2021 Offseason Prediction: Who We Lose and What Will Be Our Needs?

[he gone.]

On 9/1/2020 at 12:29 PM, SouthSideGeorgia said:

Was looking for a post that summarizes who the Sox lose after this 2020 season and showcases what our needs will be in free agency and/or trades. There’s obviously some obstacles and unknowns, like Rule 5 draft, the 40-man roster and offseason decisions. But I figured I’d try to compile that and ask for feedback, corrections and opinion here. So after 2020, here’s who the Sox lose:

End of Contracts:

C James McCann

BP Alex Colome

BP Ross Detweiler

OF Jarrod Dyson

 

Club Option for 2021:

BP Steve Cishek ($6.75 million - not likely picked up)

DH Edwin Encarnacion ($12 million - not likely picked up)

SP Gio Gonzalez ($7 million - not likely picked up)

FLEX Leury Garcia ($3.5 million - guessing not likely)

Late Arbitration Year:

RF Nomar Mazara (last arbitration yr, not likely)

INF Yolmer Sanchez (last arbitration yr, not likely)

SP Carlos Rodon (last arbitration yr, not sure here)

So what we return for sure in 2021, and what are our needs are the following:

Catcher: Yasmani Grandal backed by Zack Collins. Maybe Yermin Mercedes as a third C/DH. Discussion from some Sox fans Are considering to resign McCann, but I find that unlikely. Sexy Zavala is fourth depth catcher in organization. Pending Actions: decide on backup catchers for 2021 and beyond.

First Base: Jose Abreu returns as starter. Probably much fewer opportunities for Grandal, since he will be more everyday catcher compared to 2020. Feeling like Andrew Vaughn will be the backup first basemen and alternate at DH also with Abreu. I’m thinking Edwin prohibits them development of Vaughn and only gets one year with Sox. Minor league is Gavin Sheets, who would be a likely trade commodity due to Abreu and Vaughn.

Designated Hitter: Sox may take the option on Edwin for another $12 million, but probably not after 2020. DH could be a rotated position between Vaughn, Abreu, Collins, and maybe Eloy (if Sox land a flexible starting RF that can play LF too). Yermin Mercedes is also third catcher and spots well to the DH position. 

Second base: Cheap position for the Sox and good talent there. No reason to change a thing from Madrigal and Mendick. Seems like Leury Garcia and Yolmer Sanchez may be too expensive an option since there may be cheaper options in the minors (although Yolmer may have a better chance due to 3b). 
 

Shortstop: Tim Anderson and a backup, possibly Mendick and maybe a Yolmer, but they may cut Sanchez for a cheaper option there. Anderson and Mendick may be enough. 
 

Third Base: Yoan Moncada and a backup, Mendick, and maybe another option like Sanchez, or another farm piece. 
 

Outfield: Eloy Jimenez, Luis Robert and To Be Determined RF. Mazara has One more arbitration year, but it seems unlikely at this stage that they pursue that with his production. Will need a starting RF in offseason, preferably left handed bat, and at least average to plus defender and athleticism. Sox lose Dyson, but may keep Engle on for another backup season due to arbitration. Leury Garcia is an option, but Sox should pursue a starter here in the offseason, in my opinion. Micker Adolfo, Blake Rutherford,  and Luis Gonzalez are the farm OF to consider as depth. 
 

Starting Pitchers: Giolito, Keuchel, Cease and Dunning are for sure starters in 2021. Assuming we don’t take the option on a Gio Gonzalez. Rodon is in his last arbitration and he will cost over $5 million per year with no signs of staying healthy. It’s a toss up if the Sox keep him around (I’m thinking they release him). He could be considered for long relief bullpen, but there are probably cheaper, more dependable options there. Reynaldo Lopez is in arbitration 1, and will be on roster. He could compete for that #5 starter next year, but he’s at the end of his leash. Especially, with Kopech possibly getting the promotion to starter sometime next season. Depth at starter in the minors will be Jonathan Stiever, Bernardo Flores Jr. , and Jimmy Lambert with deeper starters in Garrett Crochet and Jared Kelley. 
 

