AJ'S Cousin Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 Starter or reliever?? Great start but 3 innings in college and 1 inning in majors does not make a career. 101 fastball? Great!! But very little movement. Good hitters can catchup to 101. Pluses we have is is a GREAT PITCHING COACH. very good catchers that can call a great game and pitch framing He can be a great one but let’s not rush him. We brought Giolito along properly, Bummer etc is he a starter or reliever. That needs to be determined Bummers return in his old form is key to getting to the WS. Huer looks great!! Foster looks like a stud. Jace is coming along. We have the potential to have a really great shut down bullpen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 9 minutes ago, AJ'S Cousin said: Starter or reliever?? Great start but 3 innings in college and 1 inning in majors does not make a career. 101 fastball? Great!! But very little movement. Good hitters can catchup to 101. Pluses we have is is a GREAT PITCHING COACH. very good catchers that can call a great game and pitch framing He can be a great one but let’s not rush him. We brought Giolito along properly, Bummer etc is he a starter or reliever. That needs to be determined Bummers return in his old form is key to getting to the WS. Huer looks great!! Foster looks like a stud. Jace is coming along. We have the potential to have a really great shut down bullpen. Great pitching coach? What have you been watching the past decade.. Welcome to the board though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capital G Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 No one knows yet. He has looked good. Next year he hopefully won't have room. Put him in the BP or stretch him. We need to use him this year as a BP piece. Next year we need to see if he can be a starter. Bummer I'm pretty sure has found his spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 The kid was making his major league debut after pitching a total of 3.1 IP in a game in the last year and a half. it is WAY too early to pronounce him as anything. BUT one thing you can do is look at the raw stuff and see that it is in the top 1% of baseball. Even if a bit comes off of velocity as a starter, you can see through a guy like Chris Sale that you can work in the mid 90's with good off speed stuff and a deceptive motion and release. Just for the little bit that he pitched the other day, you can see how his stuff could play in the starting rotation, it is a matter of how healthy they can keep him and if he can build up to 110 pitches every 5 days for a whole season. If anyone can get him there, we saw the Sox do it midstream with both Sale and Quintana. Another thing worth noting is that the Sox are notorious for simplifying a pitchers offerings during their early appearances with the team, and then letting them add back to them as they get comfortable with the initial offerings. With a guy like Crochet, even if they make him a basic fastball/slider pitcher out of the pen to start with this year, and even into when he is a starter again next year, they will eventually add something like change up or a slower fastball with more movement (4 seam/cutter, etc) Even a guy like Cease isn't a finished product at this point. He has no fastball control, so they aren't going to let him expand his offerings until he has his basics down. This is how the Sox operate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 He's a starter. Full stop. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 35 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: Great pitching coach? What have you been watching the past decade.. Welcome to the board though I still think he is a good coach. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: The kid was making his major league debut after pitching a total of 3.1 IP in a game in the last year and a half. it is WAY too early to pronounce him as anything. BUT one thing you can do is look at the raw stuff and see that it is in the top 1% of baseball. Even if a bit comes off of velocity as a starter, you can see through a guy like Chris Sale that you can work in the mid 90's with good off speed stuff and a deceptive motion and release. Just for the little bit that he pitched the other day, you can see how his stuff could play in the starting rotation, it is a matter of how healthy they can keep him and if he can build up to 110 pitches every 5 days for a whole season. If anyone can get him there, we saw the Sox do it midstream with both Sale and Quintana. Another thing worth noting is that the Sox are notorious for simplifying a pitchers offerings during their early appearances with the team, and then letting them add back to them as they get comfortable with the initial offerings. With a guy like Crochet, even if they make him a basic fastball/slider pitcher out of the pen to start with this year, and even into when he is a starter again next year, they will eventually add something like change up or a slower fastball with more movement (4 seam/cutter, etc) Even a guy like Cease isn't a finished product at this point. He has no fastball control, so they aren't going to let him expand his offerings until he has his basics down. This is how the Sox operate. Agree with everything but especially the bold. He wasn't a starter in college. Sale was. This will all be an immense learning curve for him. How to get ready, how to preserve his arm how to dial it back to get to 100 pitches. Not that he can't do it, just that I think he will have inconsistencies as he learns this. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 1 minute ago, ptatc said: Agree with everything but especially the bold. He wasn't a starter in college. Sale was. This will all be an immense learning curve for him. How to get ready, how to preserve his arm how to dial it back to get to 100 pitches. Not that he can't do it, just that I think he will have inconsistencies as he learns this. At the end of the day if there were NO questions about Crochet, he would have been the #1 pick. He has that kind of stuff. I honestly believe if we had played a full college season that the Sox wouldn't have drafted him with the 11th pick. If he had showed what the Sox think he can be, he would have been a top 3 pick in all likelihood. If he had regressed towards what he had looked like before his previous season, he wouldn't have been on a radar until the later rounds as a lottery ticket. He also did some starting, but definitely wasn't a full time starter in college. He will need to really work to get himself into shape for the marathon that is starting, but the team wouldn't have drafted him if they didn't think he could do it, as well as believing in their developmental staff here. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 Crazy how I still read this similar to the Christmas Carol character cratchett instead of crow-shay. