Offseason Targets

[bmags]

23 minutes ago, fathom said:

You also have two teams expected to be the most aggressive in terms of making changes this offseason without a GM (Mets and Cubs).  

Cubs have Hoyer.

[michelangelosmonkey]

What I don't want is to be the Cubs...one WS and a real good half decade and then standing again on the precipice .  I want this team to be a juggernaut and part of that is not trading away key positional pieces before the soufflé has risen.  The fun part of the White Sox right now is people saying "Eloy might be the best hitter on the team" and I think...well...yes but Robert might be...or Moncada or Vaughan...I mean those are four hitters that could be the greatest hitters the White Sox have had in our lifetimes (Excluding Frank Thomas who was an alien).  And that doesn't even count Tim Anderson...who in his last 172 games has hit .333 with 28 homers, 43 doubles and stole 22 bases...at SS...or the rookie 2b that hit .341, or the reigning MVP...or the second best catcher in baseball.  Plus...we have a DOZEN very exciting starting pitchers that are 26 or younger.  Stiever was our top 5 prospect...came in his first ML game and looked amazing and we were all excited...then he got shelled the next game and we never talk about him again????  I say sign Springer who will make our offense and defense elite.  Sign Quintana for cheap and then let Cease and Kopeck and Dunning and Stiever and Crochett and Lambert and Lopez and Kelly and Dahlquist and Thompson with the new hot shot pitching coach fill in four and five.  There's a very real possibility that three of those 10 will be better than Darvish or Woodruff by 2022...and we are set to be the 1970 Cincinnati Reds.          

[bear_brian]

I like the way you think!

[Balta1701]

1 hour ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

What I don't want is to be the Cubs...one WS and a real good half decade and then standing again on the precipice .  I want this team to be a juggernaut and part of that is not trading away key positional pieces before the soufflé has risen.  The fun part of the White Sox right now is people saying "Eloy might be the best hitter on the team" and I think...well...yes but Robert might be...or Moncada or Vaughan...I mean those are four hitters that could be the greatest hitters the White Sox have had in our lifetimes (Excluding Frank Thomas who was an alien).  And that doesn't even count Tim Anderson...who in his last 172 games has hit .333 with 28 homers, 43 doubles and stole 22 bases...at SS...or the rookie 2b that hit .341, or the reigning MVP...or the second best catcher in baseball.  Plus...we have a DOZEN very exciting starting pitchers that are 26 or younger.  Stiever was our top 5 prospect...came in his first ML game and looked amazing and we were all excited...then he got shelled the next game and we never talk about him again????  I say sign Springer who will make our offense and defense elite.  Sign Quintana for cheap and then let Cease and Kopeck and Dunning and Stiever and Crochett and Lambert and Lopez and Kelly and Dahlquist and Thompson with the new hot shot pitching coach fill in four and five.  There's a very real possibility that three of those 10 will be better than Darvish or Woodruff by 2022...and we are set to be the 1970 Cincinnati Reds.          

Turning it back to you, are you Ok with being the Tigers instead - good for 8-9 years, playoffs almost every year, a couple World Series appearances, and no titles?

[Chicago White Sox]

8 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Turning it back to you, are you Ok with being the Tigers instead - good for 8-9 years, playoffs almost every year, a couple World Series appearances, and no titles?

Why is this even a question?  Are you suggesting by not trading a core offensive piece for a pitcher we won’t win a World Series?

[MiddleCoastBias]

I know we go through this every year, but isn't the joke/hope that we'll make a big splash the day before Thanksgiving? I know the Thome/Rowand trade was that Wednesday and I feel like there have been a host of others (maybe Dye?)

Anyway, I say we sign Springer on Wednesday ?

Edited November 20, 2020 by MiddleCoastBias

[fathom]

1 minute ago, MiddleCoastBias said:

I know we go through this every year, but isn't the joke/hope that we'll make a big splash the day before Thanksgiving? I know the Thome/Rowand trade was that Wednesday and I feel like there have been a host of others (maybe Dye?)

Anyway, I say we sign Springer on Wednesday ?

Nah, they’re saving it for the annual SoxFest announcement!!!!

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

6 hours ago, Orlando said:

What’s everyone’s guess on first signing or trade? Who will it be and when?