Bullpen Pitchers: Losing Colome will be biggest question mark next season on who fills out the closer role. A healthy Aaron Bummer is the likely choice there. Obviously, that leaves a spot open in the set-up role. Returning High performer bullpen pitchers In addition to Bummer will be Matt Foster, Cody Heuer, and Evan Marshall. Sox lose Detweiler and probably Cishek. Bullpen arms that need further work and probably return are Jimmy Cordero, Jace Fry and Zack Burdi. Farm arms with MLB experience that will be considered are Ian Hamilton and Jose Ruiz. Sox farm hands that time may come are Tyler Johnson, or one of the young starters may get a bullpen shot first. Sox definitely have some work in the offseason free agency bolstering their bullpen, especially for a lefty option (right now only Bummer and Fry for 2021). 
 

In summary: Key free agency and/or trades for 2021 for starting Right Fielder, bullpen arms, another starting pitcher if the Sox don’t resign Gonzalez or Rodon, and Lopez goes to the bullpen. Movement within the organization should provide depth at all the positions not mentioned. 
 

Looking for feedback, Corrections, opinions on anything post-2020 season. Thanks....

Was slow on reading this thread. Great synopsis. Agree with everything you laid out. 

My thoughts to add to it:

UTIL IF - Mendick fills that role pretty good, don't see the need to go out and get anybody, but maybe you go and get a veteran guy as well there. 

SP - I think its feasible that those guys listed can get the job done and you have talented arms in waiting, just think if we truly are going to contend you add another arm. My own plan would be to start Keuchel, Giolito, Dunning and then have Cease/Rodon/Lopez/Kopech/Crotchet, etc. all just piggy back. Keep their inning limits down through a long season, but also drive competition. If someone breaks through, give them more innings. Bauer is clearly the other move and the only name I think is worth the $$. Don't go wasting money on a Robbie Ray (were linked to him in trade rumors, would be a disaster). I'd consider Alex Wood too, just to fill 70IP, maybe he's healthy at the right times and you get a nice playoff arm. Maybe roll the dice on a Kluber. But again, don't think any of it is necessary. if you're spending money go get the guy who can put you over the top. 

RF - Only real options are Starling Marte (not sure if that club option moves to the Marlins at 12.5mm or not) Springer, and Castellanos which who knows if he ops out of 3/48mm. I guess you can throw in Brantley too, but that's a sloppy RF. M. Ozuna is an option too - but again, throwing him in RF isn't ideal. I'd take any of the first 3 options. 

Other than that I think the reality is you have to go out and make a trade for a RF via prospects. Guys I'd consider:

David Dahl/Garrett Hampson/Sam Hilliard - buy low candidates. Probably doesn't cost much, however it feels a little Mazara to expect them to breakout. That being said the Rox suck at developing their young guys. They never let any of them get consistent at bats. Also doesn't help that none of them have really made a case for consistent AB's. Hampson intrigues me as a guy who can cover CF, RF, 2B, etc. nice utility guy. 

Avi Garcia - He'd literally be free, just have to pay his $10mm salary on 1 year basis. Could be worse fixes. 

Mitch Haniger - who knows what you get off of injury, but probably buying low. MIght be worth it. 

 

 

[iWiN4PreP]

14 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

David Dahl/Garrett Hampson/Sam Hilliard - buy low candidates. Probably doesn't cost much, however it feels a little Mazara to expect them to breakout. That being said the Rox suck at developing their young guys. They never let any of them get consistent at bats. Also doesn't help that none of them have really made a case for consistent AB's. Hampson intrigues me as a guy who can cover CF, RF, 2B, etc. nice utility guy. 

Rockies really need to learn to trade. They've had a log jam of players for what feels like years now.

They are also rumored to be trading Nolan Arenando this year. Or at least, open to it.

I'd love to get Dahl or Hampson. 

 

[he gone.]

16 hours ago, iWiN4PreP said:

Rockies really need to learn to trade. They've had a log jam of players for what feels like years now.

