3 years we need a lot more guaranteed production. 

I agree, but why not just acquire a rental like Gausman and address longer term adds in the offseason?

He should not be costly via trade

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Just now, steveno89 said:

I agree, but why not just acquire a rental like Gausman and address longer term adds in the offseason?

He should not be costly via trade

sometimes the value to acquire isn't a sliding scale. Giants are "competing" for a playoff spot and have a lot of resources as an org that may not care for a mid-level guy instead of just making a run of it.

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10 minutes ago, bmags said:

It wouldn't be 6 years of Kopech.

And god, the "12 years combined" stuff. is maybe the worst new measure sox fans have. Again, what if Kopech is still working on command next year and stiever is a dud? Does the 6 years mean anything at that point? I swear the new banner for this board should just be sox fans fondling a 2024 calendar.

I think the nightmare scenario is we try to hard to push the front end of the run up a year or two, and we end up giving away the wave that would have put us over the top.  I mean it isn't hard to blink and see us giving up a big package for someone like Lynn, for example.  Then if we don't do it in 20 or 21, because are still a bit overmatched and under-experienced, we get to 22 and Lynn is gone, as are all of the assets we gave up to get him.  It isn't hard to squint and see Kopech as an all-star starting pitcher during that time frame, and maybe even better than Lynn or whoever we give him up for.    So then we get to the point where we have neither player, but are still trying to win something.

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39 minutes ago, bmags said:

I think the rangers were probably hurt a bit by the clevinger stuff. Dynamic changes when you are now holding the second best piece.

It's a really scary time to be a seller right now.   Teams have no idea what they're getting back.  These prospects aren't playing games and scouts aren't allowed to watch their workouts at alternative sites.  They could being trading for a guy who is not the same player he was 9 months ago.  Hard to pull the trigger on a big move when you're not 100% in on what you're getting in return.

 

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Just now, Harold's Leg Lift said:

It's a really scary time to be a seller right now.   Teams have no idea what they're getting back.  These prospects aren't playing games and scouts aren't allowed to watch their workouts at alternative sites.  They could being trading for a guy who is not the same player he was 9 months ago.  Hard to pull the trigger on a big move when you're not 100% in on what you're getting in return.

 

that makes sense.

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8 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

If the Sox have a deal, I would think MIL makes the most sense. IDK if I believe the Woodruff rumors, but I bet it’s one of their starters and a pen arm.

Agreed, and I'm thinking it's Corbin Burnes. Engel as a throw-in piece makes sense with them trotting out to CF everyday.

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3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I think the nightmare scenario is we try to hard to push the front end of the run up a year or two, and we end up giving away the wave that would have put us over the top.  I mean it isn't hard to blink and see us giving up a big package for someone like Lynn, for example.  Then if we don't do it in 20 or 21, because are still a bit overmatched and under-experienced, we get to 22 and Lynn is gone, as are all of the assets we gave up to get him.  It isn't hard to squint and see Kopech as an all-star starting pitcher during that time frame, and maybe even better than Lynn or whoever we give him up for.    So then we get to the point where we have neither player, but are still trying to win something.

I agree, just a few days ago I was talking about now overvaluing control over talent. But of the rumored names, there isn't anyone that concerns me on that side. These are high level talents. 

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Looks like a sellers market.  If I am Hahn and know Bummer and Rodon progressing and would be available playoff time, I think I stand pat.  Afraid the prices don't match the return.  It is okay for others to disagree, just my opinion.  

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10 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

It's a really scary time to be a seller right now.   Teams have no idea what they're getting back.  These prospects aren't playing games and scouts aren't allowed to watch their workouts at alternative sites.  They could being trading for a guy who is not the same player he was 9 months ago.  Hard to pull the trigger on a big move when you're not 100% in on what you're getting in return.

 

Well, you can also argue that you have to strike early on the front end of this window knowing you have some guys that are only under team control for the next 3-4 years like Abreu, Giollito, and Anderson.  It's never too early to start contending for a championship.  

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