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 You dont need much movement on 101 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 Wouldn't he ended up still being a great pick if the comps to Andrew Miller are accurate? Of course, that is only if he becomes "Andrew Miller" while in a Sox uniform and not elsewhere, like Andrew did later in his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkness99 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 looks like a reliever to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 3 minutes ago, bmags said: Crazy how I still read this similar to the Christmas Carol character cratchett instead of crow-shay. imho, Bob Crachit would have been a Madrigal type player if he would not have gone on to be a clerk, and if baseball had been invented yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 Both of his pitches have a really good spin rate (2500 each) which is a good thing. Don't know the spin effiency/axis but they spin should help his pitches. He eventually will need his change up but for 2-3 innings 2 pitches are fine. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 32 minutes ago, wegner said: Wouldn't he ended up still being a great pick if the comps to Andrew Miller are accurate? Of course, that is only if he becomes "Andrew Miller" while in a Sox uniform and not elsewhere, like Andrew did later in his career. Andrew Miller is currently in his mid 30s making over $11 million a year because of his history as one of the best non-closer firefighters in recent baseball history. If a guy like Crochet can take up that role, that saves your bullpen a ton of stress. No it isn't what you want when you draft a pitcher at #11, but when you look at how rare an Andrew Miller is, and what he has done for baseball teams when healthy, it would be hard to argue that wasn't a win of a pick. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 29 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: At the end of the day if there were NO questions about Crochet, he would have been the #1 pick. He has that kind of stuff. I honestly believe if we had played a full college season that the Sox wouldn't have drafted him with the 11th pick. If he had showed what the Sox think he can be, he would have been a top 3 pick in all likelihood. If he had regressed towards what he had looked like before his previous season, he wouldn't have been on a radar until the later rounds as a lottery ticket. He also did some starting, but definitely wasn't a full time starter in college. He will need to really work to get himself into shape for the marathon that is starting, but the team wouldn't have drafted him if they didn't think he could do it, as well as believing in their developmental staff here. No doubt. It's just that there is a routine to starting that pitchers learn in college. This is something he never learned. That's why I said that he will be inconsistent until he learns these things. Not that he can't it will just take him longer than others as he doesn't have that experience. Your right about the past season. He not only would have been drafted much higher, but he also would have had the experience and made his transition a little easier. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 51 minutes ago, bmags said: Crazy how I still read this similar to the Christmas Carol character cratchett instead of crow-shay. God bless us, every-one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BamaDoc Posted September 21, 2020 Share Posted September 21, 2020 I think the Sox want him as a starter long term. However, because of how little he has pitched this year (3.1 college innings), I don't think you would pitch him much beyond 100 or so inning next year. That means about three or so innings per start if 30 starts. Because of the inning limits, I could see him being used in the majors as a reliever next year as innings are built. I doubt I would pitch him back to back days but 50-60 games at 1-2 innings would get you there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 11 hours ago, harkness99 said: looks like a reliever to me. You might want to look again. Here are some things to look for: 1. Does he have the frame/athleticism to handle a starters work load? Check 2. Does he have an easy repeatable delivery? Check 3. Does he have a chance for three avg/above avg pitches? Check 4. Does he have a chance for at least avg command of those three pitches? Check This guys a starter all day long. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaws7575 Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 At this moment in time he is a relief pitcher if he is on the team during the play offs. There is no way I could say he does not have enough movement on phis pitches after one inning to be a future starter. At a quick glance I think he could be a very good starter-but time will tell on that. i f they use him it would be like Jenks from 2005 all over again in a way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 49 minutes ago, jaws7575 said: At this moment in time he is a relief pitcher if he is on the team during the play offs. There is no way I could say he does not have enough movement on phis pitches after one inning to be a future starter. At a quick glance I think he could be a very good starter-but time will tell on that. i f they use him it would be like Jenks from 2005 all over again in a way. Welcome to Soxtalk! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox1917 Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 14 hours ago, AJ'S Cousin said: Starter or reliever?? Great start but 3 innings in college and 1 inning in majors does not make a career. 101 fastball? Great!! But very little movement. Good hitters can catchup to 101. Pluses we have is is a GREAT PITCHING COACH. very good catchers that can call a great game and pitch framing He can be a great one but let’s not rush him. We brought Giolito along properly, Bummer etc is he a starter or reliever. That needs to be determined Bummers return in his old form is key to getting to the WS. Huer looks great!! Foster looks like a stud. Jace is coming along. We have the potential to have a really great shut down bullpen. Don cooper isnt considered to be a great pitching coach by anyone not named don cooper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackowiakYakYak Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 9 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: You might want to look again. Here are some things to look for: 1. Does he have the frame/athleticism to handle a starters work load? Check 2. Does he have an easy repeatable delivery? Check 3. Does he have a chance for three avg/above avg pitches? Check 4. Does he have a chance for at least avg command of those three pitches? Check This guys a starter all day long. This. The guy looks strong enough and he makes every pitch look effortless. Fulmer was a huge question mark because he was undersized and had a high-effort delivery. Crochet looks efficient. As other’s have said, I don’t know if he’s ready to throw even 80 pitches, but I don’t doubt he could in a few years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 21 hours ago, ptatc said: I still think he is a good coach. He's objectively a good coach with a nice resume. Sox fans don't like him because he's not going to kiss their ass and he isn't afraid to tell them to shut up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 1 hour ago, TaylorStSox said: He's objectively a good coach with a nice resume. Sox fans don't like him because he's not going to kiss their ass and he isn't afraid to tell them to shut up. Who is the last young person he has helped or improved for an extended period of time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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