They are also rumored to be trading Nolan Arenando this year. Or at least, open to it.

I'd love to get Dahl or Hampson. 

 

Truth. When the Sox were terrible I adopted many teams to kind of watch on a semi-regular basis just to mix it up. Rockies were one of them ... just terrible management there. They never commit to anybody. Arenado should've been traded 2-3 years ago at peak value. Amazingly they wasted another year this year ... Matt Kemp, Kevin Pillar, Ian Desmond, etc. They continue to bring in these old vets that should only be complementary pieces, not taking roles from Hampson, Rodgers, McMahon, Hilliard, Tapia, Dahl, etc. etc. etc. They would benefit from a Rays like evaluator. They should've been trading their bats (arenado/blackmon,etc) for sinker baller guys like Dakota Hudson and anybody who keeps the ball on the ground. The team really is just so poorly ran. 

Hell, the Sox could probably add Arenado to their roster for free and move Moncada to RF if they wanted to explore that option. (he has that opt-out which also isn't ideal) Not saying that's the right call, just saying RF isn't really prime for picking this offseason with perfect fits ... Springer to me is the only fit that makes absolute sense. Outside that, Marte? Then its really just finding one year solutions again. The next year would be Conforto ... but not much else. So really, we need to figure out RF via trade, or hope that Adolfo or Rutherford somehow find it (maybe on micker, but doubtful that we have more than an engel in rutherford).

 

Order of preference would be Springer, Trade, wait and see approach. 

[GreenSox]

They need 2 hitters, one of whom needs to play RF.  That's obvious.
I'd bring back Colome  - he's just a really good closer.   You don't need your best reliever as closer, and he isn't the Sox best reliever.  He handles the 1 clean inning very well.  If they don't re-sign him, they are going to have to find a closer somewhere (and at the risk of the daggers, putting Crochet there is a waste).
They have a lot of young ML ready pitching.  If they are going to use some in trade, and I would hope they don't, it's got to be for a young hitter...not a veteran.

 

[he gone.]

12 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

They need 2 hitters, one of whom needs to play RF.  That's obvious.
I'd bring back Colome  - he's just a really good closer.   You don't need your best reliever as closer, and he isn't the Sox best reliever.  He handles the 1 clean inning very well.  If they don't re-sign him, they are going to have to find a closer somewhere (and at the risk of the daggers, putting Crochet there is a waste).
They have a lot of young ML ready pitching.  If they are going to use some in trade, and I would hope they don't, it's got to be for a young hitter...not a veteran.

 

The consensus is RF is the big hole (too bad we didn't sign Bryce Harper, man that would have solved literally everything for a decade). Looking around the depth charts though I just don't know who would be available + at what price. 

 

https://www.rotoworld.com/baseball/mlb/depth-charts

 

I went through this and when you start eliminating teams that won't trade with us (division) + teams who are in the hunt and unlikely to trade a nice piece in RF + guys who are even worth trading for? The list is quite small. On the surface you'd think a lot of teams have good RF, but really, it's not that easy. 

Conforto and Polanco stick out as targets. But with new Mets management, not sure they're looking to trade him in his final year. Polanco to me isn't a solution, so not worth it.  Dahl, Avi, Hilliard, etc. as i mentioned earlier... nothing that exciting out there that truly makes us a better team. 

[GreenSox]

9 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said:

The consensus is RF is the big hole (too bad we didn't sign Bryce Harper, man that would have solved literally everything for a decade). Looking around the depth charts though I just don't know who would be available + at what price. 

 

https://www.rotoworld.com/baseball/mlb/depth-charts

 

I went through this and when you start eliminating teams that won't trade with us (division) + teams who are in the hunt and unlikely to trade a nice piece in RF + guys who are even worth trading for? The list is quite small. On the surface you'd think a lot of teams have good RF, but really, it's not that easy. 

Conforto and Polanco stick out as targets. But with new Mets management, not sure they're looking to trade him in his final year. Polanco to me isn't a solution, so not worth it.  Dahl, Avi, Hilliard, etc. as i mentioned earlier... nothing that exciting out there that truly makes us a better team. 