2021 Taijuan Walker

[Balta1701]

48 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Why is this even a question?  Are you suggesting by not trading a core offensive piece for a pitcher we won’t win a World Series?

Not only is it entirely possible that could be exactly what happens, but you won't know that needing pitching cost you the world series at the trade deadline any year! 

I don't want guys traded away either, but eventually - you want a title, you have to beat that Dodgers superteam. 

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

5 hours ago, bmags said:

Cubs have Hoyer.

Hoyer got promoted to VP of Baseball Ops. This would leave a vacancy in their GM spot, unless they just let McLeod take it.
 

 

[Bob Sacamano]

4 minutes ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

Hoyer got promoted to VP of Baseball Ops. This would leave a vacancy in their GM spot, unless they just let McLeod take it.
 

 

I would guess he is still acting GM.

Edited November 20, 2020 by manbearpuig

[Chicago White Sox]

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Not only is it entirely possible that could be exactly what happens, but you won't know that needing pitching cost you the world series at the trade deadline any year! 

I don't want guys traded away either, but eventually - you want a title, you have to beat that Dodgers superteam. 

Sure, but it doesn’t have to be this year.  In fact, I’d argue this is the perfect year to hold onto our chips and see what you have in your young arms unless you’re certain one of them is going to flop.  Hopefully with a new pitching coach and normal season structure we get a better sense of what we have in Kopech, Cease, & Dunning.  Go add a couple arms on one year deals like Paxton and Richards and revisit the need for a high end starter at the deadline.  All that being said, I’m totally cool with trading for someone like Darvish at the right price.  But I’m not eager to blow my prospect load coming off the mess that was 2020 when most guys are probably at reduced value.

[michelangelosmonkey]

12 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

Turning it back to you, are you Ok with being the Tigers instead - good for 8-9 years, playoffs almost every year, a couple World Series appearances, and no titles?

I guess my point is that I don't want to be that "really solid team" that gets there every year but isn't really good enough to beat a super team.  I want to be that super team.  Do  you really think Darvish gives us a better chance to win WS in 2022-23-24-25 than Cease-Kopech-Crochett fulfilling their promise?  He sure gives us a better chance of winning in 2021but I don't think we are ready to beat the Dodgers in 2021.  The core of the White Sox...Madrigal, Moncada, Robert, Eloy, Vaughan, Gio, Kopech, Crochett, Cease,  Dunning, Foster, Heuer are 26 or younger...not even in their prime years yet...why are we pushing all chips in at this point?   Seems like we have a much better idea a year from now how to hit the gas...and our young assets will be better defined.   

[ChiSox59]

47 minutes ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

I guess my point is that I don't want to be that "really solid team" that gets there every year but isn't really good enough to beat a super team.  I want to be that super team.  Do  you really think Darvish gives us a better chance to win WS in 2022-23-24-25 than Cease-Kopech-Crochett fulfilling their promise?  He sure gives us a better chance of winning in 2021but I don't think we are ready to beat the Dodgers in 2021.  The core of the White Sox...Madrigal, Moncada, Robert, Eloy, Vaughan, Gio, Kopech, Crochett, Cease,  Dunning, Foster, Heuer are 26 or younger...not even in their prime years yet...why are we pushing all chips in at this point?   Seems like we have a much better idea a year from now how to hit the gas...and our young assets will be better defined.   

Agreed. Save the impact prospect/ young mlb capital. Sign FA and if you need to make a trade, use guys that don’t project to have major roles in the coming years. 

Go to battle in 21 and see what happens. Can reasses next offseason. This team is good enough to win the central with a few shrewd signings and without moving any of our major prospects. 

[Flash]

I guess I disagree on timing. I think this team is capable of competing for trophy in 21 if we sign 2 impact pitchers. I don't know who those pitchers might be but based on the current landscape, Darvish could very well be one of them and might not be overly expensive in player capital. As to other potential impact pitchers out there, you've got Bauer and a host of arms who may or may not be available in trade.

[Chicago White Sox]

10 minutes ago, Flash said:

I guess I disagree on timing. I think this team is capable of competing for trophy in 21 if we sign 2 impact pitchers. I don't know who those pitchers might be but based on the current landscape, Darvish could very well be one of them and might not be overly expensive in player capital. As to other potential impact pitchers out there, you've got Bauer and a host of arms who may or may not be available in trade.