Springer is the FA prize. 
Then I look at Dunning, Cease, and Lopez...perhaps trade 1 for a similarly situated young OF.  I'd be leery of trading pitching, but maybe?

[Chicago White Sox]

1 hour ago, GreenSox said:

They need 2 hitters, one of whom needs to play RF.  That's obvious.
I'd bring back Colome  - he's just a really good closer.   You don't need your best reliever as closer, and he isn't the Sox best reliever.  He handles the 1 clean inning very well.  If they don't re-sign him, they are going to have to find a closer somewhere (and at the risk of the daggers, putting Crochet there is a waste).
They have a lot of young ML ready pitching.  If they are going to use some in trade, and I would hope they don't, it's got to be for a young hitter...not a veteran.

 

Two hitters?  Where is the other hitter playing other than RF?

[Chicago White Sox]

24 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Springer is the FA prize. 
Then I look at Dunning, Cease, and Lopez...perhaps trade 1 for a similarly situated young OF.  I'd be leery of trading pitching, but maybe?

There’s a very good chance we’re signing Cespedes or Colas as part of the upcoming signing class.  We really just need a stopgap option.  My money is on Joc being that guy whether or not some people hate that idea.

[SoxBlanco]

7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Two hitters?  Where is the other hitter playing other than RF?

DH.  I would try to get that really good hitter...what's his name again?  Andrew something?

[GreenSox]

28 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

There’s a very good chance we’re signing Cespedes or Colas as part of the upcoming signing class.  We really just need a stopgap option.  My money is on Joc being that guy whether or not some people hate that idea.

Who is the RF post stopgap?

And the 2nd hitter is DH.   But even with 2, really no bench-bat.

[bmags]

2 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Who is the RF post stopgap?

And the 2nd hitter is DH.   But even with 2, really no bench-bat.

Probably difficult to follow CWS post if you don't follow baseball, but he mentioned the sox signing Cespedes or Colas...so his post answered your question pretty well. WAs the entire point of saying stop gap.

[Chicago White Sox]

37 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

Who is the RF post stopgap?

And the 2nd hitter is DH.   But even with 2, really no bench-bat.

Cespedes or Colas would be the long-term RF.

And Andrew Vaughn is going to be our DH (or 1B) next year so that position is more than covered.

What is it you mean by a bench bat?  What role is said playing?

[Chicago White Sox]

35 minutes ago, bmags said:

Probably difficult to follow CWS post if you don't follow baseball, but he mentioned the sox signing Cespedes or Colas...so his post answered your question pretty well. WAs the entire point of saying stop gap.

Thank you!

[GreenSox]

1 hour ago, bmags said:

Probably difficult to follow CWS post if you don't follow baseball, but he mentioned the sox signing Cespedes or Colas...so his post answered your question pretty well. WAs the entire point of saying stop gap.

He was clear on a stopgap, and I asked him for his ideas, POST stopgap. 

Yes, it was obviously an offensive question and, yes if someone doesn't adopt the CW and groupthink, they don't follow baseball.  So cute; so clever.

Edited September 25, 2020 by GreenSox

[bmags]

38 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

He was clear on a stopgap, and I asked him for his ideas, POST stopgap. 

Yes, it was obviously an offensive question and, yes if someone doesn't adopt the CW and groupthink, they don't follow baseball.  So cute; so clever.

Again, it wasn’t a puzzle. Cespedes and Colas were the very first players mentioned. 

[Boopa1219]

Will be more detailed later but the Sox need to add more OBP guys to the roster. Moncada and Grandal are not enough.

I hope they spin the wheels on Pederson for RF and Brad Miller as a bench piece this offseason. 

[Chicago White Sox]

13 minutes ago, Joshua Strong said:

Will be more detailed later but the Sox need to add more OBP guys to the roster. Moncada and Grandal are not enough.

I hope they spin the wheels on Pederson for RF and Brad Miller as a bench piece this offseason. 

Vaughn will be a high OBP guy and so will Madrigal given his high average.

[joejoesox]

isnt Cruz a FA? Pay the man and give EE his walking papers

[Chicago White Sox]

4 minutes ago, joesaiditstrue said:

isnt Cruz a FA? Pay the man and give EE his walking papers

We’re not blocking Vaughn for another year and should be using our resources for RF & pitching upgrades

[Boopa1219]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Vaughn will be a high OBP guy and so will Madrigal given his high average.

I’m talking about guys with high walk rates, walk rates that are close to 10%. I don’t see Madrigal ever having a walk rate in that area. The Sox need to take more walks. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 9/25/2020 at 8:28 AM, Chicago White Sox said:

There’s a very good chance we’re signing Cespedes or Colas as part of the upcoming signing class.  We really just need a stopgap option.  My money is on Joc being that guy whether or not some people hate that idea.

Not sure a stopgap is ideal if your counting on complete unknowns to be the solution . Here's my 2 best trade candidates.

 Anthony Santander (25) of the Orioles and Mike Yastrezmski (30) of the Giants.

Santander is a switch hitter who is bad against LH but kills RH making him ideal to be the strong side platoon with Engel.  His fWAR is .8 wRC+ 131and 11HR in 37 games this year.His K% is only 15.2 .He may be on the verge of becoming an elite power hitter. His DRS is 8 this year so that's pretty good and UZR 1.1.  Why his fWAR seems low considering his good offensive and defensive year I have no idea.

Yastrezmski  will be 31 next August 23rd bats LH. He appears to hit both RH's and LH pitchers well. He has a 2.5 fWAR. He's an OBP machine with his BB% at12.9 but his K% is pretty high a t24.9 but that might be why he became a good hitter. He used to choke up on 2 strikes but now because of the Giants hitting coaches the main thing he's doing now is trying to take his best swings regardless of the count.His wRC+ 155. He's a good 2 strike hitter. He might be the most unheralded star because he did nothing of note while in the minors and only got a chance at the age of 29. He's also a good fielder. His DRs is 1 but his UZR is 1.7. This would be like Rutherford or Luis Gonzalez all of a sudden becoming a star at an advanced age when the Sox give up on them. Of course you'd be buying high on him but the Giants might be wise to trade him while they can get the most for him.

 

Edited September 27, 2020 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[caulfield12]

2 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Not sure a stopgap is ideal if your counting on complete unknowns to be the solution . Here's my 2 best trade candidates.

 Anthony Santander (25) of the Orioles and Mike Yastrezmski (30) of the Giants.

Santander is a switch hitter who is bad against LH but kills RH making him ideal to be the strong side platoon with Engel.  His fWAR is .8 wRC+ 131and 11HR in 37 games this year.His K% is only 15.2 .He may be on the verge of becoming an elite power hitter. His DRS is 8 this year so that's pretty good and UZR 1.1.  Why his fWAR seems low considering his good offensive and defensive year I have no idea.

Yastrezmski  will be 31 next August 23rd bats LH. He appears to hit both RH's and LH pitchers well. He has a 2.5 fWAR. He's an OBP machine with his BB% at12.9 but his K% is pretty high a t24.9 but that might be why he became a good hitter. He used to choke up on 2 strikes but now because of the Giants hitting coaches the main thing he's doing now is trying to take his best swings regardless of the count.His wRC+ 155. He's a good 2 strike hitter. He might be the most unheralded star because he did nothing of note while in the minors and only got a chance at the age of 29. He's also a good fielder. His DRs is 1 but his UZR is 1.7. This would be like Rutherford or Luis Gonzalez all of a sudden becoming a star at an advanced age when the Sox give up on them. Of course you'd be buying high on him but the Giants might be wise to trade him while they can get the most for him.

 

Pederson for one year, assuming Colas or Cespedes long term.

Leery of buying high on NL player peaking at that age.   But who knows?   All depends on the ask and how highly SF values him.  If thry make the postseason and he stars, his value is even higher, but he has started to return to earth already.