There’s a massive difference between saying we can’t win in 2021 and saying let’s not go “all in” in the first real year of our competitive window.

[Dam8610]

9 minutes ago, Flash said:

I guess I disagree on timing. I think this team is capable of competing for trophy in 21 if we sign 2 impact pitchers. I don't know who those pitchers might be but based on the current landscape, Darvish could very well be one of them and might not be overly expensive in player capital. As to other potential impact pitchers out there, you've got Bauer and a host of arms who may or may not be available in trade.

If this team gets Bauer and a couple of the high end relief arms available in free agency (as well as something in RF, I suggest Joc Pederson), then I agree with your assessment that this team would be ready to compete for a title, especially if the White Sox get positive development from their stable of pitching prospects. But that all goes away if they trade the third best hitter (at worst) on their team for starting pitching, especially because he's displayed the potential to become an even better hitter going forward and could become the engine that drives the offense as early as 2021. You don't trade that player, especially not for a "starting pitcher" who has never pitched more than 120 innings in a season at the MLB level.

[maloney.adam]

 

[southsideirish71]

2 minutes ago, maloney.adam said:

 

Kris Bryant?

[fathom]

4 minutes ago, maloney.adam said:

 

We finally found caulfield’s twitter account 

[Rowand44]

2 hours ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

I guess my point is that I don't want to be that "really solid team" that gets there every year but isn't really good enough to beat a super team.  I want to be that super team.  Do  you really think Darvish gives us a better chance to win WS in 2022-23-24-25 than Cease-Kopech-Crochett fulfilling their promise?  He sure gives us a better chance of winning in 2021but I don't think we are ready to beat the Dodgers in 2021.  The core of the White Sox...Madrigal, Moncada, Robert, Eloy, Vaughan, Gio, Kopech, Crochett, Cease,  Dunning, Foster, Heuer are 26 or younger...not even in their prime years yet...why are we pushing all chips in at this point?   Seems like we have a much better idea a year from now how to hit the gas...and our young assets will be better defined.   

Until 3 of them get injured and 2 of them all the sudden become Kris Bryant.  We did this at the trade deadline this season and lets not do it again this offseason.  Nothing is guaranteed in baseball and this team is ready to compete for a championship in 2021, lets not keep trying to push this thing back a season.

[fathom]

8 minutes ago, Rowand44 said:

Until 3 of them get injured and 2 of them all the sudden become Kris Bryant.  We did this at the trade deadline this season and lets not do it again this offseason.  Nothing is guaranteed in baseball and this team is ready to compete for a championship in 2021, lets not keep trying to push this thing back a season.

Couldn’t agree more

[bmags]

I hope sox go after best starting pitcher they can get. In trades though, I really don't want them to value control and cost more than performance. 

All hypothetical, but if they paid the ransom for a player like Marquez, I hope it's because they think he competes for cy youngs on the southside, and not that he gives us more financial flexibility than a Darvish.

[Harold's Leg Lift]

2 hours ago, michelangelosmonkey said:

I guess my point is that I don't want to be that "really solid team" that gets there every year but isn't really good enough to beat a super team.  I want to be that super team.  Do  you really think Darvish gives us a better chance to win WS in 2022-23-24-25 than Cease-Kopech-Crochett fulfilling their promise?  He sure gives us a better chance of winning in 2021but I don't think we are ready to beat the Dodgers in 2021.  The core of the White Sox...Madrigal, Moncada, Robert, Eloy, Vaughan, Gio, Kopech, Crochett, Cease,  Dunning, Foster, Heuer are 26 or younger...not even in their prime years yet...why are we pushing all chips in at this point?   Seems like we have a much better idea a year from now how to hit the gas...and our young assets will be better defined.   

This game is not for the faint of heart.  

[poppysox]

On 11/19/2020 at 9:01 AM, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Eloy Jimenez is a safe bet to be a damn good big leaguer for a long time. As a 23 year old he had a 141 wRC+. 

Corbin Burnes has thrown 146 big league innings at 26 years old and has a 4.48 ERA and 3.85 FIP. Prior to the past 60 game season, Corbin had a negative WAR. 

He had a nice little season last year and he might be a nice arm for a few years. You don't trade a locked up 23 year old hitter who has elite offensive skills for Corbin Burnes.

Amen!