We can look all point to Cruz, but JD Martinez and EE are both looking dead in the water, at some point soon, he’s going to crash hard.  Vaughn gets that shot, regardless.
 

Still no idea what they’re thinking with Leury Garcia.  He seemed an automatic resign until the injury, bot not so sure anymore with Mendick and Engel, even Yolmer, potentially back in the oicture.

[GreatScott82]

I think it’s safe to say EE’s option will he declined. That’s an easy fix- Vaughn and Abreu will fill the DH/1B role in 2021. 
 

i personally think the starting pitching addition is an easy fix too. Sign Trevor Bauer. 
 

However, this right field dilemma is really standing out for most of us. I think it’s safe to say we are tired of platoons and stop gaps etc... Many of us were hoping Mookie hit free agency with the Sox having a seat at the table. And last year we were hoping for a Bryce Harper signing. But this off-season will be unique as it appears as if RF is the final position player puzzle piece. I don’t want Springer... he was heavily involved in the cheating scandal. And I really want Bauer and we know how he feels about the Astros. lol. Ozuna’s defense scares me, but that dude can still mash. But do they want more one sided players?  is there a team on the midst of a rebuild that has a complete CF/RF that may be available via trade? I’m still at a loss here. 
I do think the Sox will end up re-signing McCann. He holds tremendous value for this lineup and hopefully he is open to take less playing time to stay here.
 

This will be a very important and interesting offseason for Hahn and his staff. He has a lot of trade pieces and not too many holes to fill. A position I haven’t seen this organization be in since the early 2000’s.

[YourWhatHurts]

First priority is a Giolito extension. 

I want McCann re-signed but I think the org will pass.  I also want Ricky replaced but again I think the org will pass.  

I'm interested in what a Madrigal extension costs, a Heuer extension costs, and a Crochet extension costs.  This offseason may be too early for any of that.

Paying Vaughn before calling him up is a move I am in favor of, given his talent.  Maybe he's cheaper than Eloy because the hype hasn't been as high, even though he's likely to be a better player given he's a 1B.

I'm not on board with trading for any of the Mets OFers.  I think we need to be patient.  A Joc/Engel platoon is just fine, and people complaining are overthinking it entirely.  Don't piss away all of your payroll room and prospect capital at once.  It's actually nice to have a spot you can upgrade when the time is right.  Let's wait to see what teams do what.  Even if there is some problem with a platoon in RF, we should be able to trade a very small piece around the deadline to make an upgrade.  That's a pretty easy position to upgrade cheaply at the trade deadline.

I also want to let Dunning grow up a bit in the majors.  Hopefully Lopez can build enough value to be traded.  I'm not high on him but Frank Thomas is, so I can accept some faith in him.  Stiever I really believe in and do not want to trade.  Look at the Indians, and how much it can benefit to just be patient with some guys.  Let Stiever start in AAA and develop.  I really like the idea of trading a young MLB for several pieces instead of selling before the development finishes and trading a guy like Dunning or Stiever like he's just a part or scrap.

Bauer on a 1 year deal is a nice thought but it blocks someone also, and to me, he's not an ace.  He's just another #2/#3 type that can pitch like one in a given year.  But it's not a given that he won't blow up in the playoffs when we need him.  I don't think it's a necessary move.

I would definitely tender Rodon a contract and try him as a closer.  He showed 96-98 out of the pen.  That might be a good move for his career and it could make this bullpen even nastier.  I like using Heuer, Bummer, and perhaps also Crochet any time in the game, and maybe Rodon could replace Colome as the guy in the 9th.

[Chicago White Sox]

Without question the #1 move we should make this offseason is signing Bauer.  Obviously there are a lot of obstacles there, but if these past few weeks have shown us anything it’s our young pitching still needs a lot more time.  We can’t go into 2021 with a 3-4-5 of Cease-Dunning-Kopech and have legit championship expectations.  We should also expect some regression from Dallas next year and slot him in the #3 spot if at all possible.  Short of a trade, Bauer is the only free agent who can push everyone down a spot.  If he’s willing to take a short term deal, he simply makes too much sense to pass